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Jimmy Cinnabon

Strongest wrestler at each weight

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**** Bench Press is a good indicator of Push power, however it favors guys with shorter arms.  It is just Physics, since the lankier guys have to push the weight farther off their chest.   Longer armed/Lankier guys usually will not be able to bench near as much as shorter/stockier guys.  Bench Press Strength as a measure of strength and Push power does not necessarily equate to strength and ability to use your strength on the mat.   Lankier guys may be just as strong or even stronger in practice.  The ability to combine their overall body strength with their range and ability to keep guys away may actually make them stronger on the mat in a more practical way of looking at it..  An Example would be a guy like Wade Schalles, (never a physical specimen), who was able to move and control much more muscular guys.  Schalles completely overpowered Lee Kemp (known for his strength and who was much more built) by keeping him away with technique and controlling the ties, and then used his overall body strength to win.

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7 minutes ago, Cary by the Lake said:

**** Bench Press is a good indicator of Push power, however it favors guys with shorter arms.  It is just Physics, since the lankier guys have to push the weight farther off their chest.   Longer armed/Lankier guys usually will not be able to bench near as much as shorter/stockier guys.  Bench Press Strength as a measure of strength and Push power does not necessarily equate to strength and ability to use your strength on the mat.   Lankier guys may be just as strong or even stronger in practice.  The ability to combine their overall body strength with their range and ability to keep guys away may actually make them stronger on the mat in a more practical way of looking at it..  An Example would be a guy like Wade Schalles, (never a physical specimen), who was able to move and control much more muscular guys.  Schalles completely overpowered Lee Kemp (known for his strength and who was much more built) by keeping him away with technique and controlling the ties, and then used his overall body strength to win.

I wasn't saying that bench press is a good indicator of overall body strength.  I just believe that it is an important exercise to perform for overall strength, joint stability, injury prevention etc.  Not a great indicator of ability on the mat, but probably an exercise that everyone should perform regardless of how long their arms are or how much they can max out at.

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1 hour ago, Cary by the Lake said:

**** Bench Press is a good indicator of Push power, however it favors guys with shorter arms.  It is just Physics, since the lankier guys have to push the weight farther off their chest.   Longer armed/Lankier guys usually will not be able to bench near as much as shorter/stockier guys.  Bench Press Strength as a measure of strength and Push power does not necessarily equate to strength and ability to use your strength on the mat.   Lankier guys may be just as strong or even stronger in practice.  The ability to combine their overall body strength with their range and ability to keep guys away may actually make them stronger on the mat in a more practical way of looking at it..  An Example would be a guy like Wade Schalles, (never a physical specimen), who was able to move and control much more muscular guys.  Schalles completely overpowered Lee Kemp (known for his strength and who was much more built) by keeping him away with technique and controlling the ties, and then used his overall body strength to win.

Case in point, Wick is able to cradle and ride The Bull.

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19 hours ago, Broomstick said:

My teammate who was 134/142 in college benched 350+.  There were plenty of guys I saw him wrestle that looked stronger than him. 

At my best, I could bench 2x my weight.  I was middle of the road or lower strength wise 

I think you underestimate the strength of college wrestlers.  The bench numbers suggested do not look too far off imo.

The WORLD record for someone weighing 130 lbs is 303 lbs (raw).  I think you may be off a bit on your teammate that far exceeded the world record.  The number 2 in the world at 145 has benched 341.  

Edited by Iscored2onu

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21 hours ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Maybe in the weight room...but if they wrestle I'm sure Gross overpowers him.

Don't get me wrong, I'm high on Gross, and while strength isn't always revealed in one's physique, that's the strongest guy at 133?

Seth Gross

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20 hours ago, Broomstick said:

My teammate who was 134/142 in college benched 350+.  There were plenty of guys I saw him wrestle that looked stronger than him. 

At my best, I could bench 2x my weight.  I was middle of the road or lower strength wise 

I think you underestimate the strength of college wrestlers.  The bench numbers suggested do not look too far off imo.

 

28 minutes ago, Iscored2onu said:

The WORLD record for someone weighing 130 lbs is 303 lbs (raw).  I think you may be off a bit on your teammate that far exceeded the world record.  The number 2 in the world at 145 has benched 341.  

ok that 134/142 guy might have weighed 150 or more when he maxed on bench. world record meaning competition bench is paused, butt flat, etc versus what might have been a touch and go slight arch from the 134/142 guy. And what world record listing are you looking at? they're are a ton of powerlifting feds out there and I  bet you can find a raw record at 132 or whatever the current weight classes may be that if significantly higher than that. 

 

Edited by KTG119

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4 minutes ago, KTG119 said:

 

ok that 134/142 guy might have weighed 150 or more when he maxed on bench. world record meaning competition bench is paused, butt flat, etc versus what might have been a touch and go slight arch from the 134/142 guy. And what world record listing are you looking at? they're are a ton of powerlifting feds out there and I  bet you can find a raw record at 132 or whatever the current weight classes may be that if significantly higher than that. 

 

Point being - I doubt homeboy was benching anything close to world record weights....  

Wrestlers (I was one too), are often strong..but aren't power lifters.  And you aren't putting up near world record class weight if you aren't lifting as a job.  Natural strength is one thing, but bench is one of those areas where you can lose a lot if not working it often.  I call bs ;)

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11 minutes ago, Iscored2onu said:

Point being - I doubt homeboy was benching anything close to world record weights....  

Wrestlers (I was one too), are often strong..but aren't power lifters.  And you aren't putting up near world record class weight if you aren't lifting as a job.  Natural strength is one thing, but bench is one of those areas where you can lose a lot if not working it often.  I call bs ;)

ask some of the older posters here what early '70s national champ at 134 Don Rohn benched.

if using 303 as the world record I can with good confidence say there's a few 133/141 guys off season who can do that touch and go. now if you look at the actual real all time record of well over 400 at 132 then nah. 

 

  

 

 

Edited by KTG119

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40 minutes ago, KTG119 said:

ask some of the older posters here what early '70s national champ at 134 Don Rohn benched.

if using 303 as the world record I can with good confidence say there's a few 133/141 guys off season who can do that touch and go. now if you look at the actual real all time record of well over 400 at 132 then nah. 

 

  

 

 

I'm not claiming that there's not someone....somewhere that can.  I'm just saying the list is not reasonable as many of the wrestlers today are not capable.  Why?  Because it's nearly impossible.  There's some real strong dudes out there..but doesn't mean they can toss bench around like it's their job.  1 off's?  Of course.  I bench a lot, but the usefulness of it has been questioned for some time, and I agree that there are far more exercises and movements that can assist a wrestler to become better.  

For the record, I coached college wrestling and saw some strong dudes come through the halls.  99% couldn't hit the numbers suggested above though.  

I'd rather see a wrestler focus on good-form deadlifts than benchpress.  

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4 hours ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Zuh?  Steveson has 30 pounds on Cassar.  Highly doubt he is weaker at 255 than Cassar at 225.

Steveson also has extra weight on him. Cassars strength/power/explosiveness was likely one reason he beat Steveson not just once, but twice. Or was Cassar just a technically better wrestler (doubtful, only because I trully think Steveson is exceptional). He needed something going for him to beat Steveson giving up that weight. It is also not uncommon for someone who was in his fifth year of college, being stronger then a true freshman. By the time Steveson is Cassars age, or even if Steveson comes out shreded this year he could catch him, but Cassar definitely looked like the stronger guy last year, and likely has his man strength sinking in.

Edited by Molsen

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4 hours ago, KTG119 said:

 

ok that 134/142 guy might have weighed 150 or more when he maxed on bench. world record meaning competition bench is paused, butt flat, etc versus what might have been a touch and go slight arch from the 134/142 guy. And what world record listing are you looking at? they're are a ton of powerlifting feds out there and I  bet you can find a raw record at 132 or whatever the current weight classes may be that if significantly higher than that. 

 

Ok, I may have exaggerated, but I don't think it was by that much.  I am talking about off-season lifting using any style you want to get it up, which is bouncing it and arching like heck.  How much more can someone lift like that than when following world record rules?  I would think 20 pounds at least.

This was all 25+ years ago, and I think wrestlers spent way too much time on benching.  The idea that it was a fairly useless glamour lift hadn't permeated down to the level we were at just yet.

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2 hours ago, Broomstick said:

Ok, I may have exaggerated, but I don't think it was by that much.  I am talking about off-season lifting using any style you want to get it up, which is bouncing it and arching like heck.  How much more can someone lift like that than when following world record rules?  I would think 20 pounds at least.

This was all 25+ years ago, and I think wrestlers spent way too much time on benching.  The idea that it was a fairly useless glamour lift hadn't permeated down to the level we were at just yet.

Bench Press is far from useless.

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When I wrestled many years ago at 138, I could dominate a wrestler who was an all state middle linebacker. I can’t remember his bench stats exactly but he was known as a heavy lifter. Benching strength doesn’t necessarily mean you are a “strong” wrestler since most wrestling moves pull into the body unlike football’s pushing/forward motion. The football coaches thought I was a beast and begged me to play. Glad I never did though. 

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15 hours ago, Molsen said:

Cassar is definitely stronger then Steveson. You either have to be trolling or are just plain naive to think otherwise. 

You all are using the term "stronger" like it is an exact quantifiable term.  Is it possible that Cassar had more upper body strength, while Steveson had stronger legs and hips.  That's the way it looked to me.  From the looks of his barrel chest and short arms, Derek White probably out benched both of them.

 

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11 minutes ago, MNRodent said:

You all are using the term "stronger" like it is an exact quantifiable term.  Is it possible that Cassar had more upper body strength, while Steveson had stronger legs and hips.  That's the way it looked to me.  From the looks of his barrel chest and short arms, Derek White probably out benched both of them.

 

Yes, that is 100% possible, and I could definitely see that being true.

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