Cox to 86kg — because he wants to block DT?

[nom 1,179]

Recent FRL - Willie was saying that there are respected voices saying Cox is going 86kg because he isn’t a fan of David Taylor.  
 

Lots of discussion that this isn’t a good reason to go 86kg.  But is this even a possible reason?  Is Cox that annoyed with DT?  Anyone have anything beyond guesses?

 

[Obelix 21]

 

I've also heard that he's not a fan of Taylor, although I can't say that I have any inside information that he's going 86kg for this reason. 

I would like him to go 86, as I would love for him and Snyder to both be on the team. 

[pamela 1,334]

I can’t imagine why J’Den isn’t a fan of DT...

https://twitter.com/magicman_psu/status/901073965673795586

 

In all seriousness though I thought they both had buried that and moved on. They’ve since been training partners at the OTC and have traveled together. Plus it’s hard to imagine Cox making such a big decision for emotional, petty reasons. That doesn’t mean Cox won’t go 86 next year; I just don’t buy that it’s his reason for doing so.

[CaliWrestler 48]

Hope he does and smokes DT, DT has revolved but I rather see what Cox does at Olympics

post surgery I have confidence DT would win the Olympics

[calot 222]

Kyle and Jden have been friends for a longtime and DT and him have had some issues.Jden is probably more motivated to train and cut to 86 to face a guy who's disrespected him in the past then he his to face his close friend

[TBar1977 4,482]

Cox is friends with Bo Nickal for certain. 

If Cox has ever said anything to indicate some personal issue with DT, I have not seen it.

[Ogalthorpe Haywood 399]

6 hours ago, pamela said:

I can’t imagine why J’Den isn’t a fan of DT...

https://twitter.com/magicman_psu/status/901073965673795586

 

In all seriousness though I thought they both had buried that and moved on. They’ve since been training partners at the OTC and have traveled together. Plus it’s hard to imagine Cox making such a big decision for emotional, petty reasons. That doesn’t mean Cox won’t go 86 next year; I just don’t buy that it’s his reason for doing so.

Taylor just said what many were thinking. People think Cox will cut and run through DT, those matches in ‘17 were pretty damn close with the old weigh in rules. Since then DT has won a world championship in a weight that Cox has failed too. I think Taylor is the favorite at 86kg.  

[Housebuye 2,419]

7 minutes ago, Ogalthorpe Haywood said:

Taylor just said what many were thinking. People think Cox will cut and run through DT, those matches in ‘17 were pretty damn close with the old weigh in rules. Since then DT has won a world championship in a weight that Cox has failed too. I think Taylor is the favorite at 86kg.  

No way Taylor is the favorite over Cox at 86kg. Cox owns the series and since then has clearly improved. DT has too. 
  
stylistically this favors Cox. Even DTs pace won’t wear Jden down completely and Hden can pick his time to counter. I think DT would be the first guy to score a takedown on Jden in awhile however. 
  
The major intangibles are actually probably what ends up being the deciding factors. 
 

1. if Jden can make 86kg with no adverse affects, he wins even against the best Taylor

  

2. Taylor has to get back to 2018 worlds level by April. That is going to be tough given the recovery time from injury. He likely won’t be on the mats rolling around until maybe 8 weeks prior to trials at best. He has to be at 2018 levels to have a chance. 
  
The good news is, whoever makes the team will be a favorite for gold

[TBar1977 4,482]

15 minutes ago, Ogalthorpe Haywood said:

Taylor just said what many were thinking. People think Cox will cut and run through DT, those matches in ‘17 were pretty damn close with the old weigh in rules. Since then DT has won a world championship in a weight that Cox has failed too. I think Taylor is the favorite at 86kg.  

If the three matches were added up I think Taylor had more TD's in total than Cox did, and this is a guy no other wrestler other than DT seems to be able to get even 1 TD. Also something to consider, DT wrestled several matches that day while Cox rested. Cox had all the advantages. Add in the new weigh in rules and both being rested and this is a toss up.

Edited October 24, 2019 by TBar1977

[steamboat_charlie v2 1,117]

48 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Cox is friends with Bo Nickal for certain. 

If Cox has ever said anything to indicate some personal issue with DT, I have not seen it.

You might want to check out his 2017 world championship post bronze interview then.  He's mentioned it a couple times since as well.  

There is bad blood there, no question.  

[TBar1977 4,482]

7 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

You might want to check out his 2017 world championship post bronze interview then.  He's mentioned it a couple times since as well.  

There is bad blood there, no question.  

2017 is quite some time ago. They both won World titles last year on the same USA Team. I think the 2017 issue is behind them. 

[steamboat_charlie v2 1,117]

1 minute ago, TBar1977 said:

2017 is quite some time ago. They both won World titles last year on the same USA Team. I think the 2017 issue is behind them. 

Quite some time ago?  You look at a calendar recently?

Of course they've put it behind them in terms of being teammates, training in the same places, etc.  But that doesn't mean it's just gone.  

And by the way I don't think it's a big motivating factor for J'den to make the cut.  I think he wants gold, and the path to gold at 97kg is 20% harder, so he'll make the cut.  The fact that him making the team would mean David doesn't?  That's just an extra feather in his cap.  

[Lurker 2,033]

He stated after worlds he was going to talk to his coaches, nutritionist, etc and come together on what would be the best move.  I highly doubt Taylor’s tweet during 17 worlds is any factor at all. He’s a pretty smart guy and doesn’t seem the type to make a decision as big as this off emotion. 

[TBar1977 4,482]

11 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

Quite some time ago?  You look at a calendar recently?

Of course they've put it behind them in terms of being teammates, training in the same places, etc.  But that doesn't mean it's just gone.  

And by the way I don't think it's a big motivating factor for J'den to make the cut.  I think he wants gold, and the path to gold at 97kg is 20% harder, so he'll make the cut.  The fact that him making the team would mean David doesn't?  That's just an extra feather in his cap.  

I doubt the personalities play any part what so ever. He will choose what ever weight he believes gives him the best chance, period. 

[Ogalthorpe Haywood 399]

55 minutes ago, Housebuye said:

No way Taylor is the favorite over Cox at 86kg. Cox owns the series and since then has clearly improved. DT has too. 
  
stylistically this favors Cox. Even DTs pace won’t wear Jden down completely and Hden can pick his time to counter. I think DT would be the first guy to score a takedown on Jden in awhile however. 
  
The major intangibles are actually probably what ends up being the deciding factors. 
 

1. if Jden can make 86kg with no adverse affects, he wins even against the best Taylor

  

2. Taylor has to get back to 2018 worlds level by April. That is going to be tough given the recovery time from injury. He likely won’t be on the mats rolling around until maybe 8 weeks prior to trials at best. He has to be at 2018 levels to have a chance. 
  
The good news is, whoever makes the team will be a favorite for gold

Sure Cox has improved, he looks great at his optimal weight. He even beat some good guys but no world beaters imo, Taylor beat a laundry list of studs in ‘18. Cox had trouble with the weight with the old rules but you think he’ll have no adverse affects with these much tougher rules? To be honest I think a very good DT wins I don’t think he necessarily needs to be the dominant guy from ‘18. I just don’t think Cox will look himself at 86. 

[ptz305 145]

Taylor is recovering from a major knee injury and will also be having his first kid. Not the best odds for him, but I believe he can make it happen. Either way, will be a war. 

[Plasmodium 2,220]

Cox doesn't look bigger than DT to me, so they will both be cutting weight.  Advantage Cox since Taylor will have more work to do. I heard PD3 is gunning for M2. 

[hammerlockthree 2,581]

4 hours ago, TBar1977 said:

2017 is quite some time ago. They both won World titles last year on the same USA Team. I think the 2017 issue is behind them. 

you are a fool

[DuckFor2 216]

the favorites will be 1) Yazdani 2) USA rep

[Housebuye 2,419]

4 hours ago, Ogalthorpe Haywood said:

Sure Cox has improved, he looks great at his optimal weight. He even beat some good guys but no world beaters imo, Taylor beat a laundry list of studs in ‘18. Cox had trouble with the weight with the old rules but you think he’ll have no adverse affects with these much tougher rules? To be honest I think a very good DT wins I don’t think he necessarily needs to be the dominant guy from ‘18. I just don’t think Cox will look himself at 86. 

Yeah I hear you. I don’t think Cox should go down. I’m assuming that if he does, he has figured out how to make the weight without any issues

[Housebuye 2,419]

1 hour ago, Plasmodium said:

Cox doesn't look bigger than DT to me, so they will both be cutting weight.  Advantage Cox since Taylor will have more work to do. I heard PD3 is gunning for M2. 

PD3 will be behind Zahid, Hall and Ringer as well. 

  
PD3 steppes up and jumped levels, but we are so deep at 86. 

[Peso 331]

22 minutes ago, DuckFor2 said:

the favorites will be 1) Yazdani 2) USA rep

Yaz has proven he can't beat DT...twice.

[Plasmodium 2,220]

22 minutes ago, DuckFor2 said:

the favorites will be 1) Yazdani 2) USA rep

How can you justify Yazdani being a favorite DT?

[MDogg 273]

With DT and Ringer also in the 86 bracket the difference between getting the 1 vs 2 seed at trials next year is going to be huge. 2 seed will have a rested Cox waiting for him in the bottom half semis. 

If/when DT and Ringer face each other head to head in early 2020 it’s gonna have huge implications for the Olympic trials. 

[SatoriTiger 2]

57 minutes ago, MDogg said:

With DT and Ringer also in the 86 bracket the difference between getting the 1 vs 2 seed at trials next year is going to be huge. 2 seed will have a rested Cox waiting for him in the bottom half semis. 

If/when DT and Ringer face each other head to head in early 2020 it’s gonna have huge implications for the Olympic trials. 

Any idea how the seeding will determined?  Why wouldn't, for example, PD3 be the 1 seed as the returning US rep?