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56 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

He's way better than Nolf and always has been.

Idk about that..nolf didn’t lose after his Rs Freshman year and only dropped 2 matches to Imar his entire career , he literally wasn’t challenged from sophomore year til his hidley semi his senior year...he also won ncaa on one leg 

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13 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Idk about that..nolf didn’t lose after his Rs Freshman year and only dropped 2 matches to Imar his entire career , he literally wasn’t challenged from sophomore year til his hidley semi his senior year...he also won ncaa on one leg 

Nolf was great, no doubt, but I guess you don't count his near loss to Panteleo?

And yeah, as you said, that Hidlay match was not too inspiring compared to Nickal.  Now in freestyle while Nickal is winning world championships, Nolf is losing to guys who lose to guys who lose to guys that can't even make it to the finals of WTT.  It's not even close.

Nolf is like the 5th or 6th best guy at his ideal weight (maybe), while Nickal is the clear number 2 guy at 3 different weights (86, 92 and 97).

Nolf also loses to guys who Nickal smashes on consistent basis. (This was years ago when they were similar weights, but supports my argument that Nickal has always been better.

 

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1 hour ago, Mokoma said:

Nolf was great, no doubt, but I guess you don't count his near loss to Panteleo?

And yeah, as you said, that Hidlay match was not too inspiring compared to Nickal.  Now in freestyle while Nickal is winning world championships, Nolf is losing to guys who lose to guys who lose to guys that can't even make it to the finals of WTT.  It's not even close.

Nolf is like the 5th or 6th best guy at his ideal weight (maybe), while Nickal is the clear number 2 guy at 3 different weights (86, 92 and 97).

Nolf also loses to guys who Nickal smashes on consistent basis. (This was years ago when they were similar weights, but supports my argument that Nickal has always been better.

 

Just because he won by a point doesn’t mean it’s a near loss, he was never really in danger of losing to pantelo and with freestyle nolf decided to go up last minute made the finals and took a match from Imar who then took a match from JB so idk where you can say Nolf is 5 th or 6th he’s literally 3 on the ladder ( until dake drops) and I would think has a great shot at catching Imar. And if the hidley match is gonna be held against nolf but Yet  nickel his last 2 seasons had 1 point matches with abounader ,nick gravina, Schultz and Ryan Preisch and a 2 point match with emery Parker. Hidley has had a better career then all of them already. I like Bo and think he’s awesome and I think your right he’s 2 or 3 on the ladder whatever weight he goes but as far as him being superior to nolf I don’t see it 

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1 hour ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Just because he won by a point doesn’t mean it’s a near loss, he was never really in danger of losing to pantelo and with freestyle nolf decided to go up last minute made the finals and took a match from Imar who then took a match from JB so idk where you can say Nolf is 5 th or 6th he’s literally 3 on the ladder ( until dake drops) and I would think has a great shot at catching Imar. And if the hidley match is gonna be held against nolf but Yet  nickel his last 2 seasons had 1 point matches with abounader ,nick gravina, Schultz and Ryan Preisch and a 2 point match with emery Parker. Hidley has had a better career then all of them already. I like Bo and think he’s awesome and I think your right he’s 2 or 3 on the ladder whatever weight he goes but as far as him being superior to nolf I don’t see it 

Green and Deakin would also be ahead of him no?  So yeah that's JB, Dake, Imar, Deakin, and Green...Nolf 6th.

 

He got smoked by Imar if you ask most people, but sure let's go with he did take a match.

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30 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Green and Deakin would also be ahead of him no?  So yeah that's JB, Dake, Imar, Deakin, and Green...Nolf 6th.

 

He got smoked by Imar if you ask most people, but sure let's go with he did take a match.

Let’s go with he took a match? He did take a match lol and why the hell would deakin be above him at 74 or really anywhere He took him down like 10 times last time they wrestled. You can argue green but green has never done anything at 74 or 65. Anytime he’s wrestled anything but 70 kg he hasn’t performed well at all. He took a match from Imar moving up last minute coming off the college season . This is the first time Nolf is training full time freestyle just like Nickel and you see how much he’s gotten better , why wouldn’t the same be for nolf ?

Edited by Antitroll2828

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1 hour ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Let’s go with he took a match? He did take a match lol and why the hell would deakin be above him at 74 or really anywhere He took him down like 10 times last time they wrestled. You can argue green but green has never done anything at 74 or 65. Anytime he’s wrestled anything but 70 kg he hasn’t performed well at all. He took a match from Imar moving up last minute coming off the college season . This is the first time Nolf is training full time freestyle just like Nickel and you see how much he’s gotten better , why wouldn’t the same be for nolf ?

To pretend he was close to beating Imar would be unfair.  Also, why wouldn't Deakin be ahead?  Nolf lost to Green and then Deakin beat Green.  Folkstyle doesn't apply here.

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54 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

To pretend he was close to beating Imar would be unfair.  Also, why wouldn't Deakin be ahead?  Nolf lost to Green and then Deakin beat Green.  Folkstyle doesn't apply here.

All I said was he won a match against Imar. Your making it out like Imar teched nolf 10-0 twice. Folkstyle doesnt need to apply here because anyone whose a wrestling fan in there right mind knows deakin and nolf are 2 different levels. Nolf took deakin down 10 times in one match it’s not like he was riding legs and turning him , he made him look like JV wrestler on his feet but because of transitive property he’s better the nolf ? or that anyone would have him higher on the ladder is laughable.

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7 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

All I said was he won a match against Imar. Your making it out like Imar teched nolf 10-0 twice. Folkstyle doesnt need to apply here because anyone whose a wrestling fan in there right mind knows deakin and nolf are 2 different levels. Nolf took deakin down 10 times in one match it’s not like he was riding legs and turning him , he made him look like JV wrestler on his feet but because of transitive property he’s better the nolf ? or that anyone would have him higher on the ladder is laughable.

Okay then, is Green ahead?  Nolf has never beaten Green at any level or style.  So at a minimum can we agree the ladder would go JB, Dake, Imar, Green then Nolf 5th?

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59 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

To pretend he was close to beating Imar would be unfair.  Also, why wouldn't Deakin be ahead?  Nolf lost to Green and then Deakin beat Green.  Folkstyle doesn't apply here.

I'm a PSU Alumnus and obvious fan of Bo and Nolf. However, your argument above is factually true but doesn't hold water in my opinion. First, Nolf was fresh off his folkstyle career. Second, he had Green dead to rights and let it get away from him. Third, Deakin's match against Green was a little flukey. IMHO Nolf handles Green and Deakin any time they meet going forward. That said, I agree with you in your opinion of Bo Nickal. He just has that special something that all the great ones have had. Even when he is down, you just expect him to figure out a way to win. If he sticks with wrestling over MMA (which I hope is the case for his own well being) he will win multiple gold medals, and likely a 2024 Olympic gold.

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2 minutes ago, 82bordeaux said:

I'm a PSU Alumnus and obvious fan of Bo and Nolf. However, your argument above is factually true but doesn't hold water in my opinion. First, Nolf was fresh off his folkstyle career. Second, he had Green dead to rights and let it get away from him. Third, Deakin's match against Green was a little flukey. IMHO Nolf handles Green and Deakin any time they meet going forward. That said, I agree with you in your opinion of Bo Nickal. He just has that special something that all the great ones have had. Even when he is down, you just expect him to figure out a way to win. If he sticks with wrestling over MMA (which I hope is the case for his own well being) he will win multiple gold medals, and likely a 2024 Olympic gold.

So apparently Nickal is not fresh off his folkstyle career.  Good to know.  Nolf has never beaten Green, so that argument is just silly.  I could see Nolf getting the better of Deakin though, since he has destroyed him in folkstyle.

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74kg is going to be absolutely stacked with Burroughs and Dake at the helm.   Then there's Imar, and possibly teammate Hall.  Nolf is in the conversation, but if it's 74kg, I just don't see him being the victor given this field.

70kg seems to be a good fit for Nolf, given his performance(s) against Green.  Would love to see him challenge for the 70kg spot the next few years.  But... is he now too big?  

Bo should absolutely go 86kg and be DT's backup.  :-) If DT is hurt, there's Bo, and there's barely any drop off.  86kg seems to be prime real estate for Bo, and then after the OLY Year, head back to 92kg and continue his decimation of the field, pushing Cox harder and harder. 

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6 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

74kg is going to be absolutely stacked with Burroughs and Dake at the helm.   Then there's Imar, and possibly teammate Hall.  Nolf is in the conversation, but if it's 74kg, I just don't see him being the victor given this field.

70kg seems to be a good fit for Nolf, given his performance(s) against Green.  Would love to see him challenge for the 70kg spot the next few years.  But... is he now too big?  

Bo should absolutely go 86kg and be DT's backup.  :-) If DT is hurt, there's Bo, and there's barely any drop off.  86kg seems to be prime real estate for Bo, and then after the OLY Year, head back to 92kg and continue his decimation of the field, pushing Cox harder and harder. 

Good point about Hall.  If he would drop, that would drop Nolf another spot on the ladder.

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6 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

So apparently Nickal is not fresh off his folkstyle career.  Good to know.  Nolf has never beaten Green, so that argument is just silly.  I could see Nolf getting the better of Deakin though, since he has destroyed him in folkstyle.

I didn't bring Bo up because I was agreeing with you in that I think he has that "it" factor over Nolf. Although Bo put up a respectable effort against Cox, he was never that close to challenging him at Final X. But by April, who knows? And my opinion on how Nolf does against Green in the future is just an opinion. It is based on their last match, and where I view their trajectories. You may feel strongly Green handles Nolf next time they meet. I'm always down for a little action...$$ ;)

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1 hour ago, 82bordeaux said:

I didn't bring Bo up because I was agreeing with you in that I think he has that "it" factor over Nolf. Although Bo put up a respectable effort against Cox, he was never that close to challenging him at Final X. But by April, who knows? And my opinion on how Nolf does against Green in the future is just an opinion. It is based on their last match, and where I view their trajectories. You may feel strongly Green handles Nolf next time they meet. I'm always down for a little action...$$ ;)

Fair enough, but I do disagree on not challenging Cox in Final X.  In the first match, score ended 2-2 with Nickal being the only one in a deep shot.  I believe he will finish that next time.  2nd match was a more controlled win for Cox.

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1 minute ago, Gantry said:

If I had a Nickal for every wrestler who had a shot on J'Den and couldn't finish....

 

Did you watch the flurry?  He will finish that in the future.

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In the first match, score ended 2-2 with Nickal being the only one in a deep shot.  I believe he will finish that next time.


Except the next time, Nickal didn't even come close to scoring. Once J'den has had a feel for you, his defense gets even tougher than it already is. He also sweats too much for anybody to finish a shot on him.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

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11 hours ago, Crotalus said:


 

 


Except the next time, Nickal didn't even come close to scoring. Once J'den has had a feel for you, his defense gets even tougher than it already is. He also sweats too much for anybody to finish a shot on him.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

 

The next time in the future, not the 2nd match of a best of 3 in the same day.

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