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Spencer Lee in Tokyo

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51 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Geez, you are dense. The excuse making this year, 2019, went something like this:

"there is something obviously wrong with him" 

"It's obvious he isn't 100 percent"

The word "obvious" is what caused my initial response because that wss the word so oft used to excuse losses in 2019. 

There is a difference in making excuses and pointing out the obvious.  I think it was pretty obvious that Lee's ACL injury had an impact on his loss to Bresser at the Midlands.  I do no think it had an impact in his loss to NaTo.  I think if somebody points out that there was something obviously wrong with Lee this year they aren't making excuses for him.  Just pointing out what should have been obvious.  I don't see how a person can look at 2018 Lee and 2019 Lee and not think there was something wrong with him.  Now, with that said, if you step on the mat less than 100% then be prepared to deal with the consequences.  Lee lost 2x to Rivera and got pinned by Picc.  There won't be an * next to those results just because a lot of people acknowledge that Lee was less than 100%.  They beat him fair and square.

It also puts into perspective how impressive Cael's run was. 

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6 minutes ago, Bozak2018 said:

There is a difference in making excuses and pointing out the obvious.  I think it was pretty obvious that Lee's ACL injury had an impact on his loss to Bresser at the Midlands.  I do no think it had an impact in his loss to NaTo.  I think if somebody points out that there was something obviously wrong with Lee this year they aren't making excuses for him.  Just pointing out what should have been obvious.  I don't see how a person can look at 2018 Lee and 2019 Lee and not think there was something wrong with him.  Now, with that said, if you step on the mat less than 100% then be prepared to deal with the consequences.  Lee lost 2x to Rivera and got pinned by Picc.  There won't be an * next to those results just because a lot of people acknowledge that Lee was less than 100%.  They beat him fair and square.

It also puts into perspective how impressive Cael's run was. 

Agree. 

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1 hour ago, Bozak2018 said:

There is a difference in making excuses and pointing out the obvious.  I think it was pretty obvious that Lee's ACL injury had an impact on his loss to Bresser at the Midlands.  I do no think it had an impact in his loss to NaTo.  I think if somebody points out that there was something obviously wrong with Lee this year they aren't making excuses for him.  Just pointing out what should have been obvious.  I don't see how a person can look at 2018 Lee and 2019 Lee and not think there was something wrong with him.  Now, with that said, if you step on the mat less than 100% then be prepared to deal with the consequences.  Lee lost 2x to Rivera and got pinned by Picc.  There won't be an * next to those results just because a lot of people acknowledge that Lee was less than 100%.  They beat him fair and square.

It also puts into perspective how impressive Cael's run was. 

Absolutely.

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6 hours ago, TBar1977 said:

Geez, you are dense. The excuse making this year, 2019, went something like this:

"there is something obviously wrong with him" 

"It's obvious he isn't 100 percent"

The word "obvious" is what caused my initial response because that wss the word so oft used to excuse losses in 2019. 

The "what's wrong with him" questions started well before his first loss at the Midlands.  The ISU dual is the first time I remember thinking he didn't look himself.

Edited by Dondante88

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13 hours ago, TBar1977 said:

Geez, you are dense. The excuse making this year, 2019, went something like this:

"there is something obviously wrong with him" 

"It's obvious he isn't 100 percent"

The word "obvious" is what caused my initial response because that wss the word so oft used to excuse losses in 2019. 

Geez, you are dense.  

Will you be making excuses in 2020?

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6 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

What excuses?

Injury excuses.  You have no problem talking about Team  Lee making excuses for "every loss since he was 11..."  despite the fact that you are unaware of any possible issues the kid was having.

You will have your chance to make some excuses within the next year.

How about an Avatar bet?  If David Taylor makes the Olympic team, I will change my avatar to John Adams/Thomas Jefferson/Aaron Burr (your choice).  If Taylor does not make the team, you will change your avatar to Dan Gable or Tom Brands (also your choice).  The avatar change will be for one full calendar year.

Edited by AHamilton

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41 minutes ago, AHamilton said:

I'll get you a glass of warm milk.  Here kitty kitty...

Excuses in advance... 

Basically the point is: You can trash Team Lee for "Making an excuse for every loss since he was 11," but now that I make it clear that DT (one of my favorite wrestlers to watch) is unlikely to make the Olympic team,  you are trying to backtrack.  I wish DT all the best, but him making the team seems to be a longshot.  You know this as well, therefore: you are unwilling to put your money where your mouth is.

AKA it is ok to trash a 19 year old kid, because there are no repercussions on the internet for faceless trolls... (never mind the comments made about 11 year old kids)

Edited by AHamilton

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On 10/31/2019 at 5:49 PM, AHamilton said:

 

 

So an ACL is a legit excuse for Taylor, but not for Lee (DeSanto match, matches during college campaign where he was wearing a brace)

I'm sure this has already been mentioned, but surely Lee's ACL was fully healed prior to last year's college losses?

IIRC, Lee was supposedly suffering from an undisclosed illness during the season, but neither Iowa nor Lee have ever confirmed it, and during those losses, it was not obvious that he was hurt/ill.

He didn't look as good as the previous year, or as good he'd later look at NCAAs, but that may have been due to any number of issues (including an illness).

He also seems to peak for NCAAs like no one I've ever seen before.  Although I thought he won the B10 final this past spring, it was a dead even match.  Had he faced him at NCAAs, just two weeks later, a tech wouldn't have been surprising.

And in 2018, he goes from losing to Tomasello at B10s to sticking him at NCAAs (and IIRC, he was dominating him prior).

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8 hours ago, TBar1977 said:

Cleary I have you worked up. I am declaring victory. 

LOL... No, I'm sitting here laughing at you and your hypocrisy.  Accept the avatar bet.  It'll be funny!

Also: In the future, maybe it is a good idea not to trash 17 and 18 year old kids (or for that matter 11 year old kids) who are hurt or sick.

Edited by AHamilton

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50 minutes ago, AHamilton said:

LOL... No, I'm sitting here laughing at you and your hypocrisy.  Accept the avatar bet.  It'll be funny!

Also: In the future, maybe it is a good idea not to trash 17 and 18 year old kids (or for that matter 11 year old kids) who are hurt or sick.

I reserve the right to trash an of age adult (18+) if they deserve it.  Legally defined minors on the other hand should be off limits, unless they commit an egregious act.  You know, kinda like how both the judicial system and our current journalism practices keep.

Edited by treep2000

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7 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

You know, kinda like how both the judicial system and our current journalism practices keep.

Remember that time when Flobros """reported""" the name of the Bergen Catholic kid, back when non-amateur outlets protected the kid's anonymity?

Edited by jon

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16 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

I reserve the right to trash an of age adult (18+) if they deserve it.  Legally defined minors on the other hand should be off limits, unless they commit an egregious act.  You know, kinda like how both the judicial system and our current journalism practices keep.

"Who are hurt or sick"... not criminals, bad sports, etc.  Hurt or sick.

The gist of the debate here:

Tbar says that saying that Lee lost to DeSanto, Bresser, NaTo because of his ACL injury/recovery  is "making an excuse." (TBar then walked back his critique of the DeSanto excuse; also fails to realize that the Bresser loss was something like 9 months post surgery)

On the flip side, if and when DT loses to Cox at OTT, the ACL will be a "reason" not an "excuse"

Edited by AHamilton

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20 minutes ago, Lurker said:

I might have missed something in this thread but I didn’t realize there was a victory out there to declare??

It is on equal footing as the excuses that were not declared when DT suffered an ACL tear at BTS.

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1 hour ago, AHamilton said:

LOL... No, I'm sitting here laughing at you and your hypocrisy.  Accept the avatar bet.  It'll be funny!

Also: In the future, maybe it is a good idea not to trash 17 and 18 year old kids (or for that matter 11 year old kids) who are hurt or sick.

Never trashed Lee once. I trolled Iowa fans. How can you not understand the difference. 

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