Bill Farrell Discussion Thread

[AZ_wrestling 106]

Nothing to take away from that Imar/Nolf match. Nolf clearly hurt. 

[NJDan 594]

2 hours ago, BigTimeFan said:

Apologies as I didn’t wade through all the early posts, but does anyone know why Nickal didn’t show? I’m also surprised that neither Fix nor Lee showed. I mean there was the whole Iowa recruiting day thing that Lee is going to be working toward the Olympics all year. 

Nickal is just back from U23, where I believe he qualified for OTT.

[steen-hooph 60]

1 hour ago, GranbyTroll said:

I know that Mike Mal coached and wrestled at a high level, which made that comment stick out so much for me. It sounds like something a misinformed youth wrestler's dad would say after a loss than something an informed pundit and student of the sport would say. The big question now is if Gross can be effective at that weight with a 2 day weight in procedure. 

Against the World's best with no breaks in early round matches. He looks freakishly tall for the weight. Someone reassure me with some comps. I am not an expert.

[GoNotQuietly 892]

I can’t imagine a wrestler being more than that gross looked this morning, so it stands to reason he definitely has a height advantage.

Imar, molinaro, and even ringer looked exhausted in their quarters and semis, which I honestly like as a fan. They shouldn’t be peaking their conditioning right now, and we have all seen Russia has our in November and spank everyone at worlds/Olympics

Japan is going to be extremely tough in Tokyo. They didn’t send their aces, but the whole program Greco, freestyle, and women’s has depth and direction/vision which really impressed me

It’s astonishing that I can walk into the NYAC for twenty bucks and stand matside when basically every match after the quarters features at minimum an NCAA champ. What a phenomenal and under publicized event


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[de4856 360]

57, Gross was surprisingly good, his stock just went way up at this weight.

65, JO, still very slick, nice win, but I think he has to still work on his gas tank. 

74, IMar survived a very tough one against Gantt, and then cruises past an injured Nolf, (I am sure the injury hurt Nolf’s chances considerably). I would’ve liked to have seen Gantt against Joseph or Nolf today. And although Lewis took 4th, I think that he’s got a very bright future . 

86, Dieringer, up a weight taking on some really good wrestlers and winning the Gold, nice day for him. 

97, SnyderMan, looked smooth, and in control. Hopefully he is happy in his new surroundings. 

125, Gable, it took a while but he started to open up Bradley at the end there, it was nice to see him on the mat again. 

[pamela 1,334]

I love me some Jordan Oliver and am very glad that he’s qualified for trials. With all the suspension stuff I was saddened that he might have missed his shot during some prime wrestling years. We’ll see how he fares against Zain, Yianni, etc. but I’m very happy to see him there in the mix.

[Crash 138]

I love me some Jordan Oliver and am very glad that he’s qualified for trials. With all the suspension stuff I was saddened that he might have missed his shot during some prime wrestling years. We’ll see how he fares against Zain, Yianni, etc. but I’m very happy to see him there in the mix.

 

When healthy and in shape, he is our best guy at 65.

 

While he hasn’t had the single massive injuries like Dale and Taylor has, he has had so many that kept him from being at top form.

 

He seemed to be completely healthy in this event, although his gas tank looked to be only about 80% full. If he can get that to 100 and be healthy at trials, he should make the team.

 

Wonder where worse he will compete between now and trials.

 

 

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[Crash 138]

....
It’s astonishing that I can walk into the NYAC for twenty bucks and stand matside when basically every match after the quarters features at minimum an NCAA champ. What a phenomenal and under publicized.

While this is always true, this was especially true this year. Great field...



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[Crash 138]

While this is always true, this was especially true this year. Great field...



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I just read your post and my response to my wife. Her response....” you guys should both shut up and keep your mouths closed so we don’t ruin a good thing”....ha!!


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[Ogalthorpe Haywood 322]

1 hour ago, Crash said:

 

When healthy and in shape, he is our best guy at 65.

It’s been the same story year after year. Imo if he was our best he would’ve made at least one team by now. It’s not like he has medalists standing in his way. 

[spladle08 739]

2 hours ago, Crash said:

 

When healthy and in shape, he is our best guy at 65.

 

 

Yeah, I want to believe this, but I don't think he is our best guy at all. Mind you I love me some JO. 
If the question is "Who is our guy at the weight most likely to get the first takedown against anyone in the world" Sure. 
If matches were 30 seconds.... sure.....
but 6 minutes match, its the most disappointing thing ever to watch year in and year out. 
I know it's easy to think "Well your saying he has the talent you're just saying he lacks a gas tank and he can fix that he's been injured"
But look to almost any loss he has had in his senior level career,  as the match progresses he turns into a different wrestler. Timid, tired, trying to coast

Gimme Yainni's continued scoring ability. Or Zain's Metcalfness... at the Olympics. 
 

Edited November 17, 2019 by spladle08

[TBar1977 3,845]

11 hours ago, AZ_wrestling said:

Nothing to take away from that Imar/Nolf match. Nolf clearly hurt. 

I was at a party last night. Got home saw the result and read the posts and could not even muster up the desire to watch it. So I watch this morning and yeah, Nolf was clearly protecting that leg. He could not fend off I Mar's power while hobbling on one leg. I just hope whatever it is, it isn't keeping him out for the entire season. 

[spladle08 739]

He'll be alright, I hope. Looked good, but I think it's still clearly Burroughs vs Dake, but those 2 aren't far behind. and there are a lot of other speed bumps others could present, but I liked that he was distancing himself from the other guys i would consider "second tier". 
Hope he is able to get a lot of competition in before trials, gotta get that guy experience. 

[TBar1977 3,845]

Question. I am assuming I Mar was already qualified for Trials. Did yesterday's 2nd place finish get Nolf qualified? And if so, was he required to wrestle in that finals match to qualify? 

[TBar1977 3,845]

Pretty sure the injury occurs when Cenzo pulls Nolf's right ankle in sideways at 1:09 left in Period 2. 

https://www.flowrestling.org/events/6566197-2019-bill-farrell-memorial-international-open/videos?playing=6600688

[spladle08 739]

4 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Question. I am assuming I Mar was already qualified for Trials. Did yesterday's 2nd place finish get Nolf qualified? And if so, was he required to wrestle in that finals match to qualify? 

they had the article about Macciavello qualifying before the finals, because Snyderman had already qualified so I think making the finals was enough. 
Why do you think Imar was already qualified? I'm not real versed on the procedures, but I can't think of any accomplishments he's had that would qualify him. 
I know there is a list of qualifiers floating around here somewhere, I'll find it 

[DocBZ 89]

1 hour ago, TBar1977 said:

Pretty sure the injury occurs when Cenzo pulls Nolf's right ankle in sideways at 1:09 left in Period 2. 

https://www.flowrestling.org/events/6566197-2019-bill-farrell-memorial-international-open/videos?playing=6600688

It would seem so....

"2019 Bill Farrell International Open November 2019

The highest placed Senior Freestyle USA athlete per weight category winning a medal, who has yet to qualify will earn a spot in the 2020 U.S. Olympic Team Trials ‐ Wrestling."

 

http://content.themat.com/forms/2020-OLY-MFS.pdf

 

but....I don't see Imar on the list below

 

https://www.teamusa.org/USA-Wrestling/Features/2019/October/01/2020-Olympic-Team-Trials-Qualifiers-as-of-Oct-1

 

 

Men’s freestyle

57 kg
2018 World Team member – Thomas Gilman (Titan Mercury WC/Hawkeye WC)
2019 World Team member – Daton Fix (Titan Mercury WC/Cowboy RTC)

Qualified at non-Olympic weight (61 kg)
2018 Final X champion – Nahshon Garrett (Sunkist Kids)
2018 World Team member – Joe Colon (Titan Mercury WC/Valley RTC)
2019 World Team member – Tyler Graff (Titan Mercury WC/NJRTC)

65 kg
2018 World Team member – Logan Stieber (Titan Mercury WC)
2019 World Team member – Zain Retherford (Nittany Lion WC)

Qualified at non-Olympic weight (70 kg)
2019 World Team member – James Green (Sunkist Kids)

74 kg
Automatic Final X berth – Jordan Burroughs, 2019 World bronze medalist (Sunkist Kids)
2019 Junior World champion – David Carr (Cyclone RTC)

Qualified at non-Olympic weight (79 kg)
2019 World Team member – Kyle Dake (Titan Mercury WC)
Note: As a 2019 World champion at a non-Olympic weight, Dake earns a bid to the semifinals of the weight he chooses

86 kg
2018 World Team member – David Taylor (Nittany Lion WC)
2019 World Team member – Pat Downey (Titan Mercury WC/NJRTC)

Qualified at non-Olympic weight (92 kg)
2019 World Team member – J’den Cox (Titan Mercury WC/USOPTC)
Note: As a 2019 World champion at a non-Olympic weight, Cox earns a bid to the semifinals of the weight he chooses

97 kg
Automatic Final X berth – Kyle Snyder, 2019 World bronze medalist (Titan Mercury)

125 kg
2019 World Team member – Nick Gwiazdowski (Titan Mercury WC/Wolfpack WC)
2019 Junior World champion – Mason Parris (Cliff Keen WC)

U23 World Champion

Bo Nickal

Edited November 17, 2019 by DocBZ

[spladle08 739]

• From FLO: https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/6593624-whos-in-these-17-guys-are-already-qualified-for-the-2020-olympic-trials?playing=6593624
  Thomas Gilman
• Daton Fix
• Nahshon Garrett
• Joe Colon
• Tyler Graff
• Zain Retherford
• James Green
• Jordan Burroughs
• Kyle Dake
• J'den Cox
• David Taylor
• Pat Downey
• Kyle Snyder
• Nick Gwiazdowski
   
• David Carr
• Mason Parris
  Bo Nickal

[DocBZ 89]

So new qualifiers then are..

 

Gross

JO

Imar

Dieringer

Macch

Gable

[TBar1977 3,845]

1 hour ago, spladle08 said:

they had the article about Macciavello qualifying before the finals, because Snyderman had already qualified so I think making the finals was enough. 
Why do you think Imar was already qualified? I'm not real versed on the procedures, but I can't think of any accomplishments he's had that would qualify him. 
I know there is a list of qualifiers floating around here somewhere, I'll find it 

I have no idea of the procedures because the machinations are weird and I don't care to spend the time figuring them out, but if the #2 guy from 2019 isn't qualified for 2020 then, in theory, assuming Dake didn't go down in weight,  who would Burroughs wrestle against at Trials? They have to create some sort of field for him to go against, right? How would I Mar NOT be in that field? 

Crazy that a kid like Carr was qualified and Nolf, let alone I Mar was not. 

Edited November 17, 2019 by TBar1977

[spladle08 739]

1 minute ago, TBar1977 said:

I have no idea of the procedures because the machinations are weird and I don't care to spend the time figuring them out, but if the #2 guy from 2019 isn't qualified for 2020 then, in theory, assuming Dake didn't go down in weight,  who would Burroughs wrestle against at Trials? They have to create some sort of field for him to go against, right? How would I Mar NOT be in that field? 

Yeah, ummmm I didn't realize how small the brackets are until just now. 
I understand its only meant to be for the "elite" but looking at who's qualified and how many opportunities people still have to qualify, it's going to be pretty thin. I'm sure it's thin every Olympic cycle, I just hadn't noticed. 

[DocBZ 89]

There are plenty more events to qualify. The big 2 are the Olympic Trials Qualifier (OTW know as Senior Nationals) in December 2019 (top 5 qualify) and the Final Olympic Trials Qualifier (Last Chance) in March 2020 which is only open to non-qualifiers (top 2 qualify). So that's a minimum of 7 more qualifiers per weight. This is not even including 2020 NCAA champions and Pan Am games.

After yesterday there are now 24 qualifiers across 6 weights so about 4 per weight already.

Bottom line is if you are a top 10 guy at your weight you "should" qualify in one way or another.

Video explanation below...

https://www.flowrestling.org/video/6588170-2020-olympic-team-trials-whos-in-and-whos-out

Edited November 17, 2019 by DocBZ
changed

[spladle08 739]

8 minutes ago, DocBZ said:

There is plenty more events to qualify. The big 2 are the Olympic Trials qualifier in December 2019 (top 5 qualify) and the Final Olympic Trials Qualifier in March 2020 which is only open to non-qualifiers (top 2 qualify). So that's a minimum of 7 more qualifiers per weight. This is not even including 2020 NCAA champions and Pan Am games.

After yesterday there are now 23 qualifiers across 6 weights so roughly 4 per weight already.

Bottom line is if you are a top 10 guy at your weight you "should" qualify in one way or another.

Thanks for that breakdown!

[GranbyTroll 430]

11 hours ago, pamela said:

I love me some Jordan Oliver and am very glad that he’s qualified for trials. With all the suspension stuff I was saddened that he might have missed his shot during some prime wrestling years. We’ll see how he fares against Zain, Yianni, etc. but I’m very happy to see him there in the mix.

He was definitely our best option the year he got suspended. Was he world medal good? The world may never know...

[iGranby 175]

57 - Gross is going to be a problem, especially as long as he keeps the weight cuts to an absolute minimum. NATO and Suriano are going to be close behind, and lets not forget about Lee, Fix, and Gilman. Plenty of other guys as well. 

65- JO looked very, very good. McKenna looks much improved from the last time we saw him in FS. Henderson was impressive as well.  Molinaro, even with a runner-up finish didnt look good imo. Plus, per the usual when he was not able to pull it together to win a match that was completely within his grasp he goes juice head and starts whining about something (whether it be the ref, the other guy, whatever). 

74- This weight was fun to watch for sure. If the gap between IMar and Burroughs is as close as we think, where does the rest of the heap sit? Tommy Gantt was right there in the semis and looked solid all tournament. Nolf was seemingly putting it on Cenzo until the injury. Cenzo looked damn good as well. Massa looked solid. Im a bit puzzled by Marsteller, hope to see him on the mat more. When he is on I think he adds some serious depth to the weight. 

Other stuff: I cant remember if I've heard Bray's commentary before, but I enjoyed it yesterday (It was him, right? like 99% sure it was). Like him on FRL as well. I appreciate what Mike Malinconico brings to the table for Flo, the dude clearly loves the sport and has a wealth of knowledge in regard to the technical aspects. Behind the dirt is always fun/cool. He is someone who would be great for live radio commentating because he describes matches so well as they go. With that being said, I really do not enjoy his chatter or especially his interviews. Something about the way he talks to coaches/athletes. This is why I never listened to his podcast when it was going. I cant quite put my finger on it, but it's just a preference thing I suppose. Im sure plenty of people like the guy. Just not me. SImilar to how some people dont like Pyles, or Nomad or any individual. Who knows. Not a huge deal, just mute it when he's commentating obviously. My problem, not Flo's lol. 

The stream was really good. Had no issues. I will say though - it really bugged me that a match would start, I would literally watch two guys shake hands - then the screen goes black and I hear... "OOOO---OOOHH, LALALALALA" - The damn insurance(?) commercial pops onto the screen and I miss the first 10 seconds of a match. Whats up with that?  I get that the ads are necessary, even if when you have premium but cmon. 

Over all - the Farrell was sick.