Antitroll2828 987 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 So coach Buxton left Blair in 2012, I know in 2014 Ruth won his last title. My question is has Blair had an Ncaa champion since then. Seems while Blair still is the number 1 team in the country, there athletes college success seemed to dip. Am I wrong or has anyone else noticed this? Is the lack of success at the next level a direct result of buxton leaving? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
klehner 731 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 8 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said: So coach Buxton left Blair in 2012, I know in 2014 Ruth won his last title. My question is has Blair had an Ncaa champion since then. Seems while Blair still is the number 1 team in the country, there athletes college success seemed to dip. Am I wrong or has anyone else noticed this? Is the lack of success at the next level a direct result of buxton leaving? They've only had nine NCAA champions in their history. It's not like they have been churning them out at a high rate. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ResiliteMarine 29 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 They are better known for having AA's consistently. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ptz305 145 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 (edited) Interesting question. Looking beyond Blair, this seems to be a trend among wrestlers from power programs. Wrestlers who were world beaters in high school get caught in college once others have the same training methods available. Don't get me wrong, these wrestlers are typically very good, but they have a lower ceiling than many of their peers. Edited November 12, 2019 by ptz305 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1032004 1,420 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 10 minutes ago, ptz305 said: Interesting question. Looking beyond Blair, this seems to be a trend among wrestlers from power programs. Wrestlers who were world beaters in high school get caught in college once others have the same training methods available. Don't get me wrong, these wrestlers are typically very good, but they have a lower ceiling than many of their peers. Depends on how you define "power programs" I guess. Just looking at last year, I think some would argue Suriano, Ashnault, Lewis, Valencia, and Nickal were all from "power programs." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steamboat_charlie v2 1,124 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Antitroll2828 said: So coach Buxton left Blair in 2012, I know in 2014 Ruth won his last title. My question is has Blair had an Ncaa champion since then. Seems while Blair still is the number 1 team in the country, there athletes college success seemed to dip. Am I wrong or has anyone else noticed this? Is the lack of success at the next level a direct result of buxton leaving? I wouldn't take too much from that. Sometimes these guys come in waves. Blair is as strong right now as they've ever been, and are going to continue to pump out high quality recruits. Some with more room to improve than others. Ramirez, Van Ness, Mastro 1, Mastro 2, Stewart, McGowan... you're going to see some titles out of those kids. And those are just the names I know, not following high school nearly as close as I used to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ptz305 145 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 12 minutes ago, 1032004 said: Depends on how you define "power programs" I guess. Just looking at last year, I think some would argue Suriano, Ashnault, Lewis, Valencia, and Nickal were all from "power programs." Good point, I'm not really sure how to define it, maybe as perennial top 20-25 programs on the National level. Not simply dominating in state, but producing national level heavy hitters throughout the line-up. Suriano - Yes. Ashnault - No, but I could be wrong. While South Plainfield is very good, I think their national success during his time was more of the result of a monster senior class. Again, could be wrong. Lewis - No, I don't think Bound Brook is a perennial top 25 team in the country, though they have an awesome program, they don't show up in the rankings every year. Valencia - No, SJB does not appear regularly in the rankings, though some of their individuals do and they are stacked right now. Either way, his brother serves as the counter argument. Nickal - Maybe, but again, this seems like a team that pops up on occasion and not year after year after year. I can't really think of any other D1 type guys from this school. While all of these programs are awesome, they have not been on the same level as Blair, BC, SPG, Sem, St. Eds, DCC, Montini, for years and years on end. 1 Nicky_Pipes reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VAtoSC 32 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 21 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said: I wouldn't take too much from that. Sometimes these guys come in waves. Blair is as strong right now as they've ever been, and are going to continue to pump out high quality recruits. Some with more room to improve than others. Ramirez, Van Ness, Mastro 1, Mastro 2, Stewart, McGowan... you're going to see some titles out of those kids. And those are just the names I know, not following high school nearly as close as I used to. What has always amazed me about Blair is that they have big-time studs every year, but the less heralded guys are still Ironman and Beast of the East and National Prep placewinners. Yes Ruth was their last NCAA National Champion, but just last year they had three more All-Americans in Kutler, Kolodzik, and McKenna. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jon 158 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 (edited) My opinion: In recent years Blair guys have gone to the 'wrong' programs. They've gone to schools known for academics (whether or not this perception is justified lol) moreso than for wrestling. E.g., Cornell. I'm kinda grasping here but Blair guys who go on to attend power programs (e.g., Iowa, ISU, OkSt, tOSU) tend to have better outcomes than those who don't. Edited November 12, 2019 by jon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Antitroll2828 987 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 2 hours ago, klehner said: They've only had nine NCAA champions in their history. It's not like they have been churning them out at a high rate. 9 ncaa champs from one high school in 25 years I’d say that is a pretty good rate compared to most schools 1 Greatdane67 reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Morgan 54 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 I agree with Antitroll...I am sure there are not many HS's in the country who can claim even close to 9 NCAA champs. As a comparison, Bloomington Kennedy HS in MN has the highest number of NCAA champs in the state with three...Marty Morgan (MN), Joel Sharratt (IA), and Jason Ness (MN). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brickhousey 120 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 TexRef reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steamboat_charlie v2 1,124 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 27 minutes ago, brickhousey said: This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk This has come up here before so I won't spoil it. Not sure who it is in Ohio... best guess is SPG with Jim Jordan, David Taylor, and if you count Schlatter that makes 5 titles. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jon 158 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 56 minutes ago, brickhousey said: This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Also relevant: Most national championiships not just champions? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Witherman 384 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 1 hour ago, John Morgan said: I agree with Antitroll...I am sure there are not many HS's in the country who can claim even close to 9 NCAA champs. As a comparison, Bloomington Kennedy HS in MN has the highest number of NCAA champs in the state with three...Marty Morgan (MN), Joel Sharratt (IA), and Jason Ness (MN). apple valley's website says they have 6 ncaa champs - could this be counting multiple championships per individual athlete? i'm no expert on minnesota HS wrestling but they were the first team that I thought of when you mentioned bloomington being the most Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Witherman 384 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 1 hour ago, brickhousey said: This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 6 minutes ago, jon said: Also relevant: Most national championiships not just champions? quick research here but a few links I found. Looks like everything is 2017 or older. http://www.cmwrestlingalumni.com/blog/which-state-has-the-most-ncaa-championship-titles https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/5065531-which-state-is-the-best-at-producing-ncaa-all-americans looks like @Jaroslav Hasek needs to get to work on this topic 1 jon reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ptz305 145 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 1 hour ago, brickhousey said: This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Cedar Rapids Prairie? 1 Witherman reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Witherman 384 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 36 minutes ago, ptz305 said: Cedar Rapids Prairie? didn't even think of prairie. just between jimmy z and barry davis there is 6! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDogg 273 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 3 hours ago, brickhousey said: This creates a cool trivia question, what Public school has the most national champions? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I don’t know the answer but I’d bet pretty heavily it’s in Oklahoma...and my best guess is Perry High School. Oklahoma State and to a lesser extent Oklahoma have been churning out ncaa champs for damn near a century and their talent is notoriously home grown. A few years ago I think they had 7-8 guys on the roster from Stillwater High School alone. I know they’ve got 2 starters this year (Kaid Brock and Joe Smith) from Stillwater. And Perry has been a dynasty since before it produced Dan Hodge. One year in the seventies Oklahoma won a Team title and 5 out of their 10 starters were from Perry. Final guess: Perry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1032004 1,420 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, MDogg said: I don’t know the answer but I’d bet pretty heavily it’s in Oklahoma...and my best guess is Perry High School. Oklahoma State and to a lesser extent Oklahoma have been churning out ncaa champs for damn near a century and their talent is notoriously home grown. A few years ago I think they had 7-8 guys on the roster from Stillwater High School alone. I know they’ve got 2 starters this year (Kaid Brock and Joe Smith) from Stillwater. And Perry has been a dynasty since before it produced Dan Hodge. One year in the seventies Oklahoma won a Team title and 5 out of their 10 starters were from Perry. Final guess: Perry. According to the previous topic linked above Jaroslav Hasek said it was Tulsa Central with 15. Quick google search reveals they don't even have a team currently? https://www.tulsaworld.com/sports/high-school/john-klein-the-kings-of-wrestling-once-called-central-high/article_6c18438a-bb38-5dd8-8bee-a0cb0ae6c2de.html 1 MDogg reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NJDan 1,070 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 4 hours ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said: This has come up here before so I won't spoil it. Not sure who it is in Ohio... best guess is SPG with Jim Jordan, David Taylor, and if you count Schlatter that makes 5 titles. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NJDan 1,070 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, NJDan said: I always assumed SPG was Catholic b/c of the Saint in the name. But I googled and learned otherwise. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OBXWrestler 108 Report post Posted November 12, 2019 7 hours ago, ptz305 said: Good point, I'm not really sure how to define it, maybe as perennial top 20-25 programs on the National level. Not simply dominating in state, but producing national level heavy hitters throughout the line-up. Suriano - Yes. Ashnault - No, but I could be wrong. While South Plainfield is very good, I think their national success during his time was more of the result of a monster senior class. Again, could be wrong. Lewis - No, I don't think Bound Brook is a perennial top 25 team in the country, though they have an awesome program, they don't show up in the rankings every year. Valencia - No, SJB does not appear regularly in the rankings, though some of their individuals do and they are stacked right now. Either way, his brother serves as the counter argument. Nickal - Maybe, but again, this seems like a team that pops up on occasion and not year after year after year. I can't really think of any other D1 type guys from this school. While all of these programs are awesome, they have not been on the same level as Blair, BC, SPG, Sem, St. Eds, DCC, Montini, for years and years on end. AJ Ferrari Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Morgan 54 Report post Posted November 13, 2019 5 hours ago, Witherman said: apple valley's website says they have 6 ncaa champs - could this be counting multiple championships per individual athlete? i'm no expert on minnesota HS wrestling but they were the first team that I thought of when you mentioned bloomington being the most Dang. I could be behind the times and that may be so. AV DI champs...Mark Hall, Seth Gross, and Matt Demary (WI). DII champs Destin McCauley (NE Kearney), and Mike Langlais (NDSU). I am missing someone but not sure who off hand. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mphillips 1,669 Report post Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, NJDan said: I always assumed SPG was Catholic b/c of the Saint in the name. But I googled and learned otherwise. It was a running joke in Ohio for years how the, 'private, Catholic school' recruited all the nations best. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites