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OSU v Lehigh

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27 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

I didn't hear anything about a change of mind but I only heard briefly about this anyway so who knows? (And to lay all the cards out- if anyone doesn't know- I'm a Lehigh fan)

What might have happened is that there were likely at least two people doing a check. Lehigh's trainer and the local dermatologist. I didn't see the skin check and was told that it was the trainer that made the call but I did see the doctor at the meet and doubt he came just to watch. For those that don't know - it is these two people that wrote the skin check rules for the NCAA some years ago so they aren't just a couple guys there. So one of them might have made a preliminary statement about whatever they saw and then the doctor probably made the final call. Possibly even after examining a swab under a microscope as they often do.

As to the article statements about this- some of which I find very shallow in thinking-

1. "Understandably in a sport with such close contact, the rule requiring skin checks makes sense for the health of the athletes. The rule of having someone from the opposing team’s camp check the skin sometimes does not (for obvious reasons)."

This is patently absurd. If anything a cynic would expect the opposing people to be more likely to dq which would be more in keeping with the health of the wrestlers if not the ability to get on the mat. The same team's people would then be more likely to let it slide which would be against the health of the wrestlers. This also assumes a lack of ethics.

2. The following day, Witcraft weighed in vs. Lehigh, was checked by their doctor, and was initially cleared to wrestle. They simply told him to cover up whatever his skin issue was. Presumably, it wasn’t super serious as it was not even mentioned by the Drexel physicians.

This assumes that the first doc even saw the same thing. He might have missed a location, it might have spread or got worse overnight. This article assumes the Lehigh people were wrong and the Drexel people right. It could be the other way around or, as I said above, it could have gotten worse. The stress of wrestling and the trip can bring out whatever it was. He could have abraded it while wrestling. 

I agree.  It would be terrible if someone just assumed one doctor was right.

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25 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

I didn't hear anything about a change of mind but I only heard briefly about this anyway so who knows? (And to lay all the cards out- if anyone doesn't know- I'm a Lehigh fan)

What might have happened is that there were likely at least two people doing a check. Lehigh's trainer and the local dermatologist. I didn't see the skin check and was told that it was the trainer that made the call but I did see the doctor at the meet and doubt he came just to watch. For those that don't know - it is these two people that wrote the skin check rules for the NCAA some years ago so they aren't just a couple guys there. So one of them might have made a preliminary statement about whatever they saw and then the doctor probably made the final call. Possibly even after examining a swab under a microscope as they often do.

As to the article statements about this- some of which I find very shallow in thinking-

1. "Understandably in a sport with such close contact, the rule requiring skin checks makes sense for the health of the athletes. The rule of having someone from the opposing team’s camp check the skin sometimes does not (for obvious reasons)."

This is patently absurd. If anything a cynic would expect the opposing people to be more likely to dq which would be more in keeping with the health of the wrestlers if not the ability to get on the mat. The same team's people would then be more likely to let it slide which would be against the health of the wrestlers. This also assumes a lack of ethics.

2. The following day, Witcraft weighed in vs. Lehigh, was checked by their doctor, and was initially cleared to wrestle. They simply told him to cover up whatever his skin issue was. Presumably, it wasn’t super serious as it was not even mentioned by the Drexel physicians.

This assumes that the first doc even saw the same thing. He might have missed a location, it might have spread or got worse overnight. This article assumes the Lehigh people were wrong and the Drexel people right. It could be the other way around or, as I said above, it could have gotten worse. The stress of wrestling and the trip can bring out whatever it was. He could have abraded it while wrestling. 

 

Agreed, what happened the day before is irrelevant.  The condition could’ve gotten worse, or they might’ve just missed it.

I’m not buying he was ever told to cover it up.  Any health professional worth their salt is not going to tell someone to cover up a possibly contagious condition.  But IF that happened, that’s even more proof something was questionable on the skin.

But yes, I would be curious to see additional explanation on why he was allegedly first cleared, but then not.  There being 2 people checking and he got past 1 but not the other is likely the most plausible.

 

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11 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Im not buying he was ever told to cover it up.  Any health professional worth their salt is not going to tell someone to cover up a possibly contagious condition.  But IF that happened, that’s even more proof something was questionable on the skin.

And knowing the Lehigh people involved as long as I have, it surprises me that it might be true. At the most, I could see them saying that they would examine more closely and if then found not infectious to cover it up.

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2 hours ago, witwhiz said:

 

Is Jack Foley the one that diagnosed this?  If he so, he can't hold a press conference,  proclaim himself an expert and then announce the medical condition of somebody.

Edited by Plasmodium
removed personal info

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25 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Is Jack Foley the one that diagnosed this?  If he so, he can't hold a press conference,  proclaim himself an expert and then announce the medical condition of somebody.

All negatives.

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46 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Is Jack Foley the one that diagnosed this?  If he so, he can't hold a press conference,  proclaim himself an expert and then announce the medical condition of somebody.

Who said he had a press conference? That could have been something someone heard him say at the skin check. And Witwhiz added the credentials not Jack. And also he wasn't alone at the skin check. Our dermatologist who has a lot of the same NCAA credentials would have been there also.

 

Also, from what I've heard, he wasn't cleared at Lehigh then dqed at Lehigh. He was cleared at Drexel and dqed at Lehigh. I don't think that reporter was there. I don't see any mention of the dq beyond the simple fact on the OSU site.

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2 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

Who said he had a press conference? That could have been something someone heard him say at the skin check. And Witwhiz added the credentials not Jack. And also he wasn't alone at the skin check. Our dermatologist who has a lot of the same NCAA credentials would have been there also.

 

Also, from what I've heard, he wasn't cleared at Lehigh then dqed at Lehigh. He was cleared at Drexel and dqed at Lehigh. I don't think that reporter was there. I don't see any mention of the dq beyond the simple fact on the OSU site.

If he flunked the skin test it goes without saying he is dq'd, but the medical personnel shouldn't be offering info of a personal and private nature.

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Someone who appears to be recently graduated Lehigh AA Ryan Preisch tweeted that he seemed to think it was a pretty obvious condition.

Edit:  although I kinda find that hard to believe because if it was obvious than I don’t see how OSU’s trainer, Smith/OSU coaches and the 1st Lehigh person all missed it 

Edited by 1032004

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1 minute ago, Plasmodium said:

If he flunked the skin test it goes without saying he is dq'd, but the medical personnel shouldn't be offering info of a personal and private nature.

Again, who said he did publicly and since he didn't wrestle and the skin check was done in full view of both teams is it really that private?

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2 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

Again, who said he did publicly and since he didn't wrestle and the skin check was done in full view of both teams is it really that private?

LOL   The part where it says "reported Lehigh Trainer Jack Foley"   And yes,  it is private information.  No need for anyone to announce that.

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48 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

LOL   The part where it says "reported Lehigh Trainer Jack Foley"   And yes,  it is private information.  No need for anyone to announce that.

Look up the definitions of "report", which include "to relate or tell about."

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30 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

Where do you see that other than something someone posted here?

Yeah I'm confused where that came from.  A quick google search on "Jack Foley Lehigh" and the only wrestling related things I see are an article about Jake Jakobsen from last year's NCAA's, and some random Lehigh video on Youtube.

Random fact, apparently he was considered a hero by caring for victims at the Boston Marathon bombing in 2013.

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Could it be he had a minor skin condition and it itched a bit and he scratched it right before the skin check? Made it red and stands out to anyone looking?

Might be as simple as that. We have all had an itch and scratched and in looking it appeared red and 'angry' to anyone looking.

Those doing the checking would not take a chance on it being something others might catch.

Hope it is just this simple and not a problem for him going forward.

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7 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

That is my source, whom I asked directly.  He apparently agreed that the info is not for public consumption and  removed it.

You asked Jack directly or witwhiz? That's the only place I saw it mentioned was his post. I have no idea who either of you are so how do I know that's what actually happened?

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38 minutes ago, WillieBoy said:

Could it be he had a minor skin condition and it itched a bit and he scratched it right before the skin check? Made it red and stands out to anyone looking?

 

its also possible he was under weight so already eating a bagel with strawberry jam and got some of it on his arm, failed to wipe it off before the skin check   ;_;

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2 hours ago, Plasmodium said:

That is my source, whom I asked directly.  He apparently agreed that the info is not for public consumption and  removed it.

**** First the Okst reporter is a Homer first and foremost.  Second Plasmodium sounds like someone who likes to pick at scabs.  Just one person's opinion.  If you were not there then you are handing out 2nd, 3rd or 4th hand information.    I know Jack Foley personally.  He is one of the top healthcare professionals associated with wrestling.  He would never disqualify any wrestler so Lehigh or any other team could have a leg up in a match or dual or tournament.  Jack is on the the most respected in his field, Let it go.  

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1 hour ago, Cary by the Lake said:

**** First the Okst reporter is a Homer first and foremost.  Second Plasmodium sounds like someone who likes to pick at scabs.  Just one person's opinion.  If you were not there then you are handing out 2nd, 3rd or 4th hand information.    I know Jack Foley personally.  He is one of the top healthcare professionals associated with wrestling.  He would never disqualify any wrestler so Lehigh or any other team could have a leg up in a match or dual or tournament.  Jack is on the the most respected in his field, Let it go.  

Scabs?  Is he in a union?  You need to take this up with whitwhiz, not me.  I said the alleged diagnosis of a failed skincheck is not for public consumption.  I bet no one, including you and Jack Foiey, will argue that point.

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So Plasmodium your argument has switched from OK State got a raw deal to concern about HIPAA rights?  Not really sure they apply when your standing in a room with 20 some odd other wrestlers, coaches, media etc all within ear shot.......No one is giving any specific diagnosis, just guesses......you are clinging to this argument because that is all you have left, which is fine......but just so you know, it's an embarrassing look........

Edited by Spladle88

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3 hours ago, Cary by the Lake said:

 Second Plasmodium sounds like someone who likes to pick at scabs.  Just one person's opinion.  

That one person has ruled that Plasmodium failed skin check.

Lehigh won this dual despite two wrestlers finishing one point short of a tech and three guys wheezing their way through the third period. Did Bethlehem have a higher altitude than usual?

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