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TBar1977

Check this sequence out

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It looked cool but isn’t that a flying scissors?

There was a college guy who used to counter singles by letting his opponent take the leg, then step behind the opponent’s near foot and falling  backwards - and ppl were wondering if it was a type of flying scissors and hence a legal move.

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Flying scissors is banned in Bjj and Judo. That said, I don't view this as flying scissors because in flying scissors both wrestlers (or bjj/judo) are usually in a neutral set up in some collar ties or maybe 2 on 1. One competitor will then jump into a flying scissors where the front leg is above the knee and the lower leg cuts just behind and under the back of the knee and comes in with force to break the stance of the opposing competitor. The force with the trail leg breaks the opponent's stance but can also break the opponent's leg or ankle.

What Poulin did was from a more defensive position and he doesn't use force on the back of the upper calf in an injurious way, he almost hooks the lower leg between his sweeping leg and his crotch. It has similar effect because one leg ends up on each side of the opponent, but it does not appear to have a potentially injurious aspect to the way he did it. Could what Poulin did cause injury? Maybe, but at first glance I don't think what he did is illegal. 

Edited by TBar1977

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It's a cutback using the leg. Should be illegal. He does it a little smoother and likely safer than how it was done when they made it illegal. He comes in lower and scoops it with the inside of his leg rather than a simple kick back. I'd be interested if there's an interpretation thing here or if ref simply didn't realize what he saw.

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1 hour ago, gimpeltf said:

It's a cutback using the leg. Should be illegal. He does it a little smoother and likely safer than how it was done when they made it illegal. He comes in lower and scoops it with the inside of his leg rather than a simple kick back. I'd be interested if there's an interpretation thing here or if ref simply didn't realize what he saw.

I was reluctant to use the phrase you used "scoops it", but that is what came to mind. Had he used real force then you think for sure about the cutback. The NFHS rule book says you can't "kick" the leg, that would be an illegal cutback. The question in my mind is whether Stevo actually "kicked" the leg out. Seems to me he scooped or gathered it, not kicked it. 

Edited by TBar1977

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That’s definitely a cutback and illegal in NCAA wrestling. It’s used a decent amount in freestyle and is legal. Not sure what the rules are for HS wrestling though.  

 

It’s cool to see Stevo is still throwing headlocks. 

Edited by Billyhoyle

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11 hours ago, gimpeltf said:

Book says nothing of the sort.

7.5.n leg block (cut-back)

 

That's it

Wrong...from NFHS rule book:

 

7-1-5n . This is a legal leg block (in picture).  The arm is used to block the leg prior to going to the mat.  The opponent's leg cannot be "cut out" by a kick

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2 hours ago, AnklePicker said:

Wrong...from NFHS rule book:

 

7-1-5n . This is a legal leg block (in picture).  The arm is used to block the leg prior to going to the mat.  The opponent's leg cannot be "cut out" by a kick

Good point but I was going to say it only shows a legal one.

And to your point, clearly can't kick but define kick. The picture also says/shows that using the arm is legal. He didn't use the arm to block, he used the leg. You're implying that only kicking is illegal. The picture implies that only use of the arm is legal and that kicking is illegal. It doesn't show everything in between which is pretty much what happened and what I was saying in my first post on this subject. What he did was clearly not what is shown as legal but unclearly different than what is said to be illegal. I wouldn't be surprised that the powers that be will need to define this better at some point.

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My understanding is this rule was put in place to prevent an unsafe back fall by the opponent from a standing position.  One where the wrestler or his opponent wouldn’t have the ability to protect themselves as they hit the mat or even turn to redirect the motion.  In most cases the motion wouldn’t create an injury but the point was to lesson the chance of it occurring.  If a modified version of the type of scissor sweep is deemed to be a similar risk then I’m sure someone will look into rewording the rules. 

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