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15 hours ago, Lunaticfringe said:

Surprised by was How well Kevin Steinhaus and Brett Pfarr developed. They were top class A wrestlers with untapped potential playing multiple sports in high school.

 

Busts I seen coming were Brandon Florida guys because they were all held back age wise and were 19 when they graduated high school. 

For quite a long time, many of the top high school recruits have been a year or more older than many other high school seniors. 

This was not a practice exclusive to Brandon, in fact, I'd wager that during the last 10-15 years more Blue Chip recruits were "old seniors" than those who weren't. 

I do think that keeping kids back 1-2 years, while often providing significant benefits in high school, also increases the odds of them contracting HEW earlier. 

From what I can see, the nation's premier recruits...the Top 10 guys...have all wrestled year-round for many years before they enter the crucible of DI wrestling. That type of intensity and stress exacts a toll on many fine wrestlers who become mentally worn-out by the time they are 20 year old college freshman. 

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Mike Benefiel - overestimated

Alex Tsirtsis - overestimated

Kenny Jordan - overestimated

Quentin Wright - I got him right on after his redshirt year and the change in coaching staff.

Darian Cruz - underestimated, but not by a ton.

Darrion Caldwell - underestimated 

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Beau Maynes at Oklahoma (from Kansas).   Ran into a lot of injuries and had a phenomenal high school career goinng 132-0 with 0 people taking him down. 

Donte Butler from Missouri.   I coached him in junior college for 1 year.  He was a stud that was 2nd in a loaded Fargo at 112 in summer of 2007.   His freshman year of college  in 2008 he came in and just crapped the bed (NJCAA districts), but because he had such a good year,  he luckily got a wild card.   Needless to say Donte then goes to the National tournament and it is like someone gave him coffee.  He wakes up and is launching guys left and right.  Loses in the semis and comes back for 3rd and gets Gorrian Award.  If academics were not part of college, and just athletics were...he'd be a multi time placer at NJCAA and maybe some lower levels of NCAA or NAIA.   Tons of talent,  but just could never fully committ to working hard in or out of the classroom.  

Jesse Webb at Ohio U/Castleton; He came in fresh off Jr. Double AA at Fargo and at Ohio U, you have a heavyweight coach....Freshman year he got fed to the wolves, but soph year looked promising.  Started 7-1 before a 17 match losing streak before squeaking out a SV win for 8th victory on the year before losing last 2 to finish 9-18.  Redshirted finally at 285 in 2017,  but opted to go to DIII Castleton for last 2 seasons where he competed in only 7 matches as a junior (4-3)  before going 1-0 in his lone match as a senior. 

 

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3 hours ago, Swayz said:

Beau Maynes at Oklahoma (from Kansas).   Ran into a lot of injuries and had a phenomenal high school career goinng 132-0 with 0 people taking him down. 

Donte Butler from Missouri.   I coached him in junior college for 1 year.  He was a stud that was 2nd in a loaded Fargo at 112 in summer of 2007.   His freshman year of college  in 2008 he came in and just crapped the bed (NJCAA districts), but because he had such a good year,  he luckily got a wild card.   Needless to say Donte then goes to the National tournament and it is like someone gave him coffee.  He wakes up and is launching guys left and right.  Loses in the semis and comes back for 3rd and gets Gorrian Award.  If academics were not part of college, and just athletics were...he'd be a multi time placer at NJCAA and maybe some lower levels of NCAA or NAIA.   Tons of talent,  but just could never fully committ to working hard in or out of the classroom.  

Jesse Webb at Ohio U/Castleton; He came in fresh off Jr. Double AA at Fargo and at Ohio U, you have a heavyweight coach....Freshman year he got fed to the wolves, but soph year looked promising.  Started 7-1 before a 17 match losing streak before squeaking out a SV win for 8th victory on the year before losing last 2 to finish 9-18.  Redshirted finally at 285 in 2017,  but opted to go to DIII Castleton for last 2 seasons where he competed in only 7 matches as a junior (4-3)  before going 1-0 in his lone match as a senior. 

 

I follow some D3 wrestling.  Jesse Webb definitely had way more matches than that at Castleton.

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On 7/31/2020 at 10:38 AM, Konquest said:

Scott Winston was kind of an example of what I was talking about years ago on this very thread.  A guy who had a college physique in high school who was dominant until guys caught up to him physically.  These "specimens" are usually the guys who wind up with a big learning curve in college and don't live up to their HS reputations.  It has to be mentally as well as physically frustrating when you're used to just rag-dolling everyone and all of a sudden those finishes don't work.  

Crazy to think about guys on the other end of that spectrum - Taylor, Dake, Valencia, Burroughs, a few examples of recent greats that were still physically maturing their true freshman year.

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On 8/4/2020 at 7:57 PM, AHamilton said:

I follow some D3 wrestling.  Jesse Webb definitely had way more matches than that at Castleton.

I wouldn't doubt it.  I should have looked on their website.  I think it was on a comparable one.   Let me dig.   Surely he had decent record at Castleton. 

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1 minute ago, Swayz said:

I wouldn't doubt it.  I should have looked on their website.  I think it was on a comparable one.   Let me dig.   Surely he had decent record at Castleton. 

Appears he took 5th at Regional in 2018 and then made Nationals going 0-2.   So I would keep him in this category for sure though.

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41 minutes ago, Swayz said:

Appears he took 5th at Regional in 2018 and then made Nationals going 0-2.   So I would keep him in this category for sure though.

Definitely fair to keep him in the category, I just knew he had a lot of matches.  Was D3 nationally ranked on several occasions I think, but bombed in the post-season.

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On 1/4/2020 at 5:45 PM, VakAttack said:

Mike Evans, mutli-time champ.
Anthony Valencia was the better Valencia.

I think my all-timer, though, was saying David Craig was going to be better then Jake Varner.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

Well, he did you one better and became James Bond!!!

 

image.jpeg.442f8fdaf11df331f16718246747a4a5.jpeg

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Some Wisconsin guys:

Ben Askren:  He was great in high school, but I did not think he'd win two Hodges and be a 4X Finalist.  Took his game to the next level in college.

Ringer/Jesse Thielke/Jake Sueflohn:  These guys were all in high school at similar weights at the same time and all were ranked #1 nationally at some point.  Everyone thought Thielke was going to be the best one of them all.  He beat Ringer in a dual meet.  Sueflohn handed Thielke his only HS loss, which Theilke later avenged.  Would not have guessed Ringer would go 3,1,1,1, win the Hodge, and have the only AA honors out of this group.

Garrett Lowney:  Was assuming he'd be a NC at Minny, despite being a tweener.

King Cole:  I was actually right about him, thought he'd be a stud and NC

Beau Breske:  Thought he would be at least a multi-time NQ and make at least one AA

Matt Hanutke:  Wisconsin's first 4X State Champ, but it was in the smallest school division at the smallest weight class; he didn't wrestle tough competiton.  Went on to be  a 4X AA at UW.

Edited by jchapman

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19 hours ago, AHamilton said:

Definitely fair to keep him in the category, I just knew he had a lot of matches.  Was D3 nationally ranked on several occasions I think, but bombed in the post-season.

Yeah,  I would have thought at DIII he woud have All-American  based on credentials from HS,  but college is a different beast. 

 

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