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Just now, nhs67 said:

Well... perspective: Gwiz didn't score a single point on him.  Wasn't even close.

Oh well perceptive in that sense, but still I dunno....
I think our pecking order realistically goes...
Gable
Gwiz.
some combination of
Parris, Nelson, Bradley, Cassar, is Rey still wrestling?

He could finish top 3 but I mean, If forced to pick I'm rolling Bradley into that 3 spot.
After Gwiz snagged back to back bronze, I thought we would slowly work our way to stardom here in the states.
But I am back to where a bronze wouldn't surprise me, but a finals appearance feels about as likely as a Greco medal... just I can't imagine it being real

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1 hour ago, nhs67 said:

We have an indication of how good he is.

He pinned Zare of Iran in the first.

The same Zare that techfalled Gwiz a few months later in the first period.

Has he participated in any tournaments since his stellar win at the Juniors?

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2 hours ago, spladle08 said:

He's a great wrestler, but that dump is only something you hit on people who aren't giving you credit for only having a dump.
No Doubt he is great, but just "not yet"

If you watch his other matches from worlds. You'll see that Parris scored in multiple ways. Not only using that dump. I feel hes more than a one trick pony and the dump is his bread and butter. He has what you cant teach and that's crazy athletic ability. Isnt it also true that hes relatively new to wrestling? Didnt he start wrestling in high school?

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If you watch his other matches from worlds. You'll see that Parris scored in multiple ways. Not only using that dump. I feel hes more than a one trick pony and the dump is his bread and butter. He has what you cant teach and that's crazy athletic ability. Isnt it also true that hes relatively new to wrestling? Didnt he start wrestling in high school?

See I dont know these details (great story if so) but to your dump caveat. Love me some Desanto these days, the whole package. But initially I was strong on the "this kids a one trick pony" wagon (when Micic called it out at nationals I thought, see, he reads my comments :) ) ...... now he is a complete wrestler and destroying people... feel similar but not the exact same about Parris.

Yes Parris is a wonderful wrestler, yes he heavily relied on that dump, yes he caught a superior wrestler who wasnt expecting it, yes he has supreme athletic ability.

I love Parris. But while he won that match he isnt there yet. Again.

To me Gable is our guy, Gwiz (was going to type "a close") a realistic distant 2nd....

Then a few guys all on the same level (close to Gwiz, a little further behind Gable)

 

If I'm wrong and Parris mows over everyone I'll be super happy, but as I see it, talent, size, athleticism. Etc... hes probably our 4.

 

And hes not consistently close to Zare, in my opinion, nothing to do with the pin

 

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In my opinion, the biggest difference between Zare and Perris is that Zare was given more chances after he got pinned, and he shined.

Perris has not been tested in Freestyle since he dominated the juniors.  All the theories about him not being ready are just that, theories.

He deserves to be tested and groomed.  If he is not ready, then fine.

He has far higher potential in the long term than Gwiz.  Gwiz has had multiple chances, and he may be a top 5-6 guy at best in the worlds.

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1 hour ago, irani said:

and has he been dominating in folkstyle?

 

 

At times.

A year ago, Michigan pulled his redshirt prior to Oregon State, and he went out and majored, or nearly majored, Amar Dhesi.  Unfortunately, that was probably the high point of his season, and he was a match away from placing at NCAAs.

IIRC, he got stuck under a lot of bigger guys, holding onto a leg, got flattened out, and gave up takedowns.  He shot constantly, and I'm not sure his tactics were suitable against NCAA heavyweights.

This year, however, he's undefeated, and although he hasn't wrestled any other top 5 guys, he's been pretty dominant.

Steveson would have been a great litmus test last weekend, but was apparently dinged up and didn't wrestle.

Personally, I think Parris may be our next great 125er.  Until last year, he'd been concentrating on football, and now that he's focused on wrestling, and in such a great room, with partners like Coon, I expect him to continue improving by leaps and bounds.

As an example, Cassiopi teched him at Fargo two years ago, and a year later, he's dominating Junior Worlds.

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Gwiz ceiling is silver with the right draw, bronze if Geno and Akgul are on opposite sides. They have been the best in the world for how many years now? No shame in not being able to dethrone either of them.

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Gwiz ceiling is silver with the right draw, bronze if Geno and Akgul are on opposite sides. They have been the best in the world for how many years now? No shame in not being able to dethrone either of them.
Ceiling but still unlikely . 0 percent if they are split and Silver still less than 30% if they are on same side hes probably in the 8 to 10 range if we wrestled the top 20 heavyweights to find a true ranking

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3 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Gwiz ceiling is silver with the right draw, bronze if Geno and Akgul are on opposite sides. They have been the best in the world for how many years now? No shame in not being able to dethrone either of them.

I think Hadi or Zare would be favored against Gwiz too, so silver or bronze would require a really good draw

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4 hours ago, spladle08 said:

See I dont know these details (great story if so) but to your dump caveat. Love me some Desanto these days, the whole package. But initially I was strong on the "this kids a one trick pony" wagon (when Micic called it out at nationals I thought, see, he reads my comments :) ) ...... now he is a complete wrestler and destroying people... feel similar but not the exact same about Parris.

Yes Parris is a wonderful wrestler, yes he heavily relied on that dump, yes he caught a superior wrestler who wasnt expecting it, yes he has supreme athletic ability.

I love Parris. But while he won that match he isnt there yet. Again.

To me Gable is our guy, Gwiz (was going to type "a close") a realistic distant 2nd....

Then a few guys all on the same level (close to Gwiz, a little further behind Gable)

 

If I'm wrong and Parris mows over everyone I'll be super happy, but as I see it, talent, size, athleticism. Etc... hes probably our 4.

 

And hes not consistently close to Zare, in my opinion, nothing to do with the pin

 

Dont quote me on what I said about him starting in high school. I'm not sure if that's the case, which is why I posed the question. However it has been said that until him committing to college wrestling he was focusing more on football as Mr. Whaletail has pointed out. Come trials time I believe his only competition will be Steveson, Bradley, Cassar and maybe Gwiz. As good a rep as gwiz has been I think his time his up. Bradley seems to have the athleticism and experience to keep up with the likes of Parris and Steveson. However at the end of the day I believe it will be the two young bucks standing in the finals. Kerk will also be a force but hes a bit undersized right now, imo.

Edited by BTC

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I don't think many people appreciate the strides Mason Parris has made since last season. Being so young, one year can make a big difference for a late maturing athlete. He has noticably put on a lot of size and muscle over last year.

My only hesitation is the demands of the college season butting up against the team trials. Even so, I'm picking him for our Tokyo rep.

 

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We’ll find out the pecking order for these young heavyweights over the course of a week in February:

Feb 8: Iowa-Michigan dual

Feb 15: Iowa-Minnesota dual

I personally think people are still sleeping on Cassioppi. Parris has looked great and clearly improved a lot over the past year, but so has Cassioppi. I’m talking Cass over Parris. I don’t know what Cass weighs but it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if he had to be mindful of what he eats in season to stay under 285. He was 260 when he showed up on Iowa’s campus 18 months ago and it wouldn’t surprise me at all if he’s 20+ pounds bigger today. I’ve heard Parris is 235-240 so we could be talking about a Cass being 40+ pounds heavier. 

Still taking Gable over Cass. 

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4 hours ago, MDogg said:

We’ll find out the pecking order for these young heavyweights over the course of a week in February:

Feb 8: Iowa-Michigan dual

Feb 15: Iowa-Minnesota dual

 

If the Minnesota Michigan dual is an example, we are more likely to see ducks. And not from Parris.

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This “duck” thing is getting as old as “LETS GOOO”.  I’m by NO means a Gable sympathizer or fan. But he was scheduled to compete in Rome. He pulled out and then didn’t compete all weekend for Minn (not just against Michigan). Is there any possibility in the minds for people calling “duck” that maybe he got injured?  I mean if he wasn’t scheduled to be in Rome, and wrestled the Friday and dominated, like he would have, then pulled out against Michigan....okay, I can see that. But come on people. 

Edited by Lurker

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11 hours ago, Lurker said:

This “duck” thing is getting as old as “LETS GOOO”.  I’m by NO means a Gable sympathizer or fan. But he was scheduled to compete in Rome. He pulled out and then didn’t compete all weekend for Minn (not just against Michigan). Is there any possibility in the minds for people calling “duck” that maybe he got injured?  I mean if he wasn’t scheduled to be in Rome, and wrestled the Friday and dominated, like he would have, then pulled out against Michigan....okay, I can see that. But come on people. 

The problem with your argument was that there seemed to be a number of people who knew he wasn't going to Rome, before the Wisconsin match, where he looked fine. 

It will all become settled at the BIG TEN tournament, but don't bet the farm on all those dual meet match-ups happen prior to that.

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For as tough and consistent as Thomas Gilman is, is there any indication that Lee is besting him at every turn? Gilman almost seems to be the antithesis of Lee personality-wise, so that might have something to do with the disdain he receives here on the board. I do not know the answer, so maybe someone close to the Hawks might have some info.

Also, what does anyone think Gilman meant when he said this last week (starting at 3:15, but specifically at 3:36)?

https://youtu.be/KBZpxTd8N1A

 

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6 minutes ago, Tofurky said:

For as tough and consistent as Thomas Gilman is, is there any indication that Lee is besting him at every turn? Gilman almost seems to be the antithesis of Lee personality-wise, so that might have something to do with the disdain he receives here on the board. I do not know the answer, so maybe someone close to the Hawks might have some info.

Also, what does anyone think Gilman meant when he said this last week (starting at 3:15, but specifically at 3:36)?

https://youtu.be/KBZpxTd8N1A

 

That was an interesting choice of words but JMO, I don’t think he really meant anything by it. Gilman’s had a lot of good things to say about Lee and his other lightweight teammates in the past.

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5 hours ago, 77again said:

The problem with your argument was that there seemed to be a number of people who knew he wasn't going to Rome, before the Wisconsin match, where he looked fine. 

It will all become settled at the BIG TEN tournament, but don't bet the farm on all those dual meet match-ups happen prior to that.

 Its not a problem with my argument because he still pulled out of a scheduled event that has nothing to do with NCAA seeds, then did not compete in a match that would not have effected his NCAA seed, in succession to not competing against Michigan.  If he had competed in this other two events, then okay I can see it maybe.  But he didn't, there has to be a reason why and I'm sure it wasn't an attempt to skip Michigan without getting themat.com forumn meatheads (thanks for the term @LJB) on his case.  But since Parris was one of those multiple scheduled matches he endeded up not competing in....it has to be a "duck", no other explanation possible?  

Like I said, its gotten as old as the stupid ass "LETS GOOOO"

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14 minutes ago, Tofurky said:

For as tough and consistent as Thomas Gilman is, is there any indication that Lee is besting him at every turn? Gilman almost seems to be the antithesis of Lee personality-wise, so that might have something to do with the disdain he receives here on the board. I do not know the answer, so maybe someone close to the Hawks might have some info.

Also, what does anyone think Gilman meant when he said this last week (starting at 3:15, but specifically at 3:36)?

https://youtu.be/KBZpxTd8N1A

 

I think he just means he feels he's going to have to beat Lee to make the team. Nothing more nothing less.  As @pamela said he has said nothing but good things about Lee (i.e. "you really want to get humbled, wrestle with Spencer Lee)

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24 minutes ago, Lurker said:

 If he had competed in this other two events, then okay I can see it maybe.  But he didn't, there has to be a reason why and I'm sure it wasn't an attempt to skip Michigan without getting themat.com forumn meatheads (thanks for the term @LJB) on his case.  But since Parris was one of those multiple scheduled matches he endeded up not competing in....it has to be a "duck", no other explanation possible?  

Like I said, its gotten as old as the stupid ass "LETS GOOOO"

Lurk, you absolutely used Rome as a justification for your injury argument in a previous post. Not worth discussing any more if you can't see that. One suggestion, if your going resort to name calling to defend you position, at least man up and own the name calling yourself instead of attributing it other posters. 

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