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Hodge Contenders

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On 1/31/2020 at 11:34 AM, headshuck said:

Tilt schmilt. Pin your guy. Weak Hodge candidates. Cancel it until next year or further risk it becoming just another MVP award.

Another MVP award?

There's already an award for most pins, and given the criteria and fan perception, the Hodge is a pretty good MVP stand-in.

The most dominant wrestler is, essentially, the most valuable.

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8 hours ago, Doc_Hfuhruhurr said:

I’d put Nick Lee on top of the list at this point. He’s been a hammer, wrestling with Retherford-ish intensity.  

If he beats Pletcher decisively this weekend, I'd probably agree.

 

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2 minutes ago, gobraves101905 said:

Zahid can win every match from here on out by one point. Fact is, if he gets title #3 this year with an undefeated season, he is the Hodge winner. Three timers don’t grow on trees. He will be rewarded for that. 

Lots of 3 timers in the past 20 years have not been Hodge winner.  Spencer also is going for number 3, what happens if he is also undefeated?

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12 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Lots of 3 timers in the past 20 years have not been Hodge winner.  Spencer also is going for number 3, what happens if he is also undefeated?

They give the advantage to the seniors. 
  
its Zahid’s to lose. I don’t literally think he wins if he doesnt bonus most of the remaining matches, but he almost certainly will, at least until ncaas. 
  
Spencer Lee has a much tougher schedule ahead of him. 
 

Pletcher, Nick Lee and Moore only have a chance if Zahid or Lee lose, or they bonus the rest of the year or something. Prior results matter and none of these guys have a title. 
  
One of Parris or Gable will be undefeated with high bonus rates this year too, but they are a bit young not win it with such a stacked field

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25 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Lots of 3 timers in the past 20 years have not been Hodge winner.  Spencer also is going for number 3, what happens if he is also undefeated?

The senior gets the advantage. It would also be Zahid’s second undefeated season and 4th conference title. 

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1 hour ago, Housebuye said:

They give the advantage to the seniors. 
  
its Zahid’s to lose. I don’t literally think he wins if he doesnt bonus most of the remaining matches, but he almost certainly will, at least until ncaas. 
  
Spencer Lee has a much tougher schedule ahead of him. 
 

Pletcher, Nick Lee and Moore only have a chance if Zahid or Lee lose, or they bonus the rest of the year or something. Prior results matter and none of these guys have a title. 
  
One of Parris or Gable will be undefeated with high bonus rates this year too, but they are a bit young not win it with such a stacked field

Listen, Zahid is great.  He might win the hodge and I will have no issue with that.  I’m just saying it’s no guarantee.  In the past 5 years we have had other 3 timers with 2 undefeated seasons not win the hodge.  
 

Who knows what the committee will deem most important this year.

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58 minutes ago, gobraves101905 said:

The senior gets the advantage. It would also be Zahid’s second undefeated season and 4th conference title. 

I don’t think the 4 conference titles will mean anything at all.  If it were Big Ten it would be more impressive but still mean very little.  2 undefeated seasons doesn’t guarantee anything either.  That happens a lot.

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10 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

I don’t think the 4 conference titles will mean anything at all.  If it were Big Ten it would be more impressive but still mean very little.  2 undefeated seasons doesn’t guarantee anything either.  That happens a lot.

Two undefeated seasons happens a lot?  Only Zahid Valencia, out of all undefeated wrestlers this year so far, has had an undefeated year.  In fact, he's the only one wrestling this year who has even *one* undefeated year in his career.

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Just now, klehner said:

Two undefeated seasons happens a lot?  Only Zahid Valencia, out of all undefeated wrestlers this year so far, has had an undefeated year.  In fact, he's the only one wrestling this year who has even *one* undefeated year in his career.

Just recently we have had many 3 timers with 2 undefeated seasons not win the hodge.  Probably 5 or more times in the 2000’s alone.

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38 minutes ago, klehner said:

Two undefeated seasons happens a lot?  Only Zahid Valencia, out of all undefeated wrestlers this year so far, has had an undefeated year.  In fact, he's the only one wrestling this year who has even *one* undefeated year in his career.

Haven't all the undefeated wrestlers this year so far had undefeated years? 

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37 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Just recently we have had many 3 timers with 2 undefeated seasons not win the hodge.  Probably 5 or more times in the 2000’s alone.

Okay, we've gone from "a lot" to "many."  Which wrestlers meet the criteria of 3x champion and two undefeated seasons?  How many of those didn't win the Hodge because someone else with equal or better qualifications won that year?

 

1 minute ago, TBar1977 said:

Haven't all the undefeated wrestlers this year so far had undefeated years? 

The year isn't over, but you knew that.

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15 minutes ago, klehner said:

Okay, we've gone from "a lot" to "many."  Which wrestlers meet the criteria of 3x champion and two undefeated seasons?  How many of those didn't win the Hodge because someone else with equal or better qualifications won that year?

 

The year isn't over, but you knew that.

Its not over for Zahid either. I posed my question thinking you actually meant to write something different than you wrote, such as your inclusion of the phrase "so far" and your omission of the word "prior". The way you wrote it was ambiguous. Not meant to jab so no need to get defensive.  

Edited by TBar1977

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2 hours ago, Mokoma said:

Lots of 3 timers in the past 20 years have not been Hodge winner.  Spencer also is going for number 3, what happens if he is also undefeated?

Zahid being a senior will get the nod over Lee. The logic will be that Lee will have his shot next year and that's how it's going to play out. Zahid wins this year for being 3-1-1-1 and Lee will win next year for going 1-1-1-1. 

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4 minutes ago, PSUMike said:

Zahid being a senior will get the nod over Lee. The logic will be that Lee will have his shot next year and that's how it's going to play out. Zahid wins this year for being 3-1-1-1 and Lee will win next year for going 1-1-1-1. 

Agree. Career will be rewarded if Zahid takes 184 weight class. 

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At this point, please specify which Lee is being discussed.  N Lee is 15/16 on bonus and riding a streak of 12 bonus point wins.  S Lee is 12/13 but has three blackmarks.  He  has a bonus point streak of 0 going, didn't complete Midlands and wrestles for Iowa.

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Just now, Plasmodium said:

At this point, please specify which Lee is being discussed.  N Lee is 15/16 on bonus and riding a streak of 12 bonus point wins.  S Lee is 12/13 but has three blackmarks.  He  has a bonus point streak of 0 going, didn't complete Midlands and wrestles for Iowa.

Nick can't be in the discussion. For as good as he looks, you're not going to put him in the same tier as 2 returning 2x champs. 

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2 hours ago, Housebuye said:

They give the advantage to the seniors. 
  
its Zahid’s to lose. I don’t literally think he wins if he doesnt bonus most of the remaining matches, but he almost certainly will, at least until ncaas. 
  
Spencer Lee has a much tougher schedule ahead of him. 
 

Pletcher, Nick Lee and Moore only have a chance if Zahid or Lee lose, or they bonus the rest of the year or something. Prior results matter and none of these guys have a title. 
  
One of Parris or Gable will be undefeated with high bonus rates this year too, but they are a bit young not win it with such a stacked field

I disagree.  If a freshman went undefeated with 25 pins he'd get the Hodge over a 3-time champ. That's the way it's supposed to work.

 

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24 minutes ago, klehner said:

Okay, we've gone from "a lot" to "many."  Which wrestlers meet the criteria of 3x champion and two undefeated seasons?  How many of those didn't win the Hodge because someone else with equal or better qualifications won that year?

 

The year isn't over, but you knew that.

I didn't realize a lot and many are mutually exclusive.  Just off the top of my head, recent 3 timers who haven't won the Hodge include Nolf, Snyder, Cox, Ruth, Jones, Rosholt, Steiber (although he did win it after his 4th).  Nolf, Snyder, Ruth and Jones all had 2 undefeated seasons I believe.  (Stieber also had 2 undefeated seasons, but he won Hodge as a senior).  

Like I have said before, Valencia is a good choice and if he wins it he will have earned it.  However, he won't win it just for being an undefeated 3 timer.

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I forgot about Dake, but he also won it as a senior.  Not sure how many undefeated seasons he had.  Was it 2?

Abas would also qualify, but I'm not sure how many undefeated seasons he had either.

 

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4 hours ago, Mokoma said:

I didn't realize a lot and many are mutually exclusive.  Just off the top of my head, recent 3 timers who haven't won the Hodge include Nolf, Snyder, Cox, Ruth, Jones, Rosholt, Steiber (although he did win it after his 4th).  Nolf, Snyder, Ruth and Jones all had 2 undefeated seasons I believe.  (Stieber also had 2 undefeated seasons, but he won Hodge as a senior).  

Like I have said before, Valencia is a good choice and if he wins it he will have earned it.  However, he won't win it just for being an undefeated 3 timer.

It’s a good thing the Penn State bias will not enter the equation this year. Stieber just further proves why Zahid would get the nod over Spencer. 

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