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Jimmy Cinnabon

Taking bets about PSU vs Wisconsin tonight

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6 hours ago, TBar1977 said:

He's probably going to post a link to proof of payment and when you click on the link he captures all of your data. You play chess, he plays cyber chess on steroids. That whole Cinnabon schtick is just to lure you in with the innocent pastry lovin screen name. 

You probably wouldn't bet against Penn St. on anything, would you?

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8 hours ago, HokieHWT said:

Pletcher

I am willing to make a small bet with you that Pletcher does not have a winning record over Lee this season.  And your side could be that Lee does not have a winning record over Pletcher. 

 

So if Pletcher is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, you win.  

If Lee is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, I win. 

If it's 1-1 then it's a push and neither of us win.   

They will probably meat up in the Big 10s, but who knows in the big tournament. 

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20 hours ago, shieldofpistis said:

I am willing to make a small bet with you that Pletcher does not have a winning record over Lee this season.  And your side could be that Lee does not have a winning record over Pletcher. 

 

So if Pletcher is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, you win.  

If Lee is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, I win. 

If it's 1-1 then it's a push and neither of us win.   

They will probably meat up in the Big 10s, but who knows in the big tournament. 

I'm not sure what "meating up" would look like, but I for one hope it doesn't happen

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On 2/8/2020 at 10:10 AM, jross said:

Looking closer, there should be zero near-fall points.  RBY is not on his elbows.  His shoulder or scapula or head are not touching the mat.  Never are both shoulders or both scapulae held within 4 inches of the mat for a 2 count.  The ref could have called anywhere from 0-4 points and folks would be scratching their heads.  From a distance, it looks like 2 or 4 NF.  A closer look seems like 0 NF to me.

Section 5. Near Fall
Art. 1. Near Fall Criteria. A near fall is a position in which the offensive wrestler has the opponent in a controlled pinning situation in which any one of the following three criteria are met:

  • a. The defensive wrestler is held in a high bridge or on both elbows;
  • b. Any part of one shoulder or scapula, or the head is touching the mat and the other shoulder or scapula is held at an angle of 45 degrees or less to the mat; or
  • c. Any part of both shoulders or both scapulae are held within four inches of the mat.

 

q7XA6G.gif

 

 

What does an official say about it?  Zero NF!

 

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On 2/9/2020 at 4:12 PM, shieldofpistis said:

I am willing to make a small bet with you that Pletcher does not have a winning record over Lee this season.  And your side could be that Lee does not have a winning record over Pletcher. 

 

So if Pletcher is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, you win.  

If Lee is 1-0, 2-0, 3-0, or 2-1, I win. 

If it's 1-1 then it's a push and neither of us win.   

They will probably meat up in the Big 10s, but who knows in the big tournament. 

Cool I’m good for $20

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9 minutes ago, jross said:

 

What does an official say about it?  Zero NF!

 

How the heck can you make a definitive statement like that?  Did he have a digital measuring tape to ensure it wasn’t 4”?

And if the official “realized the shoulders were too high and stopped counting,” then why did he count another 2 after that?

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2 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

How the heck can you make a definitive statement like that?  Did he have a digital measuring tape to ensure it wasn’t 4”?

And if the official “realized the shoulders were too high and stopped counting,” then why did he count another 2 after that?

Relational to body size in the video, it is clear that RBY's shoulders are higher than 4 inches.  RBY's right shoulder is on Seth's chest.  It's actually tilted to <12 inches high.  RBY's left arm is nearly fully extended the entire time and certainly is higher than Seth's chest.  I called my seven year old son over just now.  He is average sized for his age (48in. tall, 56lbs).  His forearm alone is 8 inches long and his chest is at least 5 inches deep.  I trust that Seth's chest is deeper than 4 inches and RBY's left arm is at least 2.5 feet long.  Normally a spladle has the defender's shoulders flat to the mat.  It is rare to see good wrestlers put in a spladle and rarer to see someone escape one. Seth hit it a little different than normal.  From their feet, Seth's chest was positionally low on RBY's back and Seth went on the outside of the leg rather than the inside.  It worked but it did not put Ruby in a seriously dangerous position. 

During the match, the bird's eye camera view and my instinct told me it was 4 points.  Watching the replay live, my spladle experience told me it had to at least be 2pts but not 4pts based on the ref's body language and hand counts.  Watching the replay again in relation to the rules has me thinking it was 0 points.  The position was weird and the live action was fast.  I'm not sure what replay angle the ref saw and he was forced to make a judgement call under pressure.  The called action was 2pts.  Seth's coach wanted 4pts.  I believe it is 0pts.  Keeping the 2pt ruling was the safe choice.  

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26 minutes ago, jross said:

Relational to body size in the video, it is clear that RBY's shoulders are higher than 4 inches.  RBY's right shoulder is on Seth's chest.  It's actually tilted to <12 inches high.  RBY's left arm is nearly fully extended the entire time and certainly is higher than Seth's chest.  I called my seven year old son over just now.  He is average sized for his age (48in. tall, 56lbs).  His forearm alone is 8 inches long and his chest is at least 5 inches deep.  I trust that Seth's chest is deeper than 4 inches and RBY's left arm is at least 2.5 feet long.  Normally a spladle has the defender's shoulders flat to the mat.  It is rare to see good wrestlers put in a spladle and rarer to see someone escape one. Seth hit it a little different than normal.  From their feet, Seth's chest was positionally low on RBY's back and Seth went on the outside of the leg rather than the inside.  It worked but it did not put Ruby in a seriously dangerous position. 

During the match, the bird's eye camera view and my instinct told me it was 4 points.  Watching the replay live, my spladle experience told me it had to at least be 2pts but not 4pts based on the ref's body language and hand counts.  Watching the replay again in relation to the rules has me thinking it was 0 points.  The position was weird and the live action was fast.  I'm not sure what replay angle the ref saw and he was forced to make a judgement call under pressure.  The called action was 2pts.  Seth's coach wanted 4pts.  I believe it is 0pts.  Keeping the 2pt ruling was the safe choice.  

What GockeS said. 

You also didn’t answer my second question (this is more questioning Rotundo’s explanation than you).

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37 minutes ago, GockeS said:

you do realize the scapula extend well down below the tops of the shoulders... 

Yes but not to someone's buttocks.  It looks like lower mid back exposure and lower scapula is higher than 4 inches.  RBY's upper back, including the nuance detail of the entire scapula and shoulders are high off the mat.  

Edited by jross

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2 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

So then Rotundo was wrong about what he thought happened

I guess we'd have to ask him.  The way I interpret Rotundo's message is that the ref made the mistake twice before realizing the shoulders were too high.  RBY's shoulders might have been even higher for the second two count!

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21 minutes ago, jross said:

I guess we'd have to ask him.  The way I interpret Rotundo's message is that the ref made the mistake twice before realizing the shoulders were too high.  RBY's shoulders might have been even higher for the second two count!

Ok maybe I misunderstood the tweet. I read “second count” as “second second,” but maybe he meant “second set of 2 seconds.”

Regardless, asking 1 official (who? an NCAA D1 official? Middle school?) doesn’t really mean anything.  I’m sure several officials could have varying opinions on it.

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