So is Darmstadt a contender now?

[hammerlockthree 2,637]

Goes 84 and doesn't seem like himself, moves up to 97 and gets hurt immediatly...then dominates Brucki.

Is this a Brucki thing? Who besides Moore could be called a heavy favorite again him? Pretty drastic turnaround. 

[red blades 367]

Short answer is yes, he's a contender; but don't sleep on Noah Adams, he's been on a roll all year.

[ugarte 526]

1 minute ago, red blades said:

Short answer is yes, he's a contender; but don't sleep on Noah Adams, he's been on a roll all year.

Adams as a pinning machine scares me more than Kollin Moore tbh. It's going to be a good tournament.

[treep2000 1,152]

So long as Darmy is opposite Moore in the bracket, I'm cool.  Darmy could upset Moore... easily methinks.  

I think Noah Adams doesn't stand a chance against Moore (but then again, neither did Conel... and then THAT happened).

[Perry 1,429]

Bruck is grossly overrated

[steamboat_charlie v2 1,175]

10 minutes ago, Perry said:

Bruck is grossly overrated

He's not my favorite... but grossly overrated?  He's 48-6 over the last two seasons.  Five of those losses to AA's, and the other earlier this season to Brunner. 

I'd say a win over him, especially one this dominant, does mean something.  

[Antitroll2828 1,008]

26 minutes ago, treep2000 said:

So long as Darmy is opposite Moore in the bracket, I'm cool.  Darmy could upset Moore... easily methinks.  

I think Noah Adams doesn't stand a chance against Moore (but then again, neither did Conel... and then THAT happened).

I felt the same way but when they wrestled at ncaa two years ago Moore controlled every part of the match and it just seemed like a match up nightmare for Darmstadt

[Gantry 1,872]

Darmstadt like all amazing riders is going to have some good guys who he's going to crush while others will be headscratching scores in the other direction.  Come tournament time, there is almost always that one guy you can't ride though, so the key will be his neutral game against the elite of the elite. 

[hammerlockthree 2,637]

I think someone is gonna knock off Moore. He produces his fair share of head scratching.

[Mphillips 1,810]

He's 9-1 at 197.  The loss was an INJ.  He was 13-4 at 184 and has 12 pins.  He's a returning AA from 2018 where he went 34-4.

I believe he has to be considered...

 

[klehner 755]

33 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

I felt the same way but when they wrestled at ncaa two years ago Moore controlled every part of the match and it just seemed like a match up nightmare for Darmstadt

This was when Darmstadt was wrestling with a fractured vertebra, right?

[Mphillips 1,810]

I don't believe Darmstadt wasn't healthy any of 2018.

[ugarte 526]

1 hour ago, Antitroll2828 said:

I felt the same way but when they wrestled at ncaa two years ago Moore controlled every part of the match and it just seemed like a match up nightmare for Darmstadt

i have no idea what to take away from the 2018 NCAAs. After getting to semis Darmstadt went LBF (Haught); 7-4 L (Moore - and I think maybe all his points were escapes?*); LBF (Holschlag) ... and then back surgery and a one year hiatus. No idea when the injury happened but he was just ... different for the rest of the tournament in 2018 after Haught caught him and stuck him. The 5th place match against Holschlag was over in a minute.

* this was also at a point in the season when anyone watching film on Darmstadt wasn't trying to ride him because he got so many reversals to back points and falls 

Edited February 10, 2020 by ugarte

[klehner 755]

33 minutes ago, Mphillips said:

I don't believe Darmstadt wasn't healthy any of 2018.

Believe differently.

Quote

 

Darmstadt told The Sun he fractured his L5 vertebrae during the course of the season last year and the recovery has not been fast enough to get him ready for the upcoming season.

“I wrestled with it. I didn’t know I had the fracture until after nationals,” said Darmstadt, who, finished sixth in his first go-around at NCAAs last season at 197. “I tried to take off some time this summer but I’m not ready to compete yet, for sure. So I’ve just got to let it heal.”

“I felt it pretty much every day in the practice room, I just thought it was back pain,” Darmstadt said. “There were definitely moments at nationals and just throughout the season where I had the fracture and it affected me.”

 

As good as he was his freshman year, he looks better this year at 197.

[Mphillips 1,810]

6 minutes ago, klehner said:

Believe differently.

As good as he was his freshman year, he looks better this year at 197.

My bad.  I know he was injured.  I meant to write that I don't believe he was healthy all of 2018.  

[Antitroll2828 1,008]

30 minutes ago, ugarte said:

i have no idea what to take away from the 2018 NCAAs. After getting to semis Darmstadt went LBF (Haught); 7-4 L (Moore - and I think maybe all his points were escapes?*); LBF (Holschlag) ... and then back surgery and a one year hiatus. No idea when the injury happened but he was just ... different for the rest of the tournament in 2018 after Haught caught him and stuck him. The 5th place match against Holschlag was over in a minute.

* this was also at a point in the season when anyone watching film on Darmstadt wasn't trying to ride him because he got so many reversals to back points and falls 

Darmstadt had 2 escapes and a reversal immediately following at takedown all in the first period, it was 6-4 after 1 and neither guy did much after.... Moore typically doesn’t try very hard on top against top level guys, I just meant in the fact Moore finished clean against Darmstadt and I believe the Flo guys mentioned they wrestled each other back in Ohio growing up and Moore kind of has the big brother thing with Darmstadt..I’m not knocking Darmstadt, he can literally pin anyone from any position if he catches you sleeping but I just think Moore has a great style for beating him. 

[ugarte 526]

13 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Darmstadt had 2 escapes and a reversal immediately following at takedown all in the first period, it was 6-4 after 1 and neither guy did much after.... Moore typically doesn’t try very hard on top against top level guys, I just meant in the fact Moore finished clean against Darmstadt and I believe the Flo guys mentioned they wrestled each other back in Ohio growing up and Moore kind of has the big brother thing with Darmstadt..I’m not knocking Darmstadt, he can literally pin anyone from any position if he catches you sleeping but I just think Moore has a great style for beating him. 

he definitely might! i am not predicting anything against moore or adams. i felt good about beating brucki, though, health permitting and he definitely wasn't showing any sign of injury yesterday. prior to the dual koll said that darmstadt could have wrestled two weeks ago against brown/harvard if it was necessary, so i wasn't too concerned.

darmstadt did give up his legs a lot as a freshman to be honest, but he was so good on top and bottom that he got away with it until NCAAs with only an early season loss and scares against Brucki (Princeton dual) and Weiler (EIWA SF and NCAA QF). Brucki started the trend of not trying to ride and getting multiple takedowns but once Darmstadt controlled him, he got backs.

Edited February 10, 2020 by ugarte

[TBar1977 4,602]

Moore is a big favorite at 197 imo, but Darmstadt definitely is a contender. 

Edited February 11, 2020 by TBar1977

[Aviator12 208]

Moore has owned Darmstadt too, ever since high school. 

[Mohammer 65]

Darmstadt is a freak, don’t know if he beats Moore this year but guarantee he will make Adams look silly.  Adams highly overrated 

[Mphillips 1,810]

He's won 56 matches and is an AA and we still haven't seen him healthy for a full year...  

[ConnorsDad 596]

Man, how could he not be? IMO, Darmstadt has never looked better. Not only did Brucki choose neutral but BD chose top in the 3rd.

Also, I just don't get the Kollin Moore has some bonehead matches or headscratchers that a lot of people bring up here. I would say less than. He was the number three seed as a freshman and finished third only losing to numbers one and two the entire year. As a sophomore, he lost to Connel twice at the NCAA's but other than that he only lost to Cassar who I thought should have been the starter and the national champion Macchiavello. Last year he only lost to Bo in which there's no shame. I went back and looked and of all his matches in college that he won there were only 6, Woodley this year, Erich Schultz twice & Studebaker, McLaughlin & Robertson in which a late takedown would have won the match for his opponent. Out of 113 wins or so that's pretty good. He's finished his seed twice at NCAA's and on the one time he didn't he finished fourth. Now I will say I think Darmstadt is definitely very live and I wouldn't call it much of an upset at least in folkstyle.

 

Edited February 11, 2020 by ConnorsDad

[ConnorsDad 596]

If I had to choose I would still take Moore. He's beaten Darmstadt although I've not seen that match and the only other match I have seen where he faced somebody really good on top was last year against Weigel and he had no issues at all bottom and absolutely destroyed him.

[klehner 755]

31 minutes ago, Mphillips said:

He's won 56 matches and is an AA and we still haven't seen him healthy for a full year...  

He also has 30 career pins, good for 9th all-time at Cornell (ahead of Garrett, Realbuto, and Travis Lee).

[uncle bernard 1,124]

FWIW, Moore has beaten Darmstadt convincingly going back to high school (a tech fall I believe). I think Moore is a tough stylistic match up for him. However, Darmstadt is dangerous enough to never be counted out. I do think he's probably the second best guy when healthy and firing on all cylinders.