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cjc007

Saduleav cradled and exposed at Euro's.

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I dislike the current fall protocall.   May as well get a notary in there too as a third party to make sure it's really official... 

But seriously, the main reason I dislike it is there's been a few instances where a guy is almost unconscious flat on his back & the official has to take the time to pause & look at the chairman to get confirmation that it's actually a fall.  

 

From the international rules:

The fall observed by the referee will be valid if confirmed by the mat chairman. If the referee does not indicate the fall, and if the fall is valid, it may be announced with the consent of the judge and mat chairman. Consequently, to be observed and recognised, the fall must be clearly maintained. The two shoulders of the wrestler in question must be simultaneously touching the mat during the short period of stoppage specified in the first paragraph, even in the case of a standing rear body lock and lift. In all cases, the referee will strike the mat only after he has obtained confirmation from the judge or, failing this, from the mat chairman. The referee will then blow his whistle in order to end the bout. It will not be possible to request any challenge in case of a fall, being understood that the fall must be validated by the mat chairman following the judge or the referee’s decision.

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On 2/15/2020 at 4:03 PM, AnklePicker said:

This might be the dumbest thing in freestyle. A ref looking at a pin has to confirm it with some dude with no angle sitting behind a table. Am I missing something here. Why is this a thing?

No clue, amigo. It could be that that FILA/UWW recognizes that they do employ some seriously scummy refs, and this is a checks and balances system. I don't know.

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22 hours ago, AZ_wrestling said:

I don’t think his biggest threat is coming from an American this year. 

he has beaten Snyder,  Odikadze of Georgia and Sharifov of Azerbaijan fairly recently. Cox or Mohammadian of Iran could challenge him. 

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What you see happening to Sadulaev is what happened to Snyder:  people are game-planning him.  Sads is so good he is still able to come out on top, even though the margins of victory are getting smaller.  I am sure the Russian staff is picking apart all his Euro bouts (the reason he went to a meet like this) and will make appropriate adjustments.  This is something we have lagged in.

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1 hour ago, Coach_J said:

What you see happening to Sadulaev is what happened to Snyder:  people are game-planning him.  Sads is so good he is still able to come out on top, even though the margins of victory are getting smaller.  I am sure the Russian staff is picking apart all his Euro bouts (the reason he went to a meet like this) and will make appropriate adjustments.  This is something we have lagged in.

I agree. In defense of the US coaches and RTC coaches, though, Snyder is more limited than Sadulaev, so there is only so much adjusting he can do. At the end of the day, Snyder’s advantage is most pronounced in a dog fight, so any high probability strategy has to involve pushing the pace for a sustained amount of time at some point in the match. Sadulaev has more ways to position himself for the win,

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8 hours ago, whaletail said:

How does the mat chairman have a better view than the ref, or even much of a view at all?

There’s no blanket answer for that question to cover every fall that’s ever taken place in international wrestling. But to try and answer, the confirmation can come from the judge or chairman. And it doesn’t mean that either has a better view than the ref each time. What it does is get a confirmation from another official whose line of sight is a different angle than the ref. 
I just don’t see where we can have a problem with getting a fall confirmed. Regardless of which one it is and which side, isn’t having someone confirming the fall better than just one person deciding?

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8 hours ago, whaletail said:

How does the mat chairman have a better view than the ref, or even much of a view at all?

A. Perspective.

B. Generally the most experienced official is here. He can keep his focus on the bigger picture.

I officiated international for a number of years mostly in my 20s and 30s. I preferred on the mat as long as the chair had my back. However, you learn how to see more than you think from the chair.

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14 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Better yet, has a mat slap ever been over ruled?

An actual slap? Probably in lower level if the chair knows it was wrong for some reason. What happens more often is for the chair to deny the call. 

For the most part, a denial means the chair is pretty sure it isn't one. Chair will agree if he thinks it probably was a good call.

At the actual international level, things can get more complicated with possibly 3 different languages going on in the crew (and 3 different national interpretations and 3 different egos).

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34 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

An actual slap? Probably in lower level if the chair knows it was wrong for some reason. What happens more often is for the chair to deny the call. 

For the most part, a denial means the chair is pretty sure it isn't one. Chair will agree if he thinks it probably was a good call.

At the actual international level, things can get more complicated with possibly 3 different languages going on in the crew (and 3 different national interpretations and 3 different egos).

Thanks. 

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On 2/14/2020 at 2:20 PM, Crotalus said:

I can't help but think of the guy that Mark Hall pinned in a tilt last week. A fraction of the fight that Sadulaev had here is all it would have taken to not get pinned.

I saw that one! Totally agree.

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On 2/17/2020 at 10:54 AM, Lurker said:

I don’t know...it’s a match ending situation. I don’t mind it being confirmed. 

In a certain sense it's like someone locking up a leg lace and hitting four in a row, game over. It's the way it goes.

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