Fantasy Matchup - Spencer Lee vs Yojiro Uetake

[Iscored2onu 36]

David Taylor was undefeated in fantasy matchups against Kyle Dake, but couldn't quite get it done during the real matches.  On that note, how do you feel today's version of Spencer Lee would fair against someone like the college version of Yojiro Uetake?  I admittedly don't have a lot of knowledge on Uetake's style.  I do know he was 3x National Champion and undefeated in college and won gold in the '64 and '68 olympics.   Many say he was never really challenged in college, so I am curious how many feel that would translate to today's competition.  

Obviously Lee has lost in college multiple times, but many still consider him a generational talent and someone that will be a force internationally.  Asking 77 year old Uetake to participate in a match now wouldn't make much sense :) so let's hear it.  I'm really interested in hearing from some of our old timers that maybe followed wrestling back then.  

We know YoJo was 57-0 with 11 falls, so he wasn't really a prolific pinner.  He was quick on his feet and had a very square stance.  Here's his '64 College Finals match which he won 5-2.  I am of the belief that the sport has evolved so much in regards to strength, conditioning and nutrition that today's crop of wrestlers are probably a higher level OVERALL (top to bottom).  It's also not fair to compare that only.  Given the same training and overall health options, I am guessing Uetake may have been even better too.  These fantasy matchups are always fun, albeit not right or wrong and solely based on opinion.  This one is even more difficult based on the limited Uetake knowledge that many may have, myself included.  

 

[HurricaneWrestling2 867]

 

 

Good question, Iscored2onu.  I think that, even at 77, I take young Lee 4 out of 5 times.  I have old school Cowboy style, much stronger than Iowa style used by evil Brands twins.

[HurricaneWrestling2 867]

Iscored2onu,

You may have already seen this article, but if not, it's an interesting read:

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2019-09-23/all-time-dream-college-wrestling-matchups-every-weight

[TobusRex 2,107]

Uetake by as much as he wants. Probably 6-2, 5-1, something deceptively close. Spencer is special, but Uetake was a WC before his Jr year in college.

[HurricaneWrestling2 867]

After winning his first NCAA title as a sophomore at Oklahoma State (freshman ineligible during that era) , Uetake defeated four time world champion Huseyin Akbas of Turkey to win his first Olympic gold medal in 1964. Four years later in Mexico City, Uetake separated his shoulder in his final match while trailing 2-0. Despite the injury he came back to earn a 2-2 tie that was enough to win his second gold medal.

Above write-up taken from a theopenmat.com article titled "The Top 10 Men’s Freestyle Wrestling Olympians" (with my correction to when Yojo won his first NCAA title).

Edited February 23, 2020 by HurricaneWrestling2
to avoid being arrested by the dreaded Grammar Police

[Dondante88 29]

2 hours ago, TobusRex said:

Uetake by as much as he wants. Probably 6-2, 5-1, something deceptively close. Spencer is special, but Uetake was a WC before his Jr year in college.

Uetake was a 21 year old sophomore at Okie State and was 21 years and 10 months when he won his first WC/Olympic gold. If Spencer qualifies for Tokyo this summer, he will be almost the same age (21 years and 9 months)

[RavishingRickRude 15]

I feel like the bigger question is if we can compare a mid-60’s wrestler to current day. Do we feel they are on the same athletic level? Honest question. 

[TobusRex 2,107]

9 minutes ago, Dondante88 said:

Uetake was a 21 year old sophomore at Okie State and was 21 years and 10 months when he won his first WC/Olympic gold. If Spencer qualifies for Tokyo this summer, he will be almost the same age (21 years and 9 months)

So you are saying a 21 year old Uetake would be beating a 21 year old Lee?

[Mokoma 324]

I think Lee would win via tech.  

[Dondante88 29]

8 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

So you are saying a 21 year old Uetake would be beating a 21 year old Lee?

No, you said, "Spencer is special, but Uetake was a WC before his Jr year in college." I am just saying that if Spencer were to win in Tokyo this summer, he would be the same age Uetake was when he won his first WC, so the year they were each in school would be irrelevant

[TobusRex 2,107]

3 minutes ago, Dondante88 said:

No, you said, "Spencer is special, but Uetake was a WC before his Jr year in college." I am just saying that if Spencer were to win in Tokyo this summer, he would be the same age Uetake was when he won his first WC, so the year they were each in school would be irrelevant

Oh. I get it. I've got the flu, falling behind in some of the chatter around here. 

[TobusRex 2,107]

7 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

I think Lee would win via tech.  

LOL....uh huh, he'd tech Uetake. Do you know anything, AT ALL, about Uetake? 

[Mokoma 324]

5 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

LOL....uh huh, he'd tech Uetake. Do you know anything, AT ALL, about Uetake? 

Enough to know Spencer would tilt the crap out of him.

[TobusRex 2,107]

2 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Enough to know Spencer would tilt the crap out of him.

I'll take that as a "I don't know **** about college wrestling history" type answer. 

[Mokoma 324]

10 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

I'll take that as a "I don't know **** about college wrestling history" type answer. 

Have you watched him wrestle?  His technique (and everyone else’s 60 years ago) is atrocious.  He stands flat footed, has no motion, elbows out and gives up inside position from neutral.  Mat wrestling is basically sliding around on their knees and hanging on to a leg, or drapes over the arms.  They’re pretty awful and look like a first year junior high wrestler. 
 

Spencer would rag doll him in under 2 minutes.  

[RichB 226]

Reporter "How do you think you would fare against modern pitchers?"

Ty Cobb. "I would hit about .270"

Reporter ~"But you had 4300 hits, A lifetime batting average of .380. Why do you think you would only hit .270"

Cobb. "I am 78 years old"

------------------------------------

More seriously, When YU wrestled the weights were 115-123-130, he was at 130.

Lee would have likely been at 115, Desanto 123. Remember the wgt cutting rules were different..

Could he have jumped two weights and beat an Olympic Gold Medalists 

 

[Housebuye 2,419]

3 hours ago, TobusRex said:

Uetake by as much as he wants. Probably 6-2, 5-1, something deceptively close. Spencer is special, but Uetake was a WC before his Jr year in college.

True, but wrestlers are way better now. 
  
Uetake probably would be a world champ today if he trained in today’s environment. 

[Force118 150]

3 hours ago, Mokoma said:

Have you watched him wrestle?  His technique (and everyone else’s 60 years ago) is atrocious.  He stands flat footed, has no motion, elbows out and gives up inside position from neutral.  Mat wrestling is basically sliding around on their knees and hanging on to a leg, or drapes over the arms.  They’re pretty awful and look like a first year junior high wrestler. 
 

Spencer would rag doll him in under 2 minutes.  

Yes and Yianni would crush Dan Gable.......

Edited: comparing skill levels only-

Lee would beat Uetake and Yianni would cruise over Gable. The scrambling ability alone of guys today would give anyone pre askren fits

 

 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Force118

[Mokoma 324]

2 minutes ago, Force118 said:

Yes and Yianni would crush Dan Gable.......

lol

Agreed.  

[Iscored2onu 36]

1 hour ago, Dondante88 said:

Uetake was a 21 year old sophomore at Okie State and was 21 years and 10 months when he won his first WC/Olympic gold. If Spencer qualifies for Tokyo this summer, he will be almost the same age (21 years and 9 months)

Interesting.  The plot thickens!

[RichB 226]

If you brought YU forward in time from April 1,  1966 to March 1 2020 and told him he was competing against Lee March 2, 2020 he might lose. == and he might not, Tell him bout is march 1, 2021, and let him train modern rules and techniques for a year, Lee has no chance

 

[HurricaneWrestling2 867]

18 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

Have you watched him wrestle?  His technique (and everyone else’s 60 years ago) is atrocious.  He stands flat footed, has no motion, elbows out and gives up inside position from neutral.  Mat wrestling is basically sliding around on their knees and hanging on to a leg, or drapes over the arms.  They’re pretty awful and look like a first year junior high wrestler. 

They only appear that way because those old black and white films have deteriorated over the years and no longer accurately show the athletic prowess of guys from 60 years ago.  Actually, they were much better than today's stars.  Just ask any of us old guys who were around then.

[Mokoma 324]

20 minutes ago, HurricaneWrestling2 said:

They only appear that way because those old black and white films have deteriorated over the years and no longer accurately show the athletic prowess of guys from 60 years ago.  Actually, they were much better than today's stars.  Just ask any of us old guys who were around then.

Haha, my dad (who wrestled for Slippery Rock during the Gable years), is always flabbergasted when I show him videos of wrestling from back then.  He just can’t believe how bad and sloppy even the stars were.

Anyone who thinks Uetake could beat Spencer, or even keep it close, are just crazy.

[fadzaev2 545]

Yoshiro Fujita was another Oklahoma State great who would be a good fanatsy matchup for Lee.

[gimpeltf 2,045]

Just now, fadzaev2 said:

Yoshiro Fujita was another Oklahoma State great who would be a good fanatsy matchup for Lee.

 They both have bum knees too!