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Nevills out Kirk in?

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22 minutes ago, Boompa said:

It is a bum move pulling a kid's shirt his true freshman year, give him a handful of matches to not have him compete in the postseason.

I can't say elsewhere but with PA kids, PSU's reputation is faltering.

You act like the whole situation is a mystery to Nevills, like the guy is practicing with Kerk everyday, he obviously knows the guys trying to get eligible. Nevills 100 percent knew he would have to wrestle off kerk if he got his waiver. 
 
PSU reputation is falling so hard in the PA I bet Starocci, Bartlett, beard  are all really in the transfer portal now , it’s like a mass exodus over there, guys are just so upset that a coach might put the guy that wins the wrestle off out there...What a tragedy, maybe we can get congress to step in and intervene 

Edited by Antitroll2828

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4 minutes ago, cjc007 said:

Good point.

The Suriano situation didn't happen in late February, it was resolved before the season started if my memory is correct.

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They both transferred 1st semester...suriano just transferred the first week , Kerk transferred towards the end, seems like a big difference to us but as far as the NCAA is concerned wrestling is a 2 semester sport and they both left 1 st semester....also I believe the surianos hired a lawyer to help them and to speed up the process from the start 

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14 minutes ago, Marcus Cisero said:

I always felt bad for the former 3x - or was it 4x,  Solanco HS wrestler when we learned he was no longer in Penn States plans.  Who knows how the move over to Lock Haven affected his mindset / performance. A lot of us who watched him locally expected much more from him at the collegiate level.

As for Nevills, yea he's getting screwed.

If Nevills can beat Kirk but then sits hes being screwed. Otherwise hes not.

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You act like the whole situation is a mystery to Nevills, like the guy is practicing with Kerk everyday, he obviously knows the guys trying to get eligible. Nevills 100 percent knew he would have to wrestle off kerk if he got his waiver. 
 
PSU reputation is falling so hard in the PA I bet Starocci, Bartlett, beard  are all really in the transfer portal now , it’s like a mass exodus over there, guys are just so upset that a coach might put the guy that wins the wrestle off out there...What a tragedy, maybe we can get congress to step in and intervene 
Nevliss had no idea that Kerk would transfer in after the season had started.


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1 minute ago, cjc007 said:

Nevliss had no idea that Kerk would transfer in after the season had started.


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He also had no idea he would be in the lineup until after the Olympic qualifier.  So they pulled his redshirt this year...okay, he still has it available then. 

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2 minutes ago, cjc007 said:

Nevliss had no idea that Kerk would transfer in after the season had started.


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Nevills shirt wasn’t pulled until after kerk transferred in, and I’m sure it was known what the plan for kerk was the second he stepped on campus 

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Nevills shirt wasn’t pulled until after kerk transferred in, and I’m sure it was known what the plan for kerk was the second he stepped on campus 
What is his plan? To get immediately eligibility even though he shouldn't be granted his wish per big ten guidelines. Is he special, above the rules?

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7 minutes ago, cjc007 said:

Good point. The Suriano situation didn't happen in late February, it was resolved before the season started if my memory is correct.  

If the NCAA allows Kerk to be eligible, everyone would be eligible to transfer at any time while retaining athletic eligiblity.

 

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This is a good point of differentiation.  I'm very pro letting wrestlers compete and not restricting their ability to transfer and compete.  This one feels weird because it's just suddenly happening right before the postseason.  It's the "logical extreme" that people often would use to mock the debate that wrestlers should be allowed to transfer, and that many on the other side would say "yeah, but what i the likelihood of that happening?"  The look is also exacerbated by the nomadic state of Kerk's collegiate experience thusfar.  In the end,, I support it, but man, Kerk makes it tough.

The collateral stuff about Nevills' feels bad, though.

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1 minute ago, cjc007 said:

What is his plan? To get immediately eligibility even though he shouldn't be granted his wish per big ten guidelines. Is he special, above the rules?

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Suriano transferred and wrestled immediately...micic transferred from Illinois to Michigan and lost no eligibility, the rules are not what they used to be. Pete lipari wrestled for Rutgers in December, then for rider in January, and then wrestles Rutgers in a dual in February. Your on here claiming he’s breaking rules that don’t exist anymore 

why all the hate over a 19 year old kid just trying to do what he’s worked really damn hard his whole life for? 

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I find it interesting how some posters seem to have Stockholm Syndrome on these transfers.

For decades the common complaint was that the NCAA was all powerful, corrupt, anti-athlete, self-aggrandizing, all about the money, etc. But now that they have begun to move in the direction of treating athletes like people (anyone who transfers from one school to another does not have to sit out classes) some begin to refer to the old way as the way things should be. All of a sound the monolithic organization becomes more sympathetic than the individual.

Personally, I think everyone needs to do what is in their best interest. If you want loyalty you need to offer something to engender loyalty rather than enforce it by rule.

And yet I would still feel bad for the Nevills.

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Suriano transferred and wrestled immediately...micic transferred from Illinois to Michigan and lost no eligibility, the rules are not what they used to be. Pete lipari wrestled for Rutgers in December, then for rider in January, and then wrestles Rutgers in a dual in February. Your on here claiming he’s breaking rules that don’t exist anymore 
why all the hate over a 19 year old kid just trying to do what he’s worked really damn hard his whole life for? 
Micic wrestled in Illinois, not at Illinois. He actually wrestled for Northwestern. The coach Parisno was fired and Micic transferred to Northwestern.

I'm not hating on Kerk. I'm just trying to understand the logic in giving eligibility in late February. He should have fought for immediate eligibility if he was planning for State Penn this season.

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4 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

This is a good point of differentiation.  I'm very pro letting wrestlers compete and not restricting their ability to transfer and compete.  This one feels weird because it's just suddenly happening right before the postseason.  It's the "logical extreme" that people often would use to mock the debate that wrestlers should be allowed to transfer, and that many on the other side would say "yeah, but what i the likelihood of that happening?"  The look is also exacerbated by the nomadic state of Kerk's collegiate experience thusfar.  In the end,, I support it, but man, Kerk makes it tough.

The collateral stuff about Nevills' feels bad, though.

I get it’s a bad look because he committed to like 9 different places before settling on penn state but IMO I thought it was great suriano was eligible right away and that they’ve stopped stealing years from athletes because they felt the needed to transfer and I feel no different about the Kerk situation. The guy has worked hard his whole life , apparently he’s where he feels comfortable now, so I’m all for letting him wrestle, and honestly if he were trying to get eligible for say lock haven or Pitt I don’t think anyone would care, it’s just the team race factor I believe that has everyone salty about it, but I’m all for anything that makes the team race close and the NCAAs more interesting 

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39 minutes ago, Boompa said:

It is a bum move pulling a kid's shirt his true freshman year, give him a handful of matches to not have him compete in the postseason.

I can't say elsewhere but with PA kids, PSU's reputation is faltering.

You have no earthly idea what was said this year between the PSU staff and the Hwt wrestlers on the PSU roster. And if you think PSU's rep is falling with any significant group of h.s. wrestlers you are delusional. 

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Just now, cjc007 said:

Micic wrestled in Illinois, not at Illinois. He actually wrestled for Northwestern. The coach Parisno was fired and Micic transferred to Northwestern.

I'm not hating on Kerk. I'm just trying to understand the logic in giving eligibility in late February. He should have fought for immediate eligibility if he was planning for State Penn this season.

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Your right it was Northwestern, he’s been in college so long I forgot for a second lol

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2 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Suriano transferred and wrestled immediately...micic transferred from Illinois to Michigan and lost no eligibility, the rules are not what they used to be. Pete lipari wrestled for Rutgers in December, then for rider in January, and then wrestles Rutgers in a dual in February. Your on here claiming he’s breaking rules that don’t exist anymore 

why all the hate over a 19 year old kid just trying to do what he’s worked really damn hard his whole life for? 

While I agree, in the end, I think Kerk should be allowed to wrestle, there are clear differences in the situations.  Suriano was not seeking to be made eligible right before the postseason, which at least gives off an appearance that PSU has realized they are massive underdogs, and that's the reason for the request.  Lipari did not transfer within conference.  I also don't know what was the impetus of Lipari's transfer, but he was a RS senior, which also feels relevant.  Was he a grad transfer?

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2 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

While I agree, in the end, I think Kerk should be allowed to wrestle, there are clear differences in the situations.  Suriano was not seeking to be made eligible right before the postseason, which at least gives off an appearance that PSU has realized they are massive underdogs, and that's the reason for the request.  Lipari did not transfer within conference.  I also don't know what was the impetus of Lipari's transfer, but he was a RS senior, which also feels relevant.  Was he a grad transfer?

I thought he was a grad transfer but was told otherwise and apparently he is getting approved for a 6th year so he’s only technically a junior now

 

oh I agree the optics are terrible for PSU but I’ve also heard (idk how true) that he’s taken double the amount of credits to get eligible since he arrived at penn state and his whole issue has been around certain online classes he took at OSU 

Edited by Antitroll2828

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26 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

You act like the whole situation is a mystery to Nevills, like the guy is practicing with Kerk everyday, he obviously knows the guys trying to get eligible. Nevills 100 percent knew he would have to wrestle off kerk if he got his waiver. 
 
PSU reputation is falling so hard in the PA I bet Starocci, Bartlett, beard  are all really in the transfer portal now , it’s like a mass exodus over there, guys are just so upset that a coach might put the guy that wins the wrestle off out there...What a tragedy, maybe we can get congress to step in and intervene 

Never mind the #2 170 Trey Kibe from Mifflin County who literally just committed to PSU within the past couple of weeks. Cue Boompa bringing up Geography 101.

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Put yourself in Nevills' place.  If he thinks he can beat Kerk, he pulls his redshirt and wrestles.  If he doesn't think he can beat Kerk, then how many matches does he think he'll get over the next four years?  So he pulls his redshirt so he can at least get some prime duals in.

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3 minutes ago, klehner said:

Put yourself in Nevills' place.  If he thinks he can beat Kerk, he pulls his redshirt and wrestles.  If he doesn't think he can beat Kerk, then how many matches does he think he'll get over the next four years?  So he pulls his redshirt so he can at least get some prime duals in.

Yeah this was my thinking when it first started being talked about.   If anything it's probably a sign that he won't transfer - as him seeking a transfer would be the main reason that he would've wanted to preserve his eligibility.

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25 minutes ago, Marcus Cisero said:

It's possible it was mentioned already above but if Nevills beats Kirk, then why in the world would Cael sit Nevills?

that's not the point @BigTenFanboy was making. he was saying that if Nevills loses a wrestle-off, he isn't getting screwed by being benched.

1 minute ago, klehner said:

Put yourself in Nevills' place.  If he thinks he can beat Kerk, he pulls his redshirt and wrestles.  If he doesn't think he can beat Kerk, then how many matches does he think he'll get over the next four years?  So he pulls his redshirt so he can at least get some prime duals in.

see also, berreyesa at cornell if womack is ready to go for EIWA imo

Anyway, there are a lot of things going on and "screwed" is a very blunt way of looking at it. If Nevills was getting his shirt pulled with the promise of competition for the rest of the year, he was done dirty. I doubt that's the case, though. If he knew Kirk/Penn State was trying to get his eligibility cleared up before the tournaments, and it happens, he will obviously be disappointed but it isn't a screwjob.

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I’m all for kids being able to transfer without losing eligibility, but not mid-season. The fact is Kerk spent time THIS SEASON in Ohio State’s room being trained by Ohio State coaches and training with (getting familiar with) Ohio State’s starters. He was allocated a significant amount of Ohio State’s limited scholarship money which they weren’t able to reallocate to bring in other guys mid-season. There has to be some balance between being fair to the kid who wants to transfer and being fair to the teammates and program he’s leaving behind. He shouldn’t be punished but once the season starts he shouldn’t be able to compete for another school (which means competing against the school he’s leaving behind) that same season. 

And nor do I think coaches should be able to quit one job mid-season and then be able to coach at another program that same season. 

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30 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

I thought he was a grad transfer but was told otherwise and apparently he is getting approved for a 6th year so he’s only technically a junior now

 

oh I agree the optics are terrible for PSU but I’ve also heard (idk how true) that he’s taken double the amount of credits to get eligible since he arrived at penn state and his whole issue has been around certain online classes he took at OSU 

So we have a Downey situation? He took 24 credits multiple semesters to get eligible. He now has 3 doctorates lol 

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1 hour ago, cjc007 said:

Good point. The Suriano situation didn't happen in late February, it was resolved before the season started if my memory is correct.  

If the NCAA allows Kerk to be eligible, everyone would be eligible to transfer at any time while retaining athletic eligiblity.

 

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I wonder if this will be allowed.  Can you imagine this happening in football or basketball?  Bad precedent.

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