Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
TBar1977

Illegal Slam or Standard Finish to a Double Leg

Recommended Posts

On 3/5/2020 at 8:56 PM, Lipdrag said:

This thread got waaaayyyy off track.  Rangernot and old coach - get a room and resolve this the old fashioned way; by slamming each other physically instead of putting us through it on this board.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled thread:  It was no slam.  Not even close.  The referee blew the call then the coach blew his integrity - again (you have to know Michigan wrestling to understand this one).  Catholics all around MI were shamed by this.

Imagine the miracle and interceding grace of the divine - Rojas has been cleared to wrestle tomorrow.  AMAZING!!!  Someone must be up to his old healing tricks again.  Glory be.

Just because he may not have had a concussion, doesn’t mean it couldn’t have been called a slam.  Its a judgement call to begin with, and watching it in slo-mo, I think it was.  And after seeing the elbow to the head that DCC took earlier and didn’t take the DQ, I believe that it wasn’t the coach’s decision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mitch Hancock did not make the call on Rojas not being allowed to continue, the doctor on staff did.  That's just a fact.  Rojas wanted to continue and wasn't looking for a way out.  If you have any problem with ethics, it would only be with Hancock on whether he should have defaulted the bout back to Facundo because that match, under the doctor's judgment, wasn't going to continue under any circumstance once the doctor ruled.  Personally, I think the elbow to the head should have been an automatic DQ and the Facundo should have been defaulted back to Facundo.  Net result, the same team ends up winning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To put this into an ongoing context,  last night in the 215 semi the DCC kid was called for a slam against the kid from Dexter.  Certain folks I won't name began yelling at the Dexter kid that he was taking the easy way out, blah-blah. The kid began yelling back that he doesn't take a fall and he continues the bout, eventually losing 5-4.  Many "adults" behaved shamefully (and that extends to people in the crowd as well) but props to the kid from Dexter going out on his shield.  If I were a small-college coach, I'd be all about getting that kid from Dexter.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, TBar1977 said:

Not a slam at all. 

Thought someone said the doc told the wrestler it was up to him if he wanted to continue. 

Holtfan retracted that statement earlier in the thread.

 

Holtfan

  • Bronze MemberHoltfan
  • Members
  •  37
  • 198 posts

EDIT!!

I was misinformed on the video.  Someone I trusted said it was so, and I didn't check it out for myself, I just took their word.  I went back and watched, it's just not there.

I will man-up on this and take the bullet on this one.  

It was unfortunate situation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, Coach_J said:

To put this into an ongoing context,  last night in the 215 semi the DCC kid was called for a slam against the kid from Dexter.  Certain folks I won't name began yelling at the Dexter kid that he was taking the easy way out, blah-blah. The kid began yelling back that he doesn't take a fall and he continues the bout, eventually losing 5-4.  Many "adults" behaved shamefully (and that extends to people in the crowd as well) but props to the kid from Dexter going out on his shield.  If I were a small-college coach, I'd be all about getting that kid from Dexter.  

Glad the Dexter kid continued if he could. Wish Rojas would have done same last week because it just doesn't seem as if he was injured. Put this on the DCC coach maybe. I dunno, the appearance just isn't good on that match last week. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

Glad the Dexter kid continued if he could. Wish Rojas would have done same last week because it just doesn't seem as if he was injured. Put this on the DCC coach maybe. I dunno, the appearance just isn't good on that match last week. 

Agreed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rojas won the Div. 1 State title at 189 by Dec. 

Facundo won the Div. 1 State Title at 171 by major. 

In the Michigan Div. 2 state finals PSU recruit Austin Boone became the 2nd wrestler (joining Brent Metcalf) as a 4 time individual state champion and 4 time team state champion when he defeated 2x state champ and Cornell recruit Chase Lajoie by a 4-3 score in the finals.

Next stop for Boone is the Dapper Dan Pittsburgh Wrestling Classic on, I think, Sunday March 15. 

https://secondhalf.mhsaa.com/All-News/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/9006/Lowells-Boone-Ends-as-2nd-8-Time-Champion

Edited by TBar1977

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anybody watch the Lewan (mi) vs Phifer (PSU) match yesterday during the BIG10 championships? That Cael Sanderson is a class act, lots of integrity there!

Wish I could say the same with DCC.   Pathetic just pathetic what went down at the MHSAA team championships. But if you know DCC I guess it shouldn't be a big surprise.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Plus, that kid wrestles, and he DOES have a concussion, sue the school, sue the coach, sue the referee, sue the doc.  "

Just saw hundreds of takedowns and mat returns more "dynamic" than the one in question at the individual state finals.  No concussions (like this instance, obviously, as the kid wrestled 6 days later and presumably practiced), not one school sued, not one coach sued, not one referee sued, not one doctor sued.

If you have not seen the Bobby Douglas interview linked earlier in this thread then please watch it.  https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=477319369798386

His concern for Coleman's reputation and for the sport of wrestling are epic and should have been applied in this instance by those involved.  Virtual asterisks now will be associated forever with this team championship and with this wrestler - unfortunately.  He probably would have reacted like the Dexter MAN if he attended Dexter.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From day one a wrestler is taught fundamental values such as character, integrity and respect regarding our sport... These same values are the foundation to being successful both on and off the mat... We are taught to respect your opponent and the sport... We were taught that the sport is bigger then any one particular wrestler, coach or team... These values are understood GLOBALLY... Its understood that there is a sense of honor and fair play that goes into our sport... It's our "CODE"... The code that is the backbone of what being successful in wrestling but more importantly in life is all about... We take a sense of pride embracing this code...

Sadly... and to many of us embarrassingly that code was broken that day by the leader of a program... He has a responsibility to lead thru his actions and not his words what our code is all about... And he failed to do so on the biggest stage and in the biggest way...

Regardless if he or anyone else acknowledges what he did was an embarrassment to the fundamental core of what we are all about... By no means is there any responsibility on any other individual... He could have and should have inj. Dlftd that match if his wrestler was unable to continue... His wrestler who is a stuf in his own right loses that match 10 times out of 10... and yes he could have defaulted at anytime... 100% no question about it...

So they can say whatever it is they want to but when it's just them looking themselves in the mirror they know the truth... They know how things went down and they know that everyone thinks differently about it... Most wont tell them how they really feel about it... However, he should know that there is a substantial quite majority out there who feel this way... They chose to not express how they feel because of many reasons and those close to the program no why that is... However, the wrestling looks differently at the program and their leadership now and that is apparent by the response this incident  has gotten...

Hopefully he realizes we arent naive... we arent oblivious to what took place... 

For those out there thinking I'm just out here being a key board warrior...

I've spoken personally to coach about how I feel... Face to face and I looked him in the eye... We agreed to disagree...

But I also spoke to 50 plus coaches all of whom thanked me and agreed with me for saying what many wanted to but for whatever reason didnt...

Congrats to all the individual state champions out there but more so to those wrestlers who continue to honor the code that our sport holds true...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think decisions would be different if it meant a team title or an individual title.  
 

Now, I known the argument is partly “wrestlers are better than competitors of other sports” but:

1.  I have never seen an offensive lineman go to the referee and say “that wasn’t a hold.” Same with pass interference.  You will never see a WR go to a ref and say, “he didn’t interfere.”  Late hits...targeting.    
 

2. How many batters hit by pitches are lauded for “taking one for the team.”  
 

3.  Wrestlers who stall to win because they know they can. 
 

4.  Coaches who KNOW there wasn’t a takedown but keep their mouth shut because it was THEIR guy who was on the receiving end of the call.  (Army v Wisc 125, even the mat judge official said it wasn’t, and he was in position to make that call).  

The slam call is like a targeting call.  Damage may not have been done on that play, but other slams, at other times may cause acute or permanent injury. 
 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will say this, has that match been freestyle, the slam would never have happened because he would have let go of his head so he could try to land on his stomach and not his back (2 not 4).  
 

That slam was more about the wrestlers aversion to let go of the head.  I am surprised the guy who slammed didn’t hurt his neck because it looked like he spiked his own head...like he facilitated getting himself DDTed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, LowSingleOTW said:

From day one a wrestler is taught fundamental values such as character, integrity and respect regarding our sport... These same values are the foundation to being successful both on and off the mat... We are taught to respect your opponent and the sport... We were taught that the sport is bigger then any one particular wrestler, coach or team... These values are understood GLOBALLY... Its understood that there is a sense of honor and fair play that goes into our sport... It's our "CODE"... The code that is the backbone of what being successful in wrestling but more importantly in life is all about... We take a sense of pride embracing this code...

Sadly... and to many of us embarrassingly that code was broken that day by the leader of a program... He has a responsibility to lead thru his actions and not his words what our code is all about... And he failed to do so on the biggest stage and in the biggest way...

Regardless if he or anyone else acknowledges what he did was an embarrassment to the fundamental core of what we are all about... By no means is there any responsibility on any other individual... He could have and should have inj. Dlftd that match if his wrestler was unable to continue... His wrestler who is a stuf in his own right loses that match 10 times out of 10... and yes he could have defaulted at anytime... 100% no question about it...

So they can say whatever it is they want to but when it's just them looking themselves in the mirror they know the truth... They know how things went down and they know that everyone thinks differently about it... Most wont tell them how they really feel about it... However, he should know that there is a substantial quite majority out there who feel this way... They chose to not express how they feel because of many reasons and those close to the program no why that is... However, the wrestling looks differently at the program and their leadership now and that is apparent by the response this incident  has gotten...

Hopefully he realizes we arent naive... we arent oblivious to what took place... 

For those out there thinking I'm just out here being a key board warrior...

I've spoken personally to coach about how I feel... Face to face and I looked him in the eye... We agreed to disagree...

But I also spoke to 50 plus coaches all of whom thanked me and agreed with me for saying what many wanted to but for whatever reason didnt...

Congrats to all the individual state champions out there but more so to those wrestlers who continue to honor the code that our sport holds true...

 

Hear! Hear!  You articulated what I feel but was unable to state clearly and dispassionately.  Thank you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...