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Careers that could have been..

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36 minutes ago, NJDan said:

You didn't start the thread so I don't see how you decide the purpose. 

The OP was: "

 Which wrestlers stand out to you as woulda coulda shoulda if not for some circumstances."  Is says nothing about freestyle. So your 'tude in NOT ok. 

 

Woulda - rocked at freestyle on Senior Circuit

coulda - by their excellent showing in folk (and some age group freestyle)

Shoulda - I think so

but could not due to medical circumstances highlighted.

I’m glad you think you could define the purpose.  

But I’m good.

 

Edited by nom

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4 hours ago, NJDan said:

Lee was a two-time champ. Nickerson won just one, but had 4 top-4 finishes. They did OK.

I think @nom was trying to say that he wanted to see these 2 compete more on the senior freestyle level due to how impressive they were in college.

Anyone calling a 2x NCAA Champ/4x AA and/or a 1x NCAA Champ/4x AA a bust is crazy.

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2 minutes ago, ShakaAloha said:

I think @nom was trying to say that he wanted to see these 2 compete more on the senior freestyle level due to how impressive they were in college.

Anyone calling a 2x NCAA Champ/4x AA and/or a 1x NCAA Champ/4x AA a bust is crazy.

I won't pretend to know or want to know what Nom was thinking, but I agree with your second point.

BTW, I don't know about Lee, but I do recall TNick wrestling in the LCQ, but that was post-injury.

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On 3/25/2020 at 8:34 AM, madcat11 said:

The Monroeville 4 minus Logan Stieber.

 

Hunter Stieber 6th, 3rd, injured.  Beat the defending champ Russell as a true freshman and with the body of a child.  Probably “shoulda,” won his sophomore year, but Port upset him, “woulda,” won his junior year but he was hurt and “coulda,” won his senior year (yes in a bracket with Rutherford), but still hurt.

 

Cam Tessari was 4th as a true freshman then got into some trouble.  Sounds like he eventually turned things around.
 

Chris Phillips was a 4x Ohio State Champ, traded wins with Ed Ruth in HS.  Didn’t quite make it to college wrestling.

I was pretty annoyed when Tessari got himself kicked off the team at Ohio State. That kid was fun to watch, wild. Hunter was a good kid, never quite reached his potential like he should have. Had arms like noodles, lol, but had a good sense of humor about it. Logan was the first 2 time 4 timer :D 

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2 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

cejudo lost multiple times in HS. his HS career wasn't close to suggesting what he would become. 

He won a couple senior nationals, made it the finals of a senior world team trials in hs.  Senior panam champ What do you want? 

Edited by Plasmodium

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2 hours ago, NJFAN said:

Travis Blasco.  Great HS career but never followed through at Iowa.

I went to school at Iowa at the same time as Blasco and Billy Murphy and legend has it they had a sit down meeting with Tom Brands to try and convince him they should be able to not only smoke pot but do it before matches because it helped them wrestle. 

Worth a shot, I guess.

 

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Ryan Davis- National Prep Champion and Cadet Freestyle Champ before transferring to Blair. 2X Beast, 2X Ironman Champ. Was ranked #1 at 145 his senior year on the same team as Mark Perry. He defeated 2 future D1 all Americans in High School (Eckloff and Kocher)

Patrick Bond- Won everything and anything in High School and was included in that top tier of recruits for the class of 2005 which included Nickerson, Metcalf and Schlatter

Mario Mason- #1 ranked 140 pounder in the country as a Junior

Eric Medina- #1 ranked 152 pounder in the country as a junior

Ben Ashmore

CP Schlatter

All five were ranked # 1 for some part of their careers. No AAs as far as I recall

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When I think of wrestlers who never lived up to their potential I think of Tony Cook. Probably nobody here knows who he was unless you wrestled in Oklahoma in the 80's. He was a 3 time state champ at Perry and won a Jr World Championship in FS his Sr year. I never heard of him going to college or wrestling ever again. What happened to him? Surely every D1 college in the country was drooling over the kid. I figure either 1) he just didn't have the grades to be accepted anywhere or 2) he had to take a job straight out of HS for some reason or another. Maybe he just HEW. 

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3 hours ago, wrestlingphish said:

I went to school at Iowa at the same time as Blasco and Billy Murphy and legend has it they had a sit down meeting with Tom Brands to try and convince him they should be able to not only smoke pot but do it before matches because it helped them wrestle. 

Worth a shot, I guess.

 

If there are any coaches in the USA that NEED to smoke pot it's Tom and Terry Brands. Those boys need to chill, bad. 

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3 hours ago, wrestlingphish said:

I went to school at Iowa at the same time as Blasco and Billy Murphy and legend has it they had a sit down meeting with Tom Brands to try and convince him they should be able to not only smoke pot but do it before matches because it helped them wrestle. 

Worth a shot, I guess.

 

Murphy? That guy who went to UM and did "okay"? 

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4 hours ago, Plasmodium said:

He won a couple senior nationals, made it the finals of a senior world team trials in hs.  Senior panam champ What do you want? 

Everything you mentioned was impressive except the Pan-Am Championship. Pan-AM is the international equivalent of the Oklahoma Open. 

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for christ sake Cejudo never won Reno TOC. he got beat by two Easton guys who never did anything (one of which was jordan oliver's brother, josh)

yes, Henry accomplished incredible things at a young age, but 1) you wouldn't have known that from his HS career and 2) he literally didn't participate in college. 

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25 minutes ago, Husker_Du said:

for christ sake Cejudo never won Reno TOC. he got beat by two Easton guys who never did anything (one of which was jordan oliver's brother, josh)

yes, Henry accomplished incredible things at a young age, but 1) you wouldn't have known that from his HS career and 2) he literally didn't participate in college. 

Didn't Cejudo win the US Open as a senior in HS?  I recall him being considered the clear cut best wrestler in the country for his year when he graduated.  Didn't he also get silver at JR worlds as a senior in HS, only losing to Kudukhov, who was world champion a year later?  In terms of the best US wrestlers to never wrestle in college, I don't see how he can be anything other than #1.  If wrestler A is undefeated in HS, he isn't better than wrestler B who takes a few losses early on but near the end of his HS career is one of the best in the world.  

 

This debate is kind of like how some insisted on ranking Marsteller above Snyder their senior years.  Yes, Marsteller had a more impressive overall track record (being a 4X PA state champ beats being a great Maryland prep wrestler), but by their senior year it was clear that Snyder was better.  

Edited by Billyhoyle

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32 minutes ago, Husker_Du said:

for christ sake Cejudo never won Reno TOC. he got beat by two Easton guys who never did anything (one of which was jordan oliver's brother, josh)

Actually, Josh did do something, which was the problem.

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2 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

Didn't Cejudo win the US Open as a senior in HS?  I recall him being considered the clear cut best wrestler in the country for his year when he graduated.  Didn't he also get silver at JR worlds as a senior in HS, only losing to Kudukhov, who was world champion a year later?  In terms of the best US wrestlers to never wrestle in college, I don't see how he can be anything other than #1.  If wrestler A is undefeated in HS, he isn't better than wrestler B who takes a few losses early on but near the end of his HS career is one of the best in the world.  

 

This debate is kind of like how some insisted on ranking Marsteller above Snyder their senior years.  Yes, Marsteller had a more impressive overall track record (being a 4X PA state champ beats being a great Maryland prep wrestler), but by their senior year it was clear that Snyder was better.  

Notice you didn't mention how Cejudo finished 31st at Worlds one year :D The crazy thing is he won the Olympic Gold just a year or two later. Cejudo had a lot of losses in his FS career. I think he'd have done well in college, but after seeing his struggles at FS I think he might have never won an NCAA title. Hell, we've seen guys with World medals not measure up in NCAA wrestling. Remember Chris Perry had a World Bronze in FS, then crapped out in R12 as Fr (frankly, he was too lazy to pull down where he eventually ended up having success!). The crazy part of that for me is the fact that FS is essentially just a takedown contest, and Perry excelled at it, but in college he was a defensive wrestler who rarely took any chances. Where in the hell was the offense he showed in FS when he was wrestling in the NCAA?

Edited by TobusRex

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35 minutes ago, TobusRex said:

Notice you didn't mention how Cejudo finished 31st at Worlds one year :D The crazy thing is he won the Olympic Gold just a year or two later. Cejudo had a lot of losses in his FS career. I think he'd have done well in college, but after seeing his struggles at FS I think he might have never won an NCAA title. Hell, we've seen guys with World medals not measure up in NCAA wrestling. Remember Chris Perry had a World Bronze in FS, then crapped out in R12 as Fr (frankly, he was too lazy to pull down where he eventually ended up having success!). The crazy part of that for me is the fact that FS is essentially just a takedown contest, and Perry excelled at it, but in college he was a defensive wrestler who rarely took any chances. Where in the hell was the offense he showed in FS when he was wrestling in the NCAA?

Out of all the American world or Olympic champions in freestyle over the past 50 years, how many have never won an NCAA title? 
 

 

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7 hours ago, Bagration44 said:

Ryan Davis- National Prep Champion and Cadet Freestyle Champ before transferring to Blair. 2X Beast, 2X Ironman Champ. Was ranked #1 at 145 his senior year on the same team as Mark Perry. He defeated 2 future D1 all Americans in High School (Eckloff and Kocher)

Patrick Bond- Won everything and anything in High School and was included in that top tier of recruits for the class of 2005 which included Nickerson, Metcalf and Schlatter

Mario Mason- #1 ranked 140 pounder in the country as a Junior

Eric Medina- #1 ranked 152 pounder in the country as a junior

Ben Ashmore

CP Schlatter

All five were ranked # 1 for some part of their careers. No AAs as far as I recall

CP Schlatter was an All-American. 

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1 hour ago, Billyhoyle said:

Out of all the American world or Olympic champions in freestyle over the past 50 years, how many have never won an NCAA title? 
 

 

Kevin Jackson, Zeke Jones, Bobby Weaver, Stan Dzeidzic come to mind.

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2 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

Out of all the American world or Olympic champions in freestyle over the past 50 years, how many have never won an NCAA title? 
 

 

Since 1960, the one's that come to mind are Shelby Wilson, John Peterson, Lloyd Keaser, Bobby Weaver, Kevin Jackson, Zeke Jones and Brandon Slay.

Edited by fadzaev2

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