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27 minutes ago, 152lbs said:

Yes, I am and I am also aware of Trump's Twitter rants then too.  

The power of the mean tweet!

I think the bigger factor was, later, when Trump was president, he said "fire the SOB!"  I think that probably fired up people more.  The kneeling went from a dying issue to a major one where a record number of players knelt.

I have to believe that ignited things more than any mean tweets.

Edited by AHamilton

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50 minutes ago, 152lbs said:

Somehow kneeling during the anthem became conflated with disrespecting the flag or the military.  I often wonder had Trump not gone on a Twitter rant this would have blown over.

Became conflated? And because of trump? You seem to have the perspective of a 14 yr old on this subject

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1 minute ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Became conflated? And because of trump? You seem to have the perspective of a 14 yr old on this subject

wait, are you suggesting that politicians and leaders don't have an influence on civil unrest? It seems like you were just arguing the opposite with me a moment ago.

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32 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

An under talked about aspect of Cuba is that the regime that preceded Castro was a far-right dictatorship and a puppet state of the US that brutally repressed Cubans. Castro very much had the support of the common people in Cuba.

 

Every one should stop reading after you dropped the support of common people...you are absolutely clueless and clearly all your knowledge about Cuba comes from some pro communism teacher or book and not from the people of Cuba, the common people weren’t swimming across shark infested waters to escape someone they supported... Unbelievable 

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Just now, russelscout said:

Just curious, what do you think I watch on TV? Clearly you have made assumptions about everyone. 

Let me summarize your post: You don't like or watch TV, therefore everyone else are simpletons if they think someone is racist, and you find trump amusing because it shows that everything is broken. Talk about non sequiturs. You're going to break an ankle making those kind of jumps. 

Honestly, you just sound like an old man ranting who takes pride in his own cynicism. 

too funny... you are concerned about my ankles yet jumped to that conclusion so fast you risk a permanent injury...

the only people that i have heard personally going off about trump have been simpletons because i would rather eat ground glass than talk politics... and everyone i find myself around for any length of time learn this very quickly and the only ones that persist are the simpletons i referred to and i walk away if they refuse to stop...

they are the same breed of people that are on this forum that i have mentioned...

anyone who continues to willingly participate in something that gets them so riled up and angry i find a simpleton and a fool... that's on both sides of the equation because all of "you" are the same to me...

and yes, i am a bit too cynical and no i wish i wasn't... i would much prefer to be simple, enjoy chain restaurunts, bad television, and politics... my life would be easier to negotiate if i was that average...

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4 hours ago, russelscout said:

I get accused of being emotional on here frequently and don't understand why. I feel like my posts are measured, defended carefully and thoroughly, and have very few exclamation points.

Honestly, your arguments aren't emotional at all.  They're well researched, clearly expressed, and persuasive.

I appreciate your contributions and have learned a bit along the way.

If you weren't an Iowa fan, we'd probably get along swimmingly.

 

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Just now, LJB said:

the only people that i have heard personally going off about trump have been simpletons because i would rather eat ground glass than talk politics

huh? they are simpletons because you don't want to talk about it?

 

1 minute ago, LJB said:

and everyone i find myself around for any length of time learn this very quickly and the only ones that persist are the simpletons i referred to and i walk away if they refuse to stop...

Are those people cool with you ranting about the msm, television, and the decline of American discourse? Whats worse? 

 

2 minutes ago, LJB said:

they are the same breed of people that are on this forum that i have mentioned...

anyone who continues to willingly participate in something that gets them so riled up and angry i find a simpleton and a fool... that's on both sides of the equation because all of "you" are the same to me...

Repeatedly you have gotten riled up about the media on here. Not just any kind of rant, the kind that tiptoes the line of a conspiracy believer, but you find someone questioning a leader as just too much?

 

4 minutes ago, LJB said:

and yes, i am a bit too cynical and no i wish i wasn't... i would much prefer to be simple, enjoy chain restaurunts, bad television, and politics... my life would be easier to negotiate if i was that average...

This is seriously sad. Essentially what you are saying is that are just too special for all of us plebes to understand the complex individual that you are. We could never expect to speak on an even keel with an individual with so much depth. This sounds like delusion.

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1 hour ago, russelscout said:

Did Fidel keep black people down though, more down than his predecessor? ...because that is relevant. I just thought it was a weird example on your part. Fidel is know for a lot of terrible things and what you stated is not one of them.

By that logic there are a lot of presidents we need to reevaluate as a whole as they were not more progressive enough on the racial front. You see a lot of quotes from FDR out there, but the guy didn't end the Jim Crow south. He kept the black people down. Yet, I dont see people clamoring to use him as an example of racism. 

Like I said, I dont think your argument made sense. 

You argue to just hear yourself argue you can simply google racism in Cuba and Wikipedia will give you a starting point , so you can maybe escape this illusion 

also fdr was not a good man, crazy how they don’t include that in the , you should hate the country you live in classes they teach today  

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3 minutes ago, whaletail said:

Honestly, your arguments aren't emotional at all.  They're well researched, clearly expressed, and persuasive.

I appreciate your contributions and have learned a bit along the way.

If you weren't an Iowa fan, we'd probably get along swimmingly.

 

Can you site anything he’s said that’s

1. Well researched 

2. Clearly expressed

3. persuasive to anyone outside of his group think mentality?

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Just now, Antitroll2828 said:

You argue to just hear yourself argue you can simply google racism in Cuba and Wikipedia will give you a starting point , so you can maybe escape this illusion 

also fdr was not a good man, crazy how they don’t include that in the , you should hate the country you live in classes they teach today  

Did you read the article? It says very little about him until it gets to his anti-discrimination laws. Fidel Castro does not equal Cuba.

Also, what school did you go to because high school is very much taught from a red white and blue perspective.

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16 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Every one should stop reading after you dropped the support of common people...you are absolutely clueless and clearly all your knowledge about Cuba comes from some pro communism teacher or book and not from the people of Cuba, the common people weren’t swimming across shark infested waters to escape someone they supported... Unbelievable 

Commoners or the old ruling class?

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1 minute ago, russelscout said:

huh? they are simpletons because you don't want to talk about it?

Are those people cool with you ranting about the msm, television, and the decline of American discourse? Whats worse? 

Repeatedly you have gotten riled up about the media on here. Not just any kind of rant, the kind that tiptoes the line of a conspiracy believer, but you find someone questioning a leader as just too much?

This is seriously sad. Essentially what you are saying is that are just too special for all of us plebes to understand the complex individual that you are. We could never expect to speak on an even keel with an individual with so much depth. This sounds like delusion.

riled up?

please...

i can count the number of times i have been "riled up" on the internet... the vast majority of this is pure amusement to me...

i actually laugh at you people... 

outloud...

it bothers the dog sometimes...

and yes, the majority of you are to simple for me... you care so much about things that not only can you not control but have very little tangible effect on your lives... it si almost as if you have never had a real problem and hard times... ever...

if that makes me the elitist you are trying to insult me as, then so be it...

because the fact of the matter is, you are here for my entertainment... that is it... once i cease to be entertained, i leave...

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4 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Can you site anything he’s said that’s

1. Well researched 

2. Clearly expressed

3. persuasive to anyone outside of his group think mentality?

1. Well, what is poorly researched? Do I need to start sourcing books? You just typically go with the "I know a guy" defense which is hardly persuasive. 
2. My written skills may need a little work, but I think most of the time people get what I am saying
3. This may be true, but I think you could agree that most people double down on their original position anyways. 
 

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2 minutes ago, LJB said:

and yes, the majority of you are to simple for me... you care so much about things that not only can you not control but have very little tangible effect on your lives

We are all on a wrestling forum. Whens the last time a wrestling match affected your life?

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8 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Commoners or the old ruling class?

Poor people horribly oppressed, a jailable offense for standing in groups of 4 or more bc you may be plotting a government overthrow, talks about education but most of the country didn’t even have schools, just ridiculous you people spread that Castro BS that the people swimming across the ocean are the old ruling class 

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Just now, russelscout said:

We are all on a wrestling forum. Whens the last time a wrestling match affected your life?

specifically affected me was last april when my oldest lost to the eventual cadet world team member in the semis... they both teched everyone else in their bracket... that loss saved me about $3k...

you know what, that is a lie, my youngest broke his hand at schoolboy national duals last summer in june... that affected me personally as well...

so yeah, sparky... i actually have some skin in the game...

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3 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

You argue to just hear yourself argue you can simply google racism in Cuba and Wikipedia will give you a starting point , so you can maybe escape this illusion 

also fdr was not a good man, crazy how they don’t include that in the , you should hate the country you live in classes they teach today  

Isn't what you're describing as hatred of America really just broad disagreement with ideological conservatism (and more specifically, social conservatism)?

If not, can you clearly describe what is that LeBron & Kap et al. hate, and why you consider it to be America?

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3 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Bingo. "Help! Help! Fidel took away my slaves! Help!"

 

Try ,Fidel took our food, our rights and lined up my son and husband against a wall and had them shot for disagreeing 

try Fidel took my families farm and murdered or imprisoned everyone that tried to stop it 

honestly you’d be ashamed of the stuff your posting if you took even the bare minimum time to research anything Cuba related outside your echo chamber 

Edited by Antitroll2828

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1 minute ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Poor people horribly oppressed, a jailable offense for standing in groups of 4 or more bc you may be plotting a government overthrow, talks about education but most of the country didn’t even have schools, just ridiculous you people spread that Castro BS that the people swimming across the ocean are the old ruling class 

The first postrevolutionary migrant wave, from 1959 to 1962, has been dubbed the Golden Exile because most refugees came from the upper and middle strata of Cuban society. (Members of this cohort prefer to describe themselves as “historical exiles.”) The majority were urban, middle-aged, well-educated, light-skinned, and white-collar workers. Most were born in the largest cities, particularly Havana. Many fled for political or religious reasons, fearing persecution by the revolutionary government. During this period, between 1,600 and 1,700 Cubans arrived in the United States per week on commercial airlines, and the U.S. government admitted approximately 248,100 Cubans. One dramatic episode during this period was Operation Pedro Pan, which brought more than 14,000 unaccompanied children to the United States between December 1960 and October 1962.

Much later:

But the deterioration in U.S.-Cuban relations since 1959, together with faltering economic and political conditions on the island, produced a much more heterogeneous Cuban American population. Successive migrant waves drew deeper from the middle and lower strata of Cuban society over time, and more recent émigrés represent a wide cross-section of Cuban society. In addition, economic motivations became increasingly intertwined with political ones during the later migrant waves.

https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/cuban-migration-postrevolution-exodus-ebbs-and-flows

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14 minutes ago, LJB said:

specifically affected me was last april when my oldest lost to the eventual cadet world team member in the semis... they both teched everyone else in their bracket... that loss saved me about $3k...

you know what, that is a lie, my youngest broke his hand at schoolboy national duals last summer in june... that affected me personally as well...

so yeah, sparky... i actually have some skin in the game...

Yeah, but this is the first time you have talked about it on this forum sparky. You hate on everyone for doing the exact same thing you are. Kind of similar to all the complaining about the things you watch on your TV. There is a name for people like you...

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1 minute ago, Antitroll2828 said:

Try ,Fidel took our food, our rights and lined up my son and husband against a wall and had them shot for disagreeing 

try Fidel took my families farm and murdered or imprisoned everyone that tried to stop it 

honestly you’d be ashamed of the stuff your posting if you took even the bare minimum time to research anything Cuba related outside your echo chamber 

For someone who is so condescending, you are almost never able to have a thought with any nuance whatsoever. 

Nobody would deny that poor Cubans have fled the human rights abuses under the Castro regime. However, you can't just bury your head in the sand about the popular legitimacy of the Cuban revolution when it occurred just because you have an ideological opposition to it. Castro was the champion of the common people against a dictatorship. Unfortunately, he went on to repeat many of the atrocities that inspired the revolution in the first place. That doesn't negate the fact that he had popular support.

And those "family farms" you're talking about were basically slave plantations in many instances. The agrarian reform laws seized the large farms from exploitative owners and redistributed the land to the poor peasants who worked them for starvation wages all those years. In fact, a large percentage of these farms were actually owned by U.S. interests. Why do you think the common people supported Castro? He offered them a chance to control their own subsistence and well-being for the first time. Obviously, you have an ideological opposition to this kind of distribution, and that's fine, but this was arguably the most popular part of Castro's platform along with his education reforms.

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2 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

For someone who is so condescending, you are almost never able to have a thought with any nuance whatsoever. 

Nobody would deny that poor Cubans have fled the human rights abuses under the Castro regime. However, you can't just bury your head in the sand about the popular legitimacy of the Cuban revolution when it occurred just because you have an ideological opposition to it. Castro was the champion of the common people against a dictatorship. Unfortunately, he went on to repeat many of the atrocities that inspired the revolution in the first place. That doesn't negate the fact that he had popular support.

And those "family farms" you're talking about were basically slave plantations in many instances. The agrarian reform laws seized the large farms from exploitative owners and redistributed the land to the poor peasants who worked them for starvation wages all those years. In fact, a large percentage of these farms were actually owned by U.S. interests. Why do you think the common people supported Castro? He offered them a chance to control their own subsistence and well-being for the first time. Obviously, you have an ideological opposition to this kind of distribution, and that's fine, but this was arguably the most popular part of Castro's platform along with his education reforms.

Its almost as if the world is more complex than simply good and bad.

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