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Further illustrating what a wild time we are living in, China allowed CanSino Biologics to skip phase 3 clinicals for their covid vaccine. Greenlit for one year military use. This is the same vaccine co-developed by the Military Sciences Academy that Canada is currently testing. No idea if this will be a huge success or a disaster but we’re definitely going at it fast and loose!

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COVID 19 is 99% political and is not very deadly at all. Under 1% death rate for those who do get it. They could have picked any flu strain and played it all over the worlds media companies and the death rate would have been close to the same. This is a manufactured crisis and will go away if Trump loses. So Olympics is 50/50 if Trump wins and 99.9 if he loses. A few dozen uber elite families are the cause of this hysteria with Covid and the race riots. Covid=shutdown the economy. BLM/race issues = divide us. They are doing a dang good job. They must be losing crazy money under Trump or Trump is actually part of this whole thing as a bad actor in order to loot Americas treasury. I don't trust anyone in power right now.   

Edited by PRyan2012

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Exceptionally positive results out today from the phase 2 vaccine trial from biontech/Pfizer. The phase 3 will take a number of months, but I’m more confident today about the 2021 Olympics happening than I was yesterday..And I was fairly confident before. 

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On 6/29/2020 at 6:59 PM, PRyan2012 said:

COVID 19 is 99% political and is not very deadly at all. Under 1% death rate for those who do get it. They could have picked any flu strain and played it all over the worlds media companies and the death rate would have been close to the same. This is a manufactured crisis and will go away if Trump loses. So Olympics is 50/50 if Trump wins and 99.9 if he loses. A few dozen uber elite families are the cause of this hysteria with Covid and the race riots. Covid=shutdown the economy. BLM/race issues = divide us. They are doing a dang good job. They must be losing crazy money under Trump or Trump is actually part of this whole thing as a bad actor in order to loot Americas treasury. I don't trust anyone in power right now.   

I'd ask you to show statistics, but you can't.

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On 6/29/2020 at 8:59 PM, PRyan2012 said:

COVID 19 is 99% political and is not very deadly at all. Under 1% death rate for those who do get it. They could have picked any flu strain and played it all over the worlds media companies and the death rate would have been close to the same. This is a manufactured crisis and will go away if Trump loses. So Olympics is 50/50 if Trump wins and 99.9 if he loses. A few dozen uber elite families are the cause of this hysteria with Covid and the race riots. Covid=shutdown the economy. BLM/race issues = divide us. They are doing a dang good job. They must be losing crazy money under Trump or Trump is actually part of this whole thing as a bad actor in order to loot Americas treasury. I don't trust anyone in power right now.   

 

27 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

I'd ask you to show statistics, but you can't.

He did! 19, 99%, 1%, 50/50, 99.9, few dozen, divide... How much more do you want?

 

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On 6/29/2020 at 8:59 PM, PRyan2012 said:

COVID 19 is 99% political and is not very deadly at all. Under 1% death rate for those who do get it. They could have picked any flu strain and played it all over the worlds media companies and the death rate would have been close to the same. This is a manufactured crisis and will go away if Trump loses. So Olympics is 50/50 if Trump wins and 99.9 if he loses. A few dozen uber elite families are the cause of this hysteria with Covid and the race riots. Covid=shutdown the economy. BLM/race issues = divide us. They are doing a dang good job. They must be losing crazy money under Trump or Trump is actually part of this whole thing as a bad actor in order to loot Americas treasury. I don't trust anyone in power right now.   

This right here is pretty much why hospitalizations (note I did not say cases) are rising in several states...

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Boy people sure have short memories and like to change the narrative for some reason...the "experts" have said from the very beginning that it isn't about keeping people from getting it, it is about stopping the massive influx of people rushing to the hospitals...anyone remember "flattening the curve"??  Where I live there is an "increase" in number of cases and the local government is freaking out and shutting everything down again...out of the some ~1000 hospital beds in the area, there are about 10 that are being taken up by "Covid cases".  This is 100% a politically motivated thing...not necessarily in regards to the new strain of the SARs virus as that is obviously very much real...but it sure is political in how the US thinks it should be handled and is handling it.  And the proof starts with how they label deaths here in the US...if someone dies and they test positive for the virus it is labeled a Covid death regardless if Covid caused the death.  Don't believe me google the heath department head that explains how deaths are labeled for Covid positive people...she literally says this exact thing.  There are other examples of how this is political and as someone else pointed out...if Trump doesn't get reelected in Nov this Covid crap all goes away.  Scary how people can't see that...and I am not even a Trump fan.

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57 minutes ago, dman115 said:

Boy people sure have short memories and like to change the narrative for some reason...the "experts" have said from the very beginning that it isn't about keeping people from getting it, it is about stopping the massive influx of people rushing to the hospitals...anyone remember "flattening the curve"??  Where I live there is an "increase" in number of cases and the local government is freaking out and shutting everything down again...out of the some ~1000 hospital beds in the area, there are about 10 that are being taken up by "Covid cases".  This is 100% a politically motivated thing...not necessarily in regards to the new strain of the SARs virus as that is obviously very much real...but it sure is political in how the US thinks it should be handled and is handling it.  And the proof starts with how they label deaths here in the US...if someone dies and they test positive for the virus it is labeled a Covid death regardless if Covid caused the death.  Don't believe me google the heath department head that explains how deaths are labeled for Covid positive people...she literally says this exact thing.  There are other examples of how this is political and as someone else pointed out...if Trump doesn't get reelected in Nov this Covid crap all goes away.  Scary how people can't see that...and I am not even a Trump fan.

It's about ICU beds not regular beds. They're filling up.

And although there's some truth to the labeling issue, the numbers of deaths overall this year is above the last few years and by more than the number labeled covid.

I agree that this situation might go away if Trump is gone next year. Most every other country was able to clear it up.

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It’s amazing to me how many people with little more than a background in high school science suddenly think they know more than the leading experts on disease in the country. They justify these opinions with discredited “studies” and comments from conspiracists/snake oil salesmen, when the truth of the matter isn’t up for debate and has been known for months. 

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3 hours ago, headshuck said:

Does anyone know if Q2 total deaths relating to pneumonia, heart, flu, covid, etc was up or down compared to the prior year?

Would be better to look at all-cause mortality rates. its how flu deaths tolls from previous years are calculated. and when you do that you see that way more people are dying in the USA than usual. if you subtract the deaths that are officially labeled covid related, you STILL get a massive surge of deaths higher than what you'd expect. 

The actual covid death toll is likely 25 to 50% higher than is officially being reported. 

And this phenomenon is happening all over the world. 

https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/04/16/tracking-covid-19-excess-deaths-across-countries

It's sad that some people an only process news from a being politically motivated perspective, but only a completely insane person would think so many cities in Europe are racking up 10 of thousands of excess deaths all to go along with some anti-Trump media campaign. 

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Lol, so following this logic was the covid crisis in Italy where they literally shut down everything except stores that sell food a plot to remove whoever the Italian president is?  Because they had one of the most strict lock downs on the planet for a while.

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38 minutes ago, Shiraz123 said:

Lol, so following this logic was the covid crisis in Italy where they literally shut down everything except stores that sell food a plot to remove whoever the Italian president is?  Because they had one of the most strict lock downs on the planet for a while.

And the initial one in Wuhan?

XI whiz!

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i won't pretend to know all that goes in to it. and i won't pretend to be up on the latest.

my two issues (atm) are

1) there's so much (dis)information about how covid deaths are tallied that i don't trust it either way

2) what is truly the situation with hydroxycholorquine? (sp)

 

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2 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

i won't pretend to know all that goes in to it. and i won't pretend to be up on the latest.

my two issues (atm) are

1) there's so much (dis)information about how covid deaths are tallied that i don't trust it either way

Even if the number isn’t exactly correct, a ton of people have died from it. There definitely isn’t a conspiracy to change the numbers though and accounting for an exact cause of death isn’t always trivial. Whether the number is 110K, 130K, or 150K is of less consequence than the trend of whether these deaths are increasing/decreasing. The bottom line is that we know that approximately somewhere between 0.5 and 1% of those infected die due to the disease-this is a very high CFR for a disease that has the potential to infect 300 million people in the US.

Quote

2) what is truly the situation with hydroxycholorquine? (sp)

 

It doesn’t work. It showed zero efficacy in the double blind trial that was carried out. The studies that claim efficacy were poorly constructed and highly biased. Anyone claiming otherwise is nuts. The only two drugs that have shown efficacy thus far are Remdesivir and dexamethasone, but neither has demonstrated a dramatic benefit. Why anybody thought a repurposed drug would show a dramatic benefit is beyond me, but there are some more promising monoclonal antibodies in clinical trials targeted directly at the virus. Expect results in the next couple of months.

Edited by Billyhoyle

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you're answer to #1 is totally devoid of certainties.

response to #2: why did CNN write several pieces poo-pooing   it and then recently (like two days ago) say it's working. (this isn't rhetorical. i literally haven't looked into anything the last few days).

i also saw a report that China has basically said it's creating Remdesivir even though it's breaking patent laws. fwiw. idk if it's true but it would corraborate what you're saying (that it works).

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9 minutes ago, Husker_Du said:

you're answer to #1 is totally devoid of certainties.

response to #2: why did CNN write several pieces poo-pooing   it and then recently (like two days ago) say it's working. (this isn't rhetorical. i literally haven't looked into anything the last few days).

i also saw a report that China has basically said it's creating Remdesivir even though it's breaking patent laws. fwiw. idk if it's true but it would corraborate what you're saying (that it works).

CNN doesn’t know what they’re talking about when it comes to science. They saw a BS study that was not double blinded and believed it or posted it because they thought it would get clicks. Do yourself a favor though and if you get covid, don’t try to get HCQ. 
 

China violating US pharma patents is par for the course with them. 
 

And yeah, my answer to number 1 is that we don’t know an exact number, but that’s not really important or surprising and all we can go off of for now is the best estimate. In the coming years, there will be retrospective studies that analyze expected vs observed deaths and more accurately pinpoint the true total. So not saying you’re wrong, just that the best we can do for now is this current method of tallying deaths. That’s why I keep saying CFR is between 0.5 and 1 percent and don’t try to give an exact number.

Edited by Billyhoyle

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25 minutes ago, Husker_Du said:

response to #2: why did CNN write several pieces poo-pooing   it and then recently (like two days ago) say it's working. (this isn't rhetorical. i literally haven't looked into anything the last few days).

Not quite. CNN showed a report that looked like it worked but the article also said researchers doubted it. As is often the case, the headline diverged from the article.

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10 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

you're answer to #1 is totally devoid of certainties.

response to #2: why did CNN write several pieces poo-pooing   it and then recently (like two days ago) say it's working. (this isn't rhetorical. i literally haven't looked into anything the last few days).

i also saw a report that China has basically said it's creating Remdesivir even though it's breaking patent laws. fwiw. idk if it's true but it would corraborate what you're saying (that it works).

WRT/1

The CDC keeps a tally of deaths, obviously.  The US is a large country with a large sample set and so has a predictable statistic, which they call expected deaths. The number of deaths this year, without regard to cause, exceeds the expected number by the same amount we are seeing reported. 

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