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If the unsportsmanlike behavior is right after the match, I give the guy some leeway. These are ultra-competitive people and it's tough to turn that switch off in an instant. If they're unsportsmanlike an hour or a day later, all bets are off.

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1 hour ago, VakAttack said:

The Metcalf one is not really involved here.  You can get mad about it, but there was time on the clock.

There APPEARED to be time on the clock from the video. Back then video graphic clocks weren't in sync with actual clocks. I think DC started celebrating a little early but not the 3 seconds it seemed to show. And I'm pretty sure time was up before BM got there. Possibly before DC started the actual flip.

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3 hours ago, 1032004 said:

I would disagree, I think he decided that with about 20 seconds left.

Side note, I can’t find the full video any more but this one shows the end.  I believe this video starts right after he was penalized for basically punching him in the head.   Then he doubles him after the whistle, does the cartwheel/head kick, then the Kimura.   I think people forget about all those other things and only remember the kimura.

 

But yeah, the past 2 years his worst antics were actually in wins (and all pale in comparison to the Micic match).

its really hard to separate the idiocy from the malice... but I'm not worried about it I just thought it was worth a mention.

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5 hours ago, Fletcher said:

If the unsportsmanlike behavior is right after the match, I give the guy some leeway. These are ultra-competitive people and it's tough to turn that switch off in an instant. If they're unsportsmanlike an hour or a day later, all bets are off.

Agreed - a good example of this is "the stomp" of Anthony Robles. People freaked out, understandably. But it was born more of frustration than unsportsmanlike behavior, with the sincere apology afterward backing that up.

It is also worth noting that the way Robles handled it was 100% pure class. 

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5 hours ago, Fletcher said:

If the unsportsmanlike behavior is right after the match, I give the guy some leeway. These are ultra-competitive people and it's tough to turn that switch off in an instant. If they're unsportsmanlike an hour or a day later, all bets are off.

This is silly imho. Morality only applies when its easy? its the opposite of reality.

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7 hours ago, VakAttack said:

Desanto performed an actual illegal move.  Metcalf was chasing Caldwell around with (short) time on the clock, it's not like he made Caldwell do a backflip.  For instance, if Caldwell, for whatever reason, started doing a backflip in the middle of the second period, what should Metcalf have done?  There is no scenario where it's ok for Desanto to do what he did to Micic.

Last time I checked, a slam is just as illegal as a kimura. Metcalf has a responsibility to safely return his opponent to the mat, and his mid-air shove absolutely qualified as a slam under that rule. Also just rewatched, and there was not time on the clock either. Caldwell started running away at :01, started his cartwheel as the clock hit :00, and Metcalf didn't shove him until another 1-2 seconds later after the ref blew the whistle about 10 times. 

Your second period backflip hypothetical is insane for obvious reasons, but Metcalf shouldn't have done what he did in that case either as it wouldn't result in any points. If he was trying to score, he would tackle caldwell and cover for 2, not shove him away in mid-air. At least Desanto was attempting a move that had been used in a wrestling match before. 

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6 hours ago, 1032004 said:

I would disagree, I think he decided that with about 20 seconds left.

Side note, I can’t find the full video any more but this one shows the end.  I believe this video starts right after he was penalized for basically punching him in the head.   Then he doubles him after the whistle, does the cartwheel/head kick, then the Kimura.   I think people forget about all those other things and only remember the kimura.

 

But yeah, the past 2 years his worst antics were actually in wins (and all pale in comparison to the Micic match).

I don't think he was thinking "kimura" when he attacked. I think he was frustrated, fell into the position after the failed cartwheel, and just cranked on whatever he could get a hold of. Still unacceptable. I just don't think he set out in those final 15 seconds with the goal of injuring Micic.

And also you made a great point about he actually has had more issues with wins than losses. I'm always way more worried he's going to do something bad after he wins than when he loses. Once he gets that killer instinct going, it's hard to shut off for him.

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12 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

I don't think he was thinking "kimura" when he attacked. I think he was frustrated, fell into the position after the failed cartwheel, and just cranked on whatever he could get a hold of. Still unacceptable. I just don't think he set out in those final 15 seconds with the goal of injuring Micic.

And also you made a great point about he actually has had more issues with wins than losses. I'm always way more worried he's going to do something bad after he wins than when he loses. Once he gets that killer instinct going, it's hard to shut off for him.

I don’t think he decided “kimura,” but I think he decided he didn’t really care if he injured Micic

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19 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Metcalf has a responsibility to safely return his opponent to the mat, and his mid-air shove absolutely qualified as a slam under that rule.

Nope. It absolutely does NOT qualify as a slam. Metcalf didnt lift him to that position. 

RULE 7, SEC. 1, ART. 1: A slam is lifting and returning an opponent to the mat with unnecessary force. This infraction may be committed by a contestant in either the top or bottom position on the mat, as well as during a takedown. A slam shall be called without hesitation.

 

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20 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

I don’t think he decided “kimura,” but I think he decided he didn’t really care if he injured Micic

thats close to where i am at. He had a pinky toe in "trying to win", 7 toes in "save face and i am crazy" and two toes in "hurt the guy".

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2012 EIWA Tournament was the worst case of unsportsmanlike conduct I have seen in my 55 years of watching and competing. Billy George of Cornell was wrestling Nathaniel Brown from Lehigh. Winner qualified for nationals. Right as the match finished George stood up and dropped down kneeing Brown in the head. Brown was unable to go to nationals and had to drop a class or two that semester. George was back next year wrestling and I don’t remember Cornell punishing him with the loss of any matches. I was matside and saw the whole thing unfold. 

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9 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

 Anthony Valencia starting punching Chris Perry

Let’s be honest about what happened... Not one punch was thrown... Valencia threw a fit and started throwing slaps like an old woman...

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Last time I checked, a slam is just as illegal as a kimura. Metcalf has a responsibility to safely return his opponent to the mat, and his mid-air shove absolutely qualified as a slam under that rule. Also just rewatched, and there was not time on the clock either. Caldwell started running away at :01, started his cartwheel as the clock hit :00, and Metcalf didn't shove him until another 1-2 seconds later after the ref blew the whistle about 10 times. 
Your second period backflip hypothetical is insane for obvious reasons, but Metcalf shouldn't have done what he did in that case either as it wouldn't result in any points. If he was trying to score, he would tackle caldwell and cover for 2, not shove him away in mid-air. At least Desanto was attempting a move that had been used in a wrestling match before. 


It's not a slam, Metcalf didn't lift him off the ground. You're right on the time, though. I haven't rewatched this match in a long time.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

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52 minutes ago, LJB said:

Let’s be honest about what happened... Not one punch was thrown... Valencia threw a fit and started throwing slaps like an old woman...

That is so True. His stand-up definitely needs work!x

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19 hours ago, VakAttack said:


 

 


It's not a slam, Metcalf didn't lift him off the ground. You're right on the time, though. I haven't rewatched this match in a long time.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

 

Vak, I never commented on that match before so here goes. While I thought what BM did was wrong, he probably would not have and certainly would not have had the opportunity had DC not started doing backflips or before the end of the match. I thought it was a ****ty and unsportsmanlike thing to do as was Brent teeing of on Caldwell. I'm not a fan of either and I thought both acted like a douche.

Edited by ConnorsDad

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9 hours ago, gimpeltf said:

There APPEARED to be time on the clock from the video. Back then video graphic clocks weren't in sync with actual clocks. I think DC started celebrating a little early but not the 3 seconds it seemed to show. And I'm pretty sure time was up before BM got there. Possibly before DC started the actual flip.

The visual display on the television or in the arena is irrelevant.  The only thing that matters is whether the whistle clearly sounded before Metcalf started his lunge.  I am not sure it did.  In short time situations athletes aren't (and shouldn't be) watching the clock.

Edited by JHRoseWrestling
Typo

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5 hours ago, JHRoseWrestling said:

The visual display on the television or in the arena is irrelevant.  The only thing that matters is whether the whistle clearly sounded before Metcalf started his lunge.  I am not sure it did.  In short time situations athletes aren't (and shouldn't be) watching the clock.

That's not the point at all. My statement was referring to posters saying how much time was left by viewing the video. I made no reference to the legality of what happened.

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