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Suriano decided to go 125 this year (inside source)

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15 hours ago, AHamilton said:

I think the ostarine makes it easier to lose weight and keep the muscle.

Terrible that he showed such poor judgment and is willing to gamble with his health like this.

By the way, where would one get this weight-loss, muscle retention drug? I need to make sure this doesn't accidentally happen to me.

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4 hours ago, fadzaev2 said:

Not sure people want to be messing with stuff like that......remember Creatine, which was a disaster......3 lives lost, no more saunas, 7 pounds added on to the weight classes, never to be taken away, one hour weigh-ins.........

“Remember” creatine?  Isn’t it still widely used and considered safe?

I never realized it was ever implicated in those deaths, although quick google search reveals it was ruled out.

Was that when creatine first came out or something?  I never thought anyone used it when cutting weight, isn’t it supposed to help gain weight/muscle?

Edited by 1032004

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If this is true it is pretty baller!

However, it is possible he is saying it is his "vision quest" to get some revenge on Spencer however, despite Spencer's reputation and stellar 2 NCAA tournaments , he is also moving away from a loaded, landmine filled 133 bracket that potentially includes Fix, Micic and RBY and his odds to win a title may actually increase just a bit at 125 considering some of Lee's inconsistencies.

Now if Fix and Micic also went 125 well then.....lookout!

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21 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

“Remember” creatine?  Isn’t it still widely used and considered safe?

I never realized it was ever implicated in those deaths, although quick google search reveals it was ruled out.

Was that when creatine first came out or something?  I never thought anyone used it when cutting weight, isn’t it supposed to help gain weight/muscle?

I have nothing definitive but I think creatine was designed more for football use to gain weight. I also think there might have been some other additives in the earlier versions or possibly the kids might have been taking dietary supplements that could have caused further problems. One is trying to increase and the other decrease. This added to the stupid weighin rules of the time wasn't a good mix.

No deaths for a hundred or so years before and none for 20-some after. 3 within a few months? Something weird going on that year.

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1 hour ago, gimpeltf said:

I have nothing definitive but I think creatine was designed more for football use to gain weight. I also think there might have been some other additives in the earlier versions or possibly the kids might have been taking dietary supplements that could have caused further problems. One is trying to increase and the other decrease. This added to the stupid weighin rules of the time wasn't a good mix.

No deaths for a hundred or so years before and none for 20-some after. 3 within a few months? Something weird going on that year.

Scapegoat, IMO.

Something along the lines of, "The kids died. They all had X, Y, and Z in their system when they died. Keep saying X and it will be blamed."

As if cutting MASSIVE amounts of weight is even remotely healthy. Then add in the large flux in short amounts of time. Now add limited water intake/dehydration. And THEN put them in a sauna with multiple layers, all the while doing full-body exercises.

[sarcasm]Yeah, it was the creatine.[/sarcasm]

Article: HERE.

Edited by RealAmericanHero

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2 minutes ago, RealAmericanHero said:

Scapegoat, IMO.

Something along the lines of, "The kids died. They all had X, Y, and Z in their system when they died. Keep saying X and it will be blamed."

As if cutting MASSIVE amounts of weight is even remotely healthy. Then add in the large flux in short amounts of time. Now add limited water intake/dehydration. And THEN put them in a sauna with multiple layers, all the while doing full-body exercises.

Yeah, it was the creatine.

Again, nothing for a hundred years before, nothing in twenty years since. They lost massive amounts for a long time before and some after. A little less after maybe. Millions of weigh-ins. No deaths. It's not all about weight cutting by itself.

And I didn't say it was just the creatine.

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My apologies - I was 100% agreeing with you that it was NOT the creatine.
Creatine was a factor in their deaths. Not the only factor, but it's there.

Sure, the Creatine itself didn't kill the wrestlers. But, the massive weight cutting combined with creatine killed these guys.





Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk

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14 minutes ago, cjc007 said:

Creatine was a factor in their deaths. Not the only factor, but it's there.

Sure, the Creatine itself didn't kill the wrestlers. But, the massive weight cutting combined with creatine killed these guys.





Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk
 

The following is a mere joke. And probably a bad/ill-timed joke, but I’m sending it anyway - 

One might say “6% of those deaths were due to Creatine”.

I’ll show myself out.

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Creatine works to keep water in the body's cells.  Saunas and plastics work to dehydrate the body.  

It's kinda like the Ghostbusters crossing the streams......two very strong forces working against each other in a very volatile arena, **** just implodes.

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17 hours ago, cjc007 said:

Creatine was a factor in their deaths. Not the only factor, but it's there.

Sure, the Creatine itself didn't kill the wrestlers. But, the massive weight cutting combined with creatine killed these guys.





Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk
 

 

23 hours ago, gimpeltf said:

Again, nothing for a hundred years before, nothing in twenty years since. They lost massive amounts for a long time before and some after. A little less after maybe. Millions of weigh-ins. No deaths. It's not all about weight cutting by itself.

And I didn't say it was just the creatine.

 

On 9/14/2020 at 12:40 PM, 1032004 said:

“Remember” creatine?  Isn’t it still widely used and considered safe?

I never realized it was ever implicated in those deaths, although quick google search reveals it was ruled out.

Was that when creatine first came out or something?  I never thought anyone used it when cutting weight, isn’t it supposed to help gain weight/muscle?

All 3 of those athletes Had taken weight cutting pills not creatinine, they practiced, took pills that are designed to suck water weight out of you ( mostly used by women) and went to a sauna.

i had a teammate who foolishly tried making 103 for a 2nd straight year and it was a brutal cut and towards the end of the year he started taking these pills and not telling anyone and he collapsed one day had a seizure and was on the verge of kidney failure. A week or so later our school brought in these Sports nutrition/dietician people and they went over the 3 different wrestlers dying and they told us the main cause of damage to there bodies was caused by these same type of “diet” pills.. I believe creatinine was just the buzzword at the time that got thrown under the bus, but they were adamant that these pills will kill you if you take them while cutting weight and over training everyday 

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50 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

All 3 of those athletes Had taken weight cutting pills not creatinine, they practiced, took pills that are designed to suck water weight out of you ( mostly used by women) and went to a sauna.

i had a teammate who foolishly tried making 103 for a 2nd straight year and it was a brutal cut and towards the end of the year he started taking these pills and not telling anyone and he collapsed one day had a seizure and was on the verge of kidney failure. A week or so later our school brought in these Sports nutrition/dietician people and they went over the 3 different wrestlers dying and they told us the main cause of damage to there bodies was caused by these same type of “diet” pills.. I believe creatinine was just the buzzword at the time that got thrown under the bus, but they were adamant that these pills will kill you if you take them while cutting weight and over training everyday 

I think 2 had been taking creatine. However, not necessarily in the days immediately leading to their deaths. My thoughts were that they might have been taking ephedrine (or some related substance). For those that might have noticed creatinin being mentioned, that's not necessarily due to taking creatine. Creatinin is manufactured by the body during times where the body is undergoing situations of excessive heat (I think this is how it was described- don't quote me). 

This is why I had been saying it wasn't just the weighin rules (although those days they were pretty stupid) nor creatine. Add all this together with other supplements and you have a perfect storm.

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On 9/14/2020 at 12:40 PM, 1032004 said:

“Remember” creatine?  Isn’t it still widely used and considered safe?

I never realized it was ever implicated in those deaths, although quick google search reveals it was ruled out.

Was that when creatine first came out or something?  I never thought anyone used it when cutting weight, isn’t it supposed to help gain weight/muscle?

The way I understood it, they were using it while cutting weight, and their kidneys shut down.

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On 9/14/2020 at 7:45 PM, cjc007 said:

Creatine was a factor in their deaths. Not the only factor, but it's there.

Sure, the Creatine itself didn't kill the wrestlers. But, the massive weight cutting combined with creatine killed these guys.





Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk
 

Please explain the evidence or the science behind how creatine caused their deaths

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9 hours ago, Cradle1 said:

Please explain the evidence or the science behind how creatine caused their deaths

He said a factor.  The factor being that creatine works to hold water in your body's cells, more specifically in this context in the muscle's cells for enhanced recovery after training.  When you are dehydrating yourself, while also using creatine, you are basically creating a civil war in your body.

Nobody knows how much of a factor creatine was, maybe nothing more than the proverbial last straw, maybe more.  But that is where the conflict between two things you are doing to your body that are on opposite ends of a spectrum.

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1 hour ago, Lurker said:

He said a factor.  The factor being that creatine works to hold water in your body's cells, more specifically in this context in the muscle's cells for enhanced recovery after training.  When you are dehydrating yourself, while also using creatine, you are basically creating a civil war in your body.

Nobody knows how much of a factor creatine was, maybe nothing more than the proverbial last straw, maybe more.  But that is where the conflict between two things you are doing to your body that are on opposite ends of a spectrum.

How much of a factor was creatine in the death of the kid who didn't take it?

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1 hour ago, Lurker said:

He said a factor.  The factor being that creatine works to hold water in your body's cells, more specifically in this context in the muscle's cells for enhanced recovery after training.  When you are dehydrating yourself, while also using creatine, you are basically creating a civil war in your body.

Nobody knows how much of a factor creatine was, maybe nothing more than the proverbial last straw, maybe more.  But that is where the conflict between two things you are doing to your body that are on opposite ends of a spectrum.

 

10 minutes ago, AHamilton said:

How much of a factor was creatine in the death of the kid who didn't take it?

Did you read what he said?

Also, if you are referencing my post stating that two did take, that meant I am aware of statements saying that two did take it not anything about the third. He might have he might not have.

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9 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

 

Did you read what he said?

Also, if you are referencing my post stating that two did take, that meant I am aware of statements saying that two did take it not anything about the third. He might have he might not have.

I read every word he said.  I'm looking more at the weigh in rules from that year.

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27 minutes ago, AHamilton said:

How much of a factor was creatine in the death of the kid who didn't take it?

Do you have a real question, or...?

And before you asked said non question, did you comprehend where I mentioned nobody knows how much if any a factor creatine was, but was just answering how taking creatine while dehydrating yourself could have a bad effect?  So obviously that doesn't apply to the person you are referring to in your non question.

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3 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Do you have a real question, or...?

And before you asked said non question, did you comprehend where I mentioned nobody knows how much if any a factor creatine was, but was just answering how taking creatine while dehydrating yourself could have a bad effect?  So obviously that doesn't apply to the person you are referring to in your non question.

Read my non-response above.

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