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HoundedHawk

My thoughts on Logan Stieber

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but I'll give Stieber the benefit that he had enough points on the board to edge 2013 out.

 

Im sure Logan is glad to have the benefit of the doubt.. hahah especially considering they reviewed it. Even more so considering, had they overturned it, he would have still been winning.

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But is that not what you implied with your original post?

Perhaps your powers of observation noticed I posted two pics on his back while the camera had time to change angles. I believe absolutely there was NF, possibly a pin.

 

if you are saying Stieber should have been pinned - you are wrong - and demonstrably so.

You have demonstrated ZERO. And your post is disingenous. last night I went frame by frame breaking it down into tenths of a second. The minimum even any biased moron could count Stieber on his back was 2.2 seconds.

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last night I went frame by frame breaking it down into tenths of a second. The minimum even any biased moron could count Stieber on his back was 2.2 seconds.

 

HAHAHAHA

 

I can guarantee you this, Not even Tony Ramos or the Brands went back frame by frame breaking it down to a tenth of a second..

They dont seem to be complaining, why are you?

 

Maybe because both Ramos and Brands accept who the better wrestler is. It is not hard to come to that conclusion when you are 0-5. He is capable of winning, but not a better wrestler.

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I posted two pics on his back while the camera had time to change angles.

 

1.You know those 2 pictures are almost certainly from different cameras...right? And even if they arnt...it would take a rotating camera about 1 second to move the amount of space from one frame to the next - so what is your point?

 

2. Im not sure you know what the word disingenuous means anymore...

 

3. Breaking it down frame by frame into tenths of a second is the entire problem you are having. Watch it at full speed - absolutely no way to call a fall, period. :roll:

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I agreed with the no-call based on the referee's behavior. Since the angle on TV makes it very hard to tell when Stieber's shoulders were less than 45 degrees from the mat, I have to take the official's word for it on at least that part. After Ramos locked up the cradle and took Stieber down, the ref's right hand goes out. This was not a count. It was him indicating a takedown for the wrestler wearing the green anklet (Ramos). Then he swipes with his left hand for a first count. As he is swiping a 2nd time, Stieber comes off his back before he finishes the count.

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All you crazy hawk fans do realize that the review camera is differnt then what is show on tv?? Fans as knowledgable as you guys should know that I would assume...but guess not. Anyway, I think it is hillarious that they couldn't get a good review because Troll #2 was infront of the camera....karma at it's best!

 

And for the record....I thought it should have been 2 and 2. But still think the outcome would have been the same....the better wrestler won and will always win when these two wrestle.

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You know those 2 pictures are almost certainly from different cameras...?

Duh, I meant the camera view, LOL, not a specific camera moving all around.The point was that he was still on his back when they took the time to switch to another view.

 

Breaking it down frame by frame into tenths of a second is the entire problem you are having. Watch it at full speed - absolutely no way to call a fall, period.

Moving the goalposts doesn't help. My picture was showing Stieber on his back, not to prove an absolute pin. Disingenous.

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After Ramos locked up the cradle and took Stieber down, the ref's right hand goes out. This was not a count. It was him indicating a takedown for the wrestler wearing the green anklet (Ramos). Then he swipes with his left hand for a first count. As he is swiping a 2nd time, Stieber comes off his back before he finishes the count.

No, his first swipe included the TD call, and the second swipe with his left hand then even put two out for NF. He then changed his mind.

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I can guarantee you this, Not even Tony Ramos or the Brands went back frame by frame breaking it down to a tenth of a second..

They dont seem to be complaining, why are you?

Are you blind? They were complaining vehemently. And you have no idea whether they later went back and looked at it frame by frame. You can't speak for them.

 

And who is the better wrestler is irrelevant on whether Steiber received grace on this specific call. He did.

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And for the record....I thought it should have been 2 and 2. But still think the outcome would have been the same....the better wrestler won and will always win when these two wrestle.

Don't say "always."

 

/Mark Perry

 

I can appreciate this, for sure.

 

I don't think you can say Ramos will "always" lose - but I do think there is more of a gap then between Taylor/Dake for example.

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My gut tells me Stieber wins anyway, buy after reviewing it in live speed & slow mo.... that is a blown call by Hagerty. Maybe he was out of position.....slow to react...delayed on the swipes, but that doesn't change the fact that Ramos stopped Stiebers reaction momentum and had the 45 broken for 2++ seconds. Bad calls are made.... unfortunately its part of the game

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Certainly could have been 2. We are forgetting the fact that Ramos has taken stieber down 1 time in 5 matches. Regardless, Stieber gets his ride time and is up 1 in the 3rd. I was surrounded by hawkeye fans at the arena, as we all were, which is great that they have that kind of support. However, many of the fans surrounding me seemed delusional or uninformed the entire tournament. Making comments that were glaringly false. It's 1 thing to be a great supporter, it's another to be ignorant and a poor sportsman.

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I know there are good iowa fans out there and there are bad fans from every school, just think about your fanhood before next year's tournament. Great fans and great wrestling make that event the best in the nation. Lastly, that wasn't a fall even in freestyle, happened way to fast.

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People keep saying that Ramos has never taken Stieber down before. This is just incorrect. He took him down first in the Big 10 Finals last year, and had a lead in the match because of it. He scored a reversal in the NCAA semifinals. And he took him down, obviously, in this NCAA Finals match. It's ridiculous the lengths that people will go to try to discredit this clearly blown call. "Oh, even if they give Ramos the backpoints, Logan would still definitely win and definitely take him down, etc." As if they've never watched wrestling in history.

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Nobody here is saying that they took away TOny Ramo's win, except for the people who are arguing (wrongly, IMO) that there was a fall. They are saying that they took away Ramos' best opportunity to win. My favorite is when people say that Tony should have just scored more at the end of the match. You know, because it's so easy to score on Logan Stieber that he should be able to easily overcome having two points he earned taken away from him.

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Maybe it was Terry Brands' legs that took away Tony Ramos' best chance. Can you at least accept this as a possibility?

 

I've already showed the pictures. There are no pictures that show Terry BRands in front of the camera while Stieber is on his back. He does get in front of the camera after Stieber is off his back. The referee may have been blocking the review, though, because that angle is tough to tell how high the camera is.

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Maybe it was Terry Brands' legs that took away Tony Ramos' best chance. Can you at least accept this as a possibility?

 

Id also like to add...talking about what is "a possibility" is somewhat useless - isnt it a possibility that Logan Stieber's father paid the ref off just before the match just in case Logan got into a tough/borderline situation?? Sure, it is possible! Is it useful to talk about possibilities? No.

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Id also like to add...talking about what is "a possibility" is somewhat useless - isnt it a possibility that Logan Stieber's father paid the ref off just before the match just in case Logan got into a tough/borderline situation?? Sure, it is possible! Is it useful to talk about possibilities? No.

 

Yeah, because Ramos getting a TD in a match where he'd already gotten one and was in deep again later on is just as unlikely as Logan Stieber's grandfather bribing an official. Totally helpful addition to the conversation.

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Yeah, because Ramos getting a TD in a match where he'd already gotten one and was in deep again later on is just as unlikely as Logan Stieber's grandfather bribing an official. Totally helpful addition to the conversation.

 

I didn't say it was? My point was getting into the "Don't you think this is at least possible?" game is totally useless.

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Maybe it was Terry Brands' legs that took away Tony Ramos' best chance. Can you at least accept this as a possibility?

 

Id also like to add...talking about what is "a possibility" is somewhat useless - isnt it a possibility that Logan Stieber's father paid the ref off just before the match just in case Logan got into a tough/borderline situation?? Sure, it is possible! Is it useful to talk about possibilities? No.

 

Good lord...

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