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Willie Trials

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59 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Seems like Andy Hamilton would disagree with you - not only did he do an interview with the guy more known for "gossip" (although does have a few legit interviews as well), he appears to be happy with the status of wrestling media:

 

I certainly didn't mean to say I was unhappy with the status of wrestling media nor was my point aimed at Stalemates directly (definitely has a unique style and keeps it light, all the power to them), so I don't think Andy and I are disagreeing about anything.  It's also not about any individual Flo personality, more a general discontent of what fans tend to focus on and what people will pay for.  I'm probably jaded by spending too much time on this message board + what blows over from twitter, so it hopefully isn't a true representation of online wrestling fandom.

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6 minutes ago, hammerlockthree said:

"be back soon"

your post still makes no sense.

"bulletin board system"

you obviously are not old enough to remember 14k dial ups...

as to the rest...

someone else will have to paint you the picture...

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Flo started a FRL with results from a Flo card and then talked about the big news of Eierman beating Khinchegashvili later on.Im not a Iowa fan so not complaining that Eierman didn't get the headline.The issue I have is Flo should be leading the show with the big news regardless of who's network it happened on.ESPN starts sports center with the big NFL game it doesn't matter if it aired on ESPN,CBS or FOX.Flo claims they want to grow wrestling but in reality they want to control it.Theyre showing that in the open in the  Willie trial

Edited by calot

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17 minutes ago, HokieHWT said:

He just aged himself. That’s “bulletin board system”, which pre-dates email. I’m not that old, I just Google everything.

ha...

i had a square buttoned 4k trash 80 grey market from japan in the late 70s...

used to key in programs and save them on a legit tape recorder...

programed turtles on apple IIE using boot discs...

i remember when a 286 was the tits...

tape backups?

oh yeah...

i even once used a legit slide rule...

now, my 2 year old iphone can get the best of me...

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1 hour ago, calot said:

The issue I have is Flo should be leading the show with the big news regardless of who's network it happened on.ESPN starts sports center with the big NFL game it doesn't matter if it aired on ESPN,CBS or FOX.

the issue with this analogy is ESPN/ABC, CBS & FOX are all partners with the NFL to the tune of billions of dollars. A better analogy would be ESPN's coverage of UFC compared to their coverage of Bellator. But in reality no analogy is adequate because the football and wrestling operate in extremely different positions in the sports media landscape. 

If you want to be blunt about it, Flo's objective is to get as many subscribers as possible. Deduce our motives from that and you'll get closer to the truth than starting from what you personally would prefer we do and then imagining the economics behind what that would entail out of thin air. 

Which is to say, we spend a lot of time and resources on the NCAA tournament, which ESPN has the exclusive right to. We aren't going bump that content for some other tournament we might be streaming during the same weekend. We're going to do our best to present the wrestling content people most want to see. that's still never going to be the exact same content for every fan or subscriber, so there will always be disagreements about whether we made the right choice in what topic was led with on FRL. 

Edited by Jaroslav Hasek

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The only issue with Flo is that they aren't what some people want them to be: wrestling journalists chasing down truth. They are a video production and event company that sometimes breaks news, which is fine. Flo won't publish anything that risks their access. This is a common complaint with ESPN and the NFL as well. It's how you get last year's video interview of Bader and Dake where it became clear that the only question anyone cares about (what was your injury) had been deemed off limits with Flo's agreement. It was clumsy, but Flo gets what they (and their subscribers) want, an interview with Dake to publish. Bader should have asked the question and let Dake refuse to answer, but it wasn't surprising considering who Flo is and claims to be.

If you're like me, this is all OK. I only subscribe to watch the matches and some of the FloFilms. I don't listen to FRL or their other shows, and I'm not that interested in the interviews they do. Others may disagree.

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6 hours ago, Jaroslav Hasek said:

the issue with this analogy is ESPN/ABC, CBS & FOX are all partners with the NFL to the tune of billions of dollars. A better analogy would be ESPN's coverage of UFC compared to their coverage of Bellator. But in reality no analogy is adequate because the football and wrestling operate in extremely different positions in the sports media landscape. 

If you want to be blunt about it, Flo's objective is to get as many subscribers as possible. Deduce our motives from that and you'll get closer to the truth than starting from what you personally would prefer we do and then imagining the economics behind what that would entail out of thin air. 

Which is to say, we spend a lot of time and resources on the NCAA tournament, which ESPN has the exclusive right to. We aren't going bump that content for some other tournament we might be streaming during the same weekend. We're going to do our best to present the wrestling content people most want to see. that's still never going to be the exact same content for every fan or subscriber, so there will always be disagreements about whether we made the right choice in what topic was led with on FRL. 

Wrestling people like to speak up and say whatever they're thinking.Thats what made Flo great was the personalities and never knowing what you may get.Now it's toe the line and be PC and not to make any coach mad.Fans can see that it didn't take the Willie trial for people to realize Flo has its favorites and won't speak bad about certain programs no matter what.With that approach and losing the Big 10 Flo has and will lose more subs.

Edited by calot

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4 minutes ago, calot said:

Wrestling people like to speak up and say whatever they're thinking.Thats what made Flo great was the personalities and never knowing what you may get.Now it's toe the line and be PC and not to make any coach mad.Fans can see that it didn't take the Willie trial for people to realize Flo has its favorites and won't speak bad about certain programs no matter what.With that approach and losing the Big 10 Flo has and will lose more subs.

You may be right. I'll suggest Flo talks more spontaneous trash on random college teams at our next editorial meeting.

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19 minutes ago, IronChef said:

The only issue with Flo is that they aren't what some people want them to be: wrestling journalists chasing down truth. They are a video production and event company that sometimes breaks news, which is fine. Flo won't publish anything that risks their access. This is a common complaint with ESPN and the NFL as well. It's how you get last year's video interview of Bader and Dake where it became clear that the only question anyone cares about (what was your injury) had been deemed off limits with Flo's agreement. It was clumsy, but Flo gets what they (and their subscribers) want, an interview with Dake to publish. Bader should have asked the question and let Dake refuse to answer, but it wasn't surprising considering who Flo is and claims to be.

If you're like me, this is all OK. I only subscribe to watch the matches and some of the FloFilms. I don't listen to FRL or their other shows, and I'm not that interested in the interviews they do. Others may disagree.

The problem with the access part is big boy sports require injury reports and press conferences. Wrestling does not so you have to rely on having a personal relationship to get the access. As we have seen from this trial, if a school feels butt hurt they will threaten access to get a positive infinity of promotion. For media that tries to emulate the big boy sports it is a juggling act to offer opinion and not be critical. 

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31 minutes ago, IronChef said:

The only issue with Flo is that they aren't what some people want them to be: wrestling journalists chasing down truth. They are a video production and event company that sometimes breaks news, which is fine. Flo won't publish anything that risks their access. This is a common complaint with ESPN and the NFL as well. It's how you get last year's video interview of Bader and Dake where it became clear that the only question anyone cares about (what was your injury) had been deemed off limits with Flo's agreement. It was clumsy, but Flo gets what they (and their subscribers) want, an interview with Dake to publish. Bader should have asked the question and let Dake refuse to answer, but it wasn't surprising considering who Flo is and claims to be.

If you're like me, this is all OK. I only subscribe to watch the matches and some of the FloFilms. I don't listen to FRL or their other shows, and I'm not that interested in the interviews they do. Others may disagree.

Agreed, but again this goes back to unless Willie is doing events at Rokfin, he’s not really competing.    And yet Flo has spent literally thousands of dollars complaining about generic phrases like “Big Board,” “Crystal Ball,” and a picture of a brain on a t-shirt. 

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33 minutes ago, Drake_Mallard said:

Does anyone really see Willie as a threat to Flo? I just dont. 

They are afraid of Rokfin. They can't sue Rokfin if Willie isn't involved.

That is why they aren't going after Lobdell who now has a patreon site which is similar to Rokfin's. Nor are they going after former FloTrack employees that have content on other providers.

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Agreed, but again this goes back to unless Willie is doing events at Rokfin, he’s not really competing.    And yet Flo has spent literally thousands of dollars complaining about generic phrases like “Big Board,” “Crystal Ball,” and a picture of a brain on a t-shirt. 

Sure, I was just writing generally about Flo. I don’t really care about the trial.

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1 hour ago, Jaroslav Hasek said:

You may be right. I'll suggest Flo talks more spontaneous trash on random college teams at our next editorial meeting.

Not what I meant and you know that.Spey you and I both know that Flo doesn't say things they know to be true because it would hurt access.Penn St ,Iowa and Ohio St do great numbers on Flo those 3 drive most of the clicks.Flo has no problem saying something bad about a lower tier program.You know the one that doesn't drive subs

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1 hour ago, Drake_Mallard said:

Does anyone really see Willie as a threat to Flo? I just dont. 

Rokfin is the threat and by going after Willie they thought it would get rid of Rokfin.But in the last few months Rokfin platform has grown and now that's not the case.Flo has wanted to have access to Penn St for years but couldn't because Cael is a pay the athlete guy.Now with this new model Penn St benefits financially from it's Rokfin channel.Had Rokfin platform grown before the Willie trial we wouldn't have a Willie trial.Flo knows that once they don't control the market the days at  Flowrestling are numbered

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1 hour ago, calot said:

Not what I meant and you know that.Spey you and I both know that Flo doesn't say things they know to be true because it would hurt access.Penn St ,Iowa and Ohio St do great numbers on Flo those 3 drive most of the clicks.Flo has no problem saying something bad about a lower tier program.You know the one that doesn't drive subs

i remember the days when Flo would get criticized for being the TMZ of the wrestling world. ahh yes, simpler times.

the upshot is that the D1 trash talk that the wrestling community so desperately craves is available for the taking. the Flo monopoly has graciously left that content gold just laying around for some entrepreneur to scoop up!

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1 hour ago, calot said:

Rokfin is the threat and by going after Willie they thought it would get rid of Rokfin.But in the last few months Rokfin platform has grown and now that's not the case.

Not too mention this entire trial is basically a long commercial for Rokfin.  The way Cael seemingly used it as a setup for announcing his event was brilliant.

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2 minutes ago, Jaroslav Hasek said:

i remember the days when Flo would get criticized for being the TMZ of the wrestling world. ahh yes, simpler times.

the upshot is that the D1 trash talk that the wrestling community so desperately craves is available for the taking. the Flo monopoly has graciously left that content gold just laying around for some entrepreneur to scoop up!

It's not about gossip Spey.Its about facts and not wanting to say them because it will hurt subs but you guys want to be the first one the announce the commitment.The issue is by trying to have it both ways you lose access to information as you guys are starting to find out 

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3 hours ago, Jaroslav Hasek said:

You may be right. I'll suggest Flo talks more spontaneous trash on random college teams at our next editorial meeting.

If you are here representing Flo this doesn't help.  Arrogance like this is basically a microcosm of Flo.  In a general sense the culture and vibe of Flo is just unlikeable.  They still have value and they are not the devil but that value is dwindling.

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1 minute ago, Class said:

If you are here representing Flo this doesn't help.  Arrogance like this is basically a microcosm of Flo.  In a general sense the culture and vibe of Flo is just unlikeable.  They still have value and they are not the devil but that value is dwindling.

They don't understand that at Flo and never will.Its the we are the smartest one  in the room attitude

Edited by calot

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7 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Not too mention this entire trial is basically a long commercial for Rokfin.  The way Cael seemingly used it as a setup for announcing his event was brilliant.

Now many RTCs have gone the Rokfin route as well as coaches.The platform is building and I agree this whole trial has been a free commercial for Rokfin.Social media is talking about it and people are taking notice.Flo subs are hurting because of it 

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