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gobraves101905

Signing Day

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3 minutes ago, gobraves101905 said:

When was that, during year 1 of the build?  That class has done well.  Finally getting some depth and being able to avoid holes with that depth. 

28th, 33rd, 14th, 10th, 12th at NCAAs since Zeke’s arrival. I remember hearing, more than once, about how great their signing classes were/are and that they will be in the title/trophy hunt.

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16 minutes ago, HokieHWT said:

28th, 33rd, 14th, 10th, 12th at NCAAs since Zeke’s arrival. I remember hearing, more than once, about how great their signing classes were/are and that they will be in the title/trophy hunt.

Their second best class will be getting on the mat for the first time this season. Those are good finishes, but great ones are still ahead. A great team is much more than just one great recruiting class. They are headed in that direction. 

Edited by gobraves101905

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1 hour ago, CA_Wrestler said:

Just like I said months ago for Cael.  No surprise.

Richie has been repping Monster Garage for several years now at any national tournament.  No doubt on my end where he was going to go even though he verbally committed so long ago.

ASU loaded at 125/133. Figs. Raimo. Courtney. McGee

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3 hours ago, HokieHWT said:

I could have sworn I heard this before about ASU.

You did - from 2014 - 2019.....  As a side note, I like ASU - I'm a Pac 12 fan...but I think it's funny that ASU has under achieved but so many people deny it  and that they weren't overhyped. 

"Maybe Anthony Valencia vs Alex Dieringer in the finals at 165.How long before ASU wins a team title?"

"Arizona State would have to be a dark horse for Hall. Obviously coaching and training partners there would be second to none. His graduation year could coincide with the 2020 games. Seems like a perfect fit with perfect weather. And would give ASU arguably the most prolific lineup at the 5 heaviest weights in history."

 "Anthony is incredibly explosive and very raw yet.   He is going to be lights out at ASU, but Zahid is even better.  Not sold on Spencer Lee, need to see him against bigger guys and not going 0-2 against them, before I believe he's ready for the D1 tournament. "

"I think if ASU keeps all of their recruits around they should be there.  Naser, Benick, the Valencias, Shields, Maruca, Tanner Hall, yeah that's going to be a tough team next year.  If their other guys rise to the challenge they could have a shot to have between 8-10 AA's next year.  I'd be surprised if they weren't at least a top 5 team, but I think they'll contend. "

"Z Valencia is an instant contender. Anthony is as well. Hall will be a lot better with a year of wrestling after 3 years off. Bennick was a jr world team member. He will be fine on the big stage. Shields looks outstanding. Nobody even talks about him. And if Nassar is really at asu they will be very deep."

"ASU is on the rise yo what looks to be top 10 status for years to come."

Edited by Idaho

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9 hours ago, gobraves101905 said:

 

Their second best class will be getting on the mat for the first time this season. Those are good finishes, but great ones are still ahead. A great team is much more than just one great recruiting class. They are headed in that direction. 

Recruiting Class Rankings


2019: 2nd

2017: 8th

2015: 1st

I see a pattern. They recruit a great class, then have no money for the following year. Toss people who didn’t pan out on their own and move on. Rinse, repeat.

Sorry. They’ve had multiple great classes and have done squat with them. See some great quotes Idaho posted above. I mean, at least you have nice weather, ASU branded booty shorts, and girls that wear bikinis under their graduation robes.

 

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2 hours ago, HokieHWT said:

Recruiting Class Rankings


2019: 2nd

2017: 8th

2015: 1st

I see a pattern. They recruit a great class, then have no money for the following year. Toss people who didn’t pan out on their own and move on. Rinse, repeat.

Sorry. They’ve had multiple great classes and have done squat with them. See some great quotes Idaho posted above. I mean, at least you have nice weather, ASU branded booty shorts, and girls that wear bikinis under their graduation robes.

 

All very true. One more advantage is that ASU gives out a pretty decent amount of $ for good students.  So wrestlers with a high GPA can get a lot of aid (and I am talking grants and not loans so they don't end up with a ton of debt).    

 

Some examples,  an instate student with a 30 GPA pays no tuition (I have 2 kids at ASU and this is quite nice, son got this, daughter got more). A friend of my daughters is from northern Cal, would have had to pay list price instate at UCLA (which is pricey) as well as Cal-Davis but given a large discount at ASU on out of state tuition making that a much cheaper option.  Son's GF is from Oregon,  $0 from UO/OSU but big discount at ASU. Daughter knew a gymnast at ASU,  no athletic $ but very smart kid and school mostly paid for. 

 

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Honestly, I think ASU underachieving may have more to do with the fact that their level of competition traditionally throughout the year is generally much weaker than any school that competes in the Big 10. I would almost prefer that either the Pac 12 somehow entices actual schools to compete that are in the conference (non-associate schools) which is not even remotely a near term possibility or join the Big 12 for wrestling. With Stanford on its way out, one somewhat decent duel meet in conference and a conference tourney full of teams with a large gaps in talent is not going to cut it in getting ASU ready for NCAAs. I think Zeke has done an amazing job bridging this with a great out of conference schedule but a switch of conference in my opinion could only help if no one else on the West coast is going to take the sport seriously at a college level. 

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9 hours ago, HokieHWT said:

Recruiting Class Rankings


2019: 2nd

2017: 8th

2015: 1st

I see a pattern. They recruit a great class, then have no money for the following year. Toss people who didn’t pan out on their own and move on. Rinse, repeat.

Sorry. They’ve had multiple great classes and have done squat with them. See some great quotes Idaho posted above. I mean, at least you have nice weather, ASU branded booty shorts, and girls that wear bikinis under their graduation robes.

 

2017 wasn’t a great class. 8th partially because Tsirtsis was in that class. Courtney and Norfleet headline the class. Demison better athlete than wrestler, overrated. Porter one of the best Greco guys in the country in that class. 

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11 minutes ago, gobraves101905 said:

2017 wasn’t a great class. 8th partially because Tsirtsis was in that class. Courtney and Norfleet headline the class. Demison better athlete than wrestler, overrated. Porter one of the best Greco guys in the country in that class. 

You’re missing the point. They go all-in for one class, see 1st and 2nd, then don’t even make the top 25 the other years. Guess what? This strategy doesn’t work.

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1 hour ago, HokieHWT said:

You’re missing the point. They go all-in for one class, see 1st and 2nd, then don’t even make the top 25 the other years. Guess what? This strategy doesn’t work.

They went all in year one to start it off. 2018 they got a top 10 hammer. 2019 was a great class. They get on the mat this year. 2020 they got a hammer top 10 guy plus a transfer that could get on the podium.  2021 they signed a great class. Plus they are getting quality guys to fill in the depth. 

Edited by gobraves101905

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4 hours ago, gobraves101905 said:

ASU getting to the point where they are starting to build depth. That doesn’t happen in a year or two. Basically started with the program torn down to the studs. 

 

gobraves - I respect your love for ASU and that fact that you don't get into pissing matches with people....just keep the positive going with your team. That's good.

They should have a solid lineup this year and the next couple years - I think the new coaches will be good for the team.

...but this is year 7 for Jones - You have to admit, with all the hype his results have been underachieving. There have been lots of reasons for that- I get it. But, the bottom line is that he has brought in some heavy hitters and hasn't been even close to a trophy. He hasn't produced a lightweight AA,  being a lightweight coach himself. As mentioned, his recruiting has been feast and famine. He certainly hasn't been terrible,  but short of where they should have been. Time will tell with the group he has right now.

Even as an OSU fan, I think its' good for ASU to have the talent they have - and for OSU to be on the upswing now. If we can save Stanford with some of their youth , there are 3 legit programs in the pac 12. Now if we could just add some schools and make the conference legit. 

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2 hours ago, Idaho said:

 

gobraves - I respect your love for ASU and that fact that you don't get into pissing matches with people....just keep the positive going with your team. That's good.

They should have a solid lineup this year and the next couple years - I think the new coaches will be good for the team.

...but this is year 7 for Jones - You have to admit, with all the hype his results have been underachieving. There have been lots of reasons for that- I get it. But, the bottom line is that he has brought in some heavy hitters and hasn't been even close to a trophy. He hasn't produced a lightweight AA,  being a lightweight coach himself. As mentioned, his recruiting has been feast and famine. He certainly hasn't been terrible,  but short of where they should have been. Time will tell with the group he has right now.

Even as an OSU fan, I think its' good for ASU to have the talent they have - and for OSU to be on the upswing now. If we can save Stanford with some of their youth , there are 3 legit programs in the pac 12. Now if we could just add some schools and make the conference legit. 

They have had a lot of individual successes. They have had some disappointments and a couple big disappointments. As far as the team goes, it’s a process. It only year 6 since the first class got on campus. That not long going from the 60’s to having a top 10 finish. The college team is doing well, improving, getting deeper and the RTC has never been where it is today in Tempe. 

Recruiting was terrible for years after the first class. The team had no depth and had multiple huge holes in the lineup each year. There has been success and people are buying in. It’s attracting more talent. I think it would be extremely naive to think a championship team and perennial contender can be built in 5 years, without any hiccups,  from out of the ashes.  

Hopefully Pac-12 wrestling survives. OSU is doing big things already. Their coaches are phenomenal. Stanford really needs to survive for the pac 12 to I believe. 

Edited by gobraves101905

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3 hours ago, Idaho said:

 

gobraves - I respect your love for ASU and that fact that you don't get into pissing matches with people....just keep the positive going with your team. That's good.

They should have a solid lineup this year and the next couple years - I think the new coaches will be good for the team.

...but this is year 7 for Jones - You have to admit, with all the hype his results have been underachieving. There have been lots of reasons for that- I get it. But, the bottom line is that he has brought in some heavy hitters and hasn't been even close to a trophy. He hasn't produced a lightweight AA,  being a lightweight coach himself. As mentioned, his recruiting has been feast and famine. He certainly hasn't been terrible,  but short of where they should have been. Time will tell with the group he has right now.

Even as an OSU fan, I think its' good for ASU to have the talent they have - and for OSU to be on the upswing now. If we can save Stanford with some of their youth , there are 3 legit programs in the pac 12. Now if we could just add some schools and make the conference legit. 

I think it is very easy to forget just how difficult it is to get a team trophy in this sport.  I know Zeke along with every other coach talks about contending for a title especially after landing an impressive recruiting class.  That's what their suppose to say.  However when you look at the teams that regularly are at the top of the heap - PSU, Iowa, OSU, Ohio St, Michigan, and Cornell and look at the level of recruits that those teams usually pull in it is no wonder that it is a tough club to join.  Beyond those 6 teams you have many other programs that have been finding a lot of success that along with ASU make up a large group of schools (Va Tech, Neb., Mo. NCSt, Lehigh, Princeton, Wisc, ISU, Minn, Rutgers, etc) trying to break into that trophy hunt.   I don't think finishes of 14th, 10th and 12th at NCAAs is that bad of a report card for Zeke.  Can he do better in the future?  Possibly but it won't be easy when you consider what some of these other programs have on their rosters and as confirmed recruits.

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