Taylor vs. Burroughs: Who ya got?

[Wrestleknownothing 391]

Allow me to summarize the Smith vs Burroughs debate.

We are spoiled.

[de4856 360]

Double post 

Edited November 17, 2020 by de4856
Double post

[de4856 360]

Just now, de4856 said:

I think that if DT is in great shape and can go all out for 6 minutes, I have to think that he wins. 

 

[Lurker 1,397]

55 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Excluding Russia, how many losses?  Just  one? 

74-5 correct. Sidakov(2), Gudeav; Tsargush, Bekzod (Uzbek)

[lu1979 338]

9 hours ago, Lurker said:

74-5 correct. Sidakov(2), Gudeav; Tsargush, Bekzod (Uzbek)

Those are JB's only losses at a World Championship or Olympics. If you are talking about his whole career you have to add Losses to Nick Marable (his 1st), Kyle Dake, IMar, and I think Chamizo although that may have been an exhibition.  

[Lurker 1,397]

39 minutes ago, lu1979 said:

Those are JB's only losses at a World Championship or Olympics. If you are talking about his whole career you have to add Losses to Nick Marable (his 1st), Kyle Dake, IMar, and I think Chamizo although that may have been an exhibition.  

I believe he was asking about losses to former soviets.  

[Plasmodium 1,603]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

I believe he was asking about losses to former soviets.  

My question was a bit unclear, but this is what I was asking.   Gracias.  It is interesting that the only non Russian loss was a backside anomaly.

[1032004 893]

16 hours ago, IronChef said:

He may have said that; I just don't think he is likely to hang around until age 36 to either suck down to 74 again or go up to 86kg at 5'7". He's already the oldest guy on the national team. Are there any contenders (say top 6 or so) who are older than him?

Doubt it, Dom Bradley is only about 9 months younger than him who was one of the first guys I thought of.

But yeah how long he sticks around may depend on how he does.  I would assume he would rather not cut weight than cut it, hence seemingly testing the waters at 86.  So if he can beat one of the top guys at 86 while giving up weight right now, I'd think he should be able to at least hang with them despite being a few years older if he can add a few pounds of muscle.   Fortunately for him he's one of the few guys making decent money from wrestling/endorsements, so while some of the other "older" guys eventually need to move on to the "real world," JB doesn't really have that problem.

[nom 873]

I tuned into FRL for a few minutes this morning .... what I heard suggested that they didn’t think this match was going to happen.  Did I hear correctly?

[Wrestleknownothing 391]

7 minutes ago, nom said:

I tuned into FRL for a few minutes this morning .... what I heard suggested that they didn’t think this match was going to happen.  Did I hear correctly?

You heard correctly. They did not explain why they thought that.

[nom 873]

Well, that stinks. Wonder what changed?  JB with a VERY vocal call out.  DT saying he signed the contract.  What happened?

[Wrestleknownothing 391]

15 minutes ago, nom said:

Well, that stinks. Wonder what changed?  JB with a VERY vocal call out.  DT saying he signed the contract.  What happened?

I just listened to this. CP on Ward Wrestling podcast (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ed-_jitPdm4&t=2s) starting at about 17 minutes they discuss this.

The question was whether JB/DT was the next event on Flo. CP says it won't be next and might not happen. You can read that as not next on Flo and might not happen on Flo. CP goes on to say that even though both wrestlers clearly want it to happen and Flo clearly wants to pay them a lot of money to make it happen, there are still negotiations to be had on location and payments to be had.

He is clearly skeptical that the negotiations will be successful. What worries me is that he obviously knows more about these negotiations than we do, as he is likely directly involved.

[Gantry 1,677]

What contract did DT sign?  It doesn't even  make sense that there is a contract as they have no event, agreement, provider, sponsor, etc.  Was all just a DT social media joke thing?

[ionel 1,353]

46 minutes ago, Gantry said:

What contract did DT sign?  It doesn't even  make sense that there is a contract as they have no event, agreement, provider, sponsor, etc.  Was all just a DT social media joke thing?

maybe a contract with his mom to clean his room and make the bed?  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

;)

[Wrestleknownothing 391]

58 minutes ago, Gantry said:

What contract did DT sign?  It doesn't even  make sense that there is a contract as they have no event, agreement, provider, sponsor, etc.  Was all just a DT social media joke thing?

I was wondering the same.

I imagine he signed a contract with (?) without first letting JB see what was in the contract. Then send it to JB and hope he signs it too. Perhaps the dig that DT finds it ironic that he has signed and JB hasn't is meant as a tactic to get JB to sign something he otherwise would not agree with.

More likely, is that JB would say, "I'm not signing that. How about this instead?" And so the negotiations begin.

It is also possible that there is nothing "signed", and the paper is just a prop. If it was real, it is turned over. The paper in front of him is blank. Also, he did not sign it on camera, the scene opens after he has "signed" it. Seems unlikely that you would make a video of yourself "signing" without actually showing the act of signing unless there wasn't anything real to sign.

My guess is "signed" is a term de art. What it really means is that he agrees in principal and he has stopped the two day clock.

[nom 873]

Whatever.  They each said let’s do this.  If one of them is now saying that some condition they require is not being met for them to move forward.  Let’s hear what it is.  No need for conjecture to the nth degree.

If this is the situation ... a bit lame.  This is wrestling.  They have called each other out.  All you need is a mat.  Let’s not be prima donnas about it.   Not a good look.

[hammerlockthree 2,044]

36 minutes ago, nom said:

Whatever.  They each said let’s do this.  If one of them is now saying that some condition they require is not being met for them to move forward.  Let’s hear what it is.  No need for conjecture to the nth degree.

If this is the situation ... a bit lame.  This is wrestling.  They have called each other out.  All you need is a mat.  Let’s not be prima donnas about it.   Not a good look.

I would say they have grandstanded on the issue....

[wrestlingphish 646]

My best guess is that it happens but not on Flo. If I were JB/DT and was negotiating with Flo about this I wouldn't just ask for a one time payment I would be looking for a % of all subscriptions that are created between the announcement of the event and the event itself and would also ask for payment based on # of times match is viewed after the fact. I doubt Flo would be willing to open up their books like that. My guess is its part of the December NLWC event and JB gets a one time payment + residuals based on NLWC subscriptions or JB/DT spin up their own Rokfin channel to host it or something and have more control. 

[GoNotQuietly 894]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Burroughs, smartly, never accepts this match-up, and just kicks the can on contract negotiations down the road until it no longer makes sense with the competition calendar. 

[hammerlockthree 2,044]

Hum, that cuts harder than any of the supposedly witty banter from Burroughs....

[Plasmodium 1,603]

If this winds up being a cheap effort to stay on the front page - Go Dake!  Go PD3! 

[ionel 1,353]

3 hours ago, hammerlockthree said:

Hum, that cuts harder than any of the supposedly witty banter from Burroughs....

So ... Burroughs' mom won't let him come outside to play? 

Say it ain't so JB!  ;_;

Edited November 22, 2020 by ionel

[AnklePicker 531]

4 hours ago, hammerlockthree said:

Hum, that cuts harder than any of the supposedly witty banter from Burroughs....

No it doesn’t, Burroughs making the magic man disappear from 74 was wittier, funnier and deeper cutting. 

[Wrestleknownothing 391]

25 minutes ago, AnklePicker said:

No it doesn’t, Burroughs making the magic man disappear from 74 was wittier, funnier and deeper cutting. 

We will have to agree to disagree.

Make no mistake, I think JB's tweet was fantastic. But it was based on an interpretation of events that is almost certainly wrong.

Taylor's tweet is pretty good, which by Taylor tweet standards makes it his best ever by a lot. But it is also factual. JB makes the weird "mom's bed - you have two days to respond" public declaration. And then goes radio silent when the bluff is called. It ivalidates his earlier tweet. He is disappearing from his own challenge.

[hammerlockthree 2,044]

48 minutes ago, AnklePicker said:

No it doesn’t, Burroughs making the magic man disappear from 74 was wittier, funnier and deeper cutting. 

some dumb play on words based on a guy switching weights for the correct reasons doesn't hold a candle to outing someone has a blow hard in a coldly factual way.

Especially sense the magic man may have just disappeared burroughs

Edited November 22, 2020 by hammerlockthree