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150 8-Man Bracket

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1 minute ago, alliseeisgold said:

micah was the better offensive wrestler and the worst top/bottom guy. Freestyle fits micah better than both. 

and all those matches were barnburners 

I don't recall Shnaulty nor Pantaleo ever being in real danger of losing. 

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4 minutes ago, jeffrideal said:

I have to say, CP has stepped his game way up in commentating.  He is pretty quick witted, I could see him going to a major outlet in sports broadcasting for other sports, if he chose to pursue that.  He used to really get on my nerves, btw.  

I agree.  Thought to myself a few times “that was pretty good CP”

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Man Punia is good. Gives up a decent amount of size to Green and still pushes him around the mat. He’s like a Russian in that he’s good in all areas.  He seemed to improve as the tourney moved on.  Did he even have any intention of wrestling in this thing?  Pretty sweet, comes here to train and picks up 25k in 2 hours of work. America, what a country!
 

Shout out to Ikei for a beautiful throw and Winchester wow some impressive technique with great positioning throughout. Some great wrestling by the ladies. 

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46 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Or being outwrestled on their feet? Bizarre claim.

If he outwrestled them then why did he not win the takedown battles?

Give me a break.

Everyone knows the Jordan's are built for folkstyle.  I lf he couldn't sniff them before at his preferred style, then he isn't sniffing them in freestyle.

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Awesome wrestling.  Bajrang is tough in the front head and has amazing par terre offense and defense.  His turk to trap arm is naaaasty and looked painful.  I can't  believe he didn't get turned with Green's lace.  Great match

 

Side note- I know his has always been a point of discussion, but internationally the US needs to score more points in par terre.  Bajrang made it look easy.  

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where the hell was zain , and yianni ? nolf ? I mean look like we had a few kg here difference between bajrang and some of the guys.

jmo but the 8 man left a little to be desired - while it was still much needed didn't satisfy the tastebuds quite like the club duals did which had much more great matches.

Would like to go to another round and have more studs. Bajrang not facing any challengers until the finals was just anticlamatic. Easy money for him. 

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1 hour ago, nhs67 said:

If he outwrestled them then why did he not win the takedown battles?

Give me a break.

Everyone knows the Jordan's are built for folkstyle.  I lf he couldn't sniff them before at his preferred style, then he isn't sniffing them in freestyle.

if you wanna go bring up those boxscores and show he lost the takedown battles go ahead because i'm not sure I believe that , let's not act like micah didn't have some of the slickest offense and was one of the top college guys for getting to a leg when you need to create offense........which is what I look for in freestyle. He probably would suck in top/bottom in free too so it's a moot point, but micah was better at getting to a leg than ashnault and pantelo. Everything else they were better. 

In freestyle I want guys who can get to a leg.

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1 hour ago, alliseeisgold said:

if you wanna go bring up those boxscores and show he lost the takedown battles go ahead because i'm not sure I believe that , let's not act like micah didn't have some of the slickest offense and was one of the top college guys for getting to a leg when you need to create offense........which is what I look for in freestyle. He probably would suck in top/bottom in free too so it's a moot point, but micah was better at getting to a leg than ashnault and pantelo. Everything else they were better. 

In freestyle I want guys who can get to a leg.

Lol, you make the audacious claim without evidence that Micah was a better takedown artist than Ashnault and Pantaleyet expect others to prove you wrong? Classic!

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I enjoyed the event...there was a lot of good wrestling. My biggest takeaway is that if Green can’t beat Bajrang at 150lbs several hours after weigh ins, he’s probably not going to do it at 65kg. Green showed he is right there with Yianni so I’m not too high on our chances at 65 unless Zain has made improvement. Bajrang is great but I feel he’s a step behind the top guys in the world too 

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Shnaulty-Jordan

Match 1 Cliff Keen Invite: Jordan 4-1 on TDs.  Shnaulty was up 1-0 on takedowns(and was up via major decision after two first period N4) before he stalled the last minute of the 3rd period for the win.  This tells doesn't tell me crap about Jordan being better at Neutral.

Match 2 B1Gs: Shnaulty decides to not stall out and win 2-1 on takedowns

Match 3 NCAAs : Even on takedowns 2-2.

But okay.  Jordan is clearly a better neutral wrestler? No.  Try again, squirt.

 

Pantaleo-Jordan

Match 1 Cliff Keen: Pantaleo 2-0

Match 2 Dual: ?  12-7 decision for Pantaleo that was 2-2 on TD.  Pantaleo was up 1-0 on TD until the last minute.

Match 3 B1Gs: 1-0 Pantaleo edge.

Match 4 NCAAs: Pantaleo 2-0 TD edge

But okay.  Jordan is clearly a better neutral wrestler? No.  Try again, squirt.

Edited by nhs67

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8 hours ago, alliseeisgold said:

where the hell was zain , and yianni ? nolf ? I mean look like we had a few kg here difference between bajrang and some of the guys.

jmo but the 8 man left a little to be desired - while it was still much needed didn't satisfy the tastebuds quite like the club duals did which had much more great matches.

Would like to go to another round and have more studs. Bajrang not facing any challengers until the finals was just anticlamatic. Easy money for him. 

Flo can’t make these guys show up. I’m sure Zain and Yianni both got invites, JO called them both out when they announced this mini tournament and Zain responded he would see everyone in April. 

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Shnaulty-Jordan
Match 1 Cliff Keen Invite: Jordan 4-1 on TDs.  Shnaulty was up 1-0 on takedowns(and was up via major decision after two first period N4) before he stalled the last minute of the 3rd period for the win.  This tells doesn't tell me crap about Jordan being better at Neutral.
Match 2 B1Gs: Shnaulty decides to not stall out and win 2-1 on takedowns
Match 3 NCAAs : Even on takedowns 2-2.
But okay.  Jordan is clearly a better neutral wrestler? No.  Try again, squirt.
 
Pantaleo-Jordan
Match 1 Cliff Keen: Pantaleo 2-0
Match 2 Dual: ?  12-7 decision for Pantaleo that was 2-2 on TD.  Pantaleo was up 1-0 on TD until the last minute.
Match 3 B1Gs: 1-0 Pantaleo edge.
Match 4 NCAAs: Pantaleo 2-0 TD edge
But okay.  Jordan is clearly a better neutral wrestler? No.  Try again, squirt.
Lol people are wild. It's ridiculous to let facts get in the way of your opinion.

In terms of takedowns btw, I'll have to go back and look but Jordan always gave me that "dive in and hope to finish" feel. He didn't seem super explosive and exploding for clean takedowns is my top priority in "who's style will translate from folk"

Disclaimer: Yes Yainni, David Taylor*, and a lot of 57kg guys like to scramble but on the whole our successful reps: Green, Burroughs, Dake, Cox, Snyder, Gwiz.... When they want/need to score they explode through people and dont spend a lot of time losing positionally in scramble situations.
I think Dake would be fine, and obviously Taylor thrives there but makes me think Jordan
wouldn't do so hot.

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1 hour ago, Eagle26 said:

I enjoyed the event...there was a lot of good wrestling. My biggest takeaway is that if Green can’t beat Bajrang at 150lbs several hours after weigh ins, he’s probably not going to do it at 65kg. Green showed he is right there with Yianni so I’m not too high on our chances at 65 unless Zain has made improvement. Bajrang is great but I feel he’s a step behind the top guys in the world too 

Barang is definitely one of the top guys in the world at 65kg and there isn't a lot of separation between them.  Right now I'd say the top 3 are Rashidov, Ottoguro, and Barang.  I discount Barang's loss to the Kazakhstan guy in the 2019 SF as a extreme case of home cooking.  He really got screwed on the call where he clearly threw that guy with a head pinch from his feet.   Musackaev also beat Ottoguro in the 2019 bronze match but I can't see him in the top echelon based on overall results including the other day in the World Cup finals.   One of the biggest unknowns is who may drop down to 65kg from 70kg and change the outlook.  D Baev is one guy who if he can make the weight and be effective he could jump right to the head of the contenders.

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27 minutes ago, lu1979 said:

Barang is definitely one of the top guys in the world at 65kg and there isn't a lot of separation between them.  Right now I'd say the top 3 are Rashidov, Ottoguro, and Barang.  I discount Barang's loss to the Kazakhstan guy in the 2019 SF as a extreme case of home cooking.  He really got screwed on the call where he clearly threw that guy with a head pinch from his feet.   Musackaev also beat Ottoguro in the 2019 bronze match but I can't see him in the top echelon based on overall results including the other day in the World Cup finals.   One of the biggest unknowns is who may drop down to 65kg from 70kg and change the outlook.  D Baev is one guy who if he can make the weight and be effective he could jump right to the head of the contenders.

The Musik-Man needs to lay off the Camel filterless for a bit.  Explosive, technical, but that gas tank hits zero pretty quick.  One to watch is Tevanyan from Armenia--just won the World Cup (beat Musik-Man in the final with a late barrage of scoring, 9-1).  He's only 21 and training in Armenia has been sporadic because of the war in Artsakh.  Not saying he is a contender for gold, but is a definite top-5 level guy and can make problems for any top dog not bringing his A-game into the circle.

Edited by Coach_J
revision

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2 minutes ago, Coach_J said:

The Musik-Man needs to lay off the Camel filterless for a bit.  Explosive, technical, but that gas tank hits zero pretty quick.  One to watch is Tevanyan from Armenia--just won the World Cup (beat Musik-Man in the final with a late barrage of scoring, 9-1).  He's only 21 and training in Armenia has been sporadic because of the war in Artsakh.  Not say he is a contender for gold, but is a definite top-5 level guy and can make problems for any top dog not bringing his A-game into the circle.

You are right about Tevanyan - when he cut loose it was impressive. I wish there was a way to see some of the earlier round matches in the World Cup.  All I got to see were the medal matches shown on the Olympic Channel.

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1 hour ago, spladle08 said:

Lol people are wild. It's ridiculous to let facts get in the way of your opinion.

In terms of takedowns btw, I'll have to go back and look but Jordan always gave me that "dive in and hope to finish" feel. He didn't seem super explosive and exploding for clean takedowns is my top priority in "who's style will translate from folk"

Disclaimer: Yes Yainni, David Taylor*, and a lot of 57kg guys like to scramble but on the whole our successful reps: Green, Burroughs, Dake, Cox, Snyder, Gwiz.... When they want/need to score they explode through people and dont spend a lot of time losing positionally in scramble situations.
I think Dake would be fine, and obviously Taylor thrives there but makes me think Jordan
wouldn't do so hot.

My remembrance of Jordan was that if he could physically dominate, in terms of athleticism and power, he would blow them out.

He went up against someone with a serious athletic and/or power advantage and had problems.

I cement my initial statement that in none of those matches between Jordan and Pantaleo/Shnaulty I was never of the mind that Jordan had a real chance to win, let alone dominate any one aspect of the match.

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25 minutes ago, lu1979 said:

Barang is definitely one of the top guys in the world at 65kg and there isn't a lot of separation between them.  Right now I'd say the top 3 are Rashidov, Ottoguro, and Barang.  I discount Barang's loss to the Kazakhstan guy in the 2019 SF as a extreme case of home cooking.  He really got screwed on the call where he clearly threw that guy with a head pinch from his feet.   Musackaev also beat Ottoguro in the 2019 bronze match but I can't see him in the top echelon based on overall results including the other day in the World Cup finals.   One of the biggest unknowns is who may drop down to 65kg from 70kg and change the outlook.  D Baev is one guy who if he can make the weight and be effective he could jump right to the head of the contenders.

Agree. I feel he is a likely bronze contender and just a small step behind for the gold. I'd put Rashidov, ottoguru, and Aliev a bit ahead of him. If Rashidov is out due to injury his chances may improve but not if Baev can make the weight effectively. Has he committed to the cut? I thought he was originally planning to go up? But he may only be 4th or 5th on the Russian ladder at 74 so 65 makes more sense especially if Rashidov is out. 

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