Jon_Kozak 249 Report post Posted February 7 Also of note is Kyle has competed way more so that partially skews the data. I believe Snyder's complete record is 131-16 and J'den's is 65-14. Snyder is 9-6 against world/Olympic champions and 21-4 against other world/olympic medalists. J'den is 5-5 against champs and 11-5 against other medalists. As already mentioned, J'den has been much better of late and is on a 22 match win streak. In that streak he has: 6 wins against World/Olympic Medalists, 7 techs, 14 shut-outs and has outscored his opponents 153-14. 2 2 nhs67, Housebuye, GoNotQuietly and 1 other reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headache 126 Report post Posted February 8 How many takedowns do you expect to see when these two wrestle? I'm guessing between zero and one - total. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flugge 1 Report post Posted February 8 The mat will have to be mopped up 3 times per period...thats my guess Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nhs67 1,235 Report post Posted February 8 This could be all pushouts for Snyder or Cox or it could be one of those matches Snyder slips and goes down big early due to a mistake and exposure and has to come back or it could be one where he just gets to his single and gets him down a few times. I really don't know how this is going to go. Citing 92kg results as reasoning for Cox being SOOO much better is ignorant at best. He beat on 92 kegger guys who couldn't crack their lineups at 86 or 97. He barely beat Salas this last time, when Snyder has shown to be clearly better every single time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjc007 703 Report post Posted February 8 Nickal has already proven to be MUCH better than Moore, Macchiavello, and Zillmer, the 3, 4, and 5 domestically ranked 97kg guys. If Snyder went 125 for hypothetical, then NLWC has no better option at 97 than Nickal.lol.Saduleav, Mohammedi have proven to much better than Snyder and Nickal. If you want to be the best, that is your competition. Not Zillmer. Moore, Nickal, or Macchyivello sp,)We saw what Nickal looked like agsinst Cox at 92. It wasn't a good look for Bo.Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nhs67 1,235 Report post Posted February 8 34 minutes ago, cjc007 said: lol. Saduleav, Mohammedi have proven to much better than Snyder and Nickal. If you want to be the best, that is your competition. Not Zillmer. Moore, Nickal, or Macchyivello sp,) We saw what Nickal looked like agsinst Cox at 92. It wasn't a good look for Bo. Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk Okay. When and where did Zillmer, Moore, and Macchiavello perform better internationally? Nickal's 92kg U23 GOLD medal is better than any of them have done. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bfrito17 27 Report post Posted February 8 It's going to be a great match up, just as it's always been a great match between these two! I think Cox has the momentum and confidence going in. Flo reposted a clip of them training together and I feel like it's going to be a clash of styles. Snyder's heavy forward pressure snap down centered offense vs Cox loose movement but always somehow in a good wrestling position defense. Whoever wins I think it goes 3 matches. I'm only going with Cox because I think he's developed that x factor that is going to throw Snyder off. I feel like Cox will win because of some defensive reattacks or short offense. 1 GoNotQuietly reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTimeFan 1,034 Report post Posted February 8 On 2/6/2021 at 6:15 PM, 2td3nf said: Nice! Very clever. I liked it too. Double bottoms don’t work in stock trading but who knows when it comes to wrestling matches. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTimeFan 1,034 Report post Posted February 8 3 hours ago, nhs67 said: This could be all pushouts for Snyder or Cox or it could be one of those matches Snyder slips and goes down big early due to a mistake and exposure and has to come back or it could be one where he just gets to his single and gets him down a few times. I really don't know how this is going to go. Citing 92kg results as reasoning for Cox being SOOO much better is ignorant at best. He beat on 92 kegger guys who couldn't crack their lineups at 86 or 97. He barely beat Salas this last time, when Snyder has shown to be clearly better every single time. I thought Karimi was the best guy he beat. He was an 86kg guy. Why did he move up ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wrestlingnerd 2,779 Report post Posted February 8 4 hours ago, nhs67 said: He barely beat Salas this last time, when Snyder has shown to be clearly better every single time. Fair point but Cox wrestled down to the level of his competitors a lot more than Snyder, who basically doesn’t do that at all with few exceptions. 1 nhs67 reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Housebuye 2,231 Report post Posted February 8 5 hours ago, nhs67 said: Okay. When and where did Zillmer, Moore, and Macchiavello perform better internationally? Nickal's 92kg U23 GOLD medal is better than any of them have done. To be fair, U23 Gold doesn’t mean much. It depends on your competition. Some weights some years are stacked, but often times it isn’t. Even moreso for non Olympic weights. Richie Lewis won gold at 70kg... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Housebuye 2,231 Report post Posted February 8 Although I think it is Moore and Nickal fighting it out. I don’t think Machiavello is as good. I know he keeps beating Moore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Housebuye 2,231 Report post Posted February 8 5 hours ago, bfrito17 said: It's going to be a great match up, just as it's always been a great match between these two! I think Cox has the momentum and confidence going in. Flo reposted a clip of them training together and I feel like it's going to be a clash of styles. Snyder's heavy forward pressure snap down centered offense vs Cox loose movement but always somehow in a good wrestling position defense. Whoever wins I think it goes 3 matches. I'm only going with Cox because I think he's developed that x factor that is going to throw Snyder off. I feel like Cox will win because of some defensive reattacks or short offense. I would imagine if it goes 3, Snyder wins. He is significantly bigger than jden and will get Jden tired I think. That’s a lot of power to deal with for 18 minutes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nhs67 1,235 Report post Posted February 8 14 minutes ago, Housebuye said: To be fair, U23 Gold doesn’t mean much. It depends on your competition. Some weights some years are stacked, but often times it isn’t. Even moreso for non Olympic weights. Richie Lewis won gold at 70kg... I understand and get that, however what has any of the other three aforementioned gentlemen done to say they're better against the world at 97, when results at 92 (which all three competed at for the majority of this last cycle) all point to Nickal being not only better, but substantially better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BTC 70 Report post Posted February 9 3 hours ago, Housebuye said: I would imagine if it goes 3, Snyder wins. He is significantly bigger than jden and will get Jden tired I think. That’s a lot of power to deal with for 18 minutes Significantly bigger is a stretch. Kyle doesn't look much bigger here to me if at all. Aside from the early snapdown it looks like jden was horsing kyle around. Not ragdolling him or anything but he seems to have an easier time moving kyle around. But yes we still have to see how he deals with kyles constant pressure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lurker 1,514 Report post Posted February 9 (edited) Can’t forget the team needs to be decided by the world qualifier, with enough time for the winning athletes to recover and prepare for it. Edited February 9 by Lurker Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hammerlockthree 2,086 Report post Posted February 9 12 hours ago, headache said: How many takedowns do you expect to see when these two wrestle? I'm guessing between zero and one - total. did adding "total" at the end of that make you feel smart? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shiraz123 669 Report post Posted February 9 (edited) 22 hours ago, BigTimeFan said: I thought Karimi was the best guy he beat. He was an 86kg guy. Why did he move up ? He lost to Yazdani one time (their only match) in the trials for 2017 worlds and then went up as they introduced 92kg the next year. I believe the score was 5-0 in that match. It wasn't a situation where he was stuck behind him for years or anything, but i'm pretty sure that would have happened if he had stayed at 86. While Karimi is a guy who was forced out of his weight due to the presence of another wrestler and not a weight issue, it is still a very impressive win for Cox. Karimi destroyed Sharifov and Russia's wrestler in 2018 worlds before losing to Cox and was very in form in 2019 also. Edited February 9 by Shiraz123 1 bnwtwg reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bnwtwg 622 Report post Posted February 9 18 hours ago, Lurker said: Can’t forget the team needs to be decided by the world qualifier, with enough time for the winning athletes to recover and prepare for it. USA 97kg qualified for 2021 worlds when Snyder won bronze at 2019 worlds and 2020 Olympics were postponed to 2021. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mspart 201 Report post Posted February 9 Snyder will be our Olympian at 97kg. mspart Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nhs67 1,235 Report post Posted February 9 Honestly I hope Snyder wins. Snyder isn't making 92 for Worlds a few months later. Does Nickal come up and take the spot, then? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTimeFan 1,034 Report post Posted February 9 4 hours ago, Shiraz123 said: He lost to Yazdani one time (their only match) in the trials for 2017 worlds and then went up as they introduced 92kg the next year. I believe the score was 5-0 in that match. It wasn't a situation where he was stuck behind him for years or anything, but i'm pretty sure that would have happened if he had stayed at 86. While Karimi is a guy who was forced out of his weight due to the presence of another wrestler and not a weight issue, it is still a very impressive win for Cox. Karimi destroyed Sharifov and Russia's wrestler in 2018 worlds before losing to Cox and was very in form in 2019 also. Hey thanks. I totally forgot about Yazdani. Of course. That makes sense and Yazdani definitely is the better wrestler. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bnwtwg 622 Report post Posted February 9 (edited) 1 hour ago, nhs67 said: Honestly I hope Snyder wins. Snyder isn't making 92 for Worlds a few months later. Does Nickal come up and take the spot, then? If Cox wins 97 and medals then the 97kg spot is his for worlds; or he can go back to 92 and placed into the WTT semi; or he can just skip worlds. I wouldn't be surprised to see medalists skip worlds due to the 15 week turnaround. That's short time for training, peaking, competing, recovering, training, peaking, tapering, competing. Could see some guys bump up too, who knows? Snyder probably hasn't been able to make 92 since his frosh year. He missed weight the first time at Final X in 2019 and is an avid 10 mile runner before all his transatlantic flights, just like the rest of us. Nickal slots in wherever he thinks someone is not competing: Taylor skips 86 @ worlds, Cox skips 92, or Snyder + Cox skips 97. Tough being a bridesmaid when you may genuinely be the 2nd best at any of those weights but you're blocked by someone world-champ caliber Edited February 9 by bnwtwg sp 1 nhs67 reacted to this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mspart 201 Report post Posted February 9 Kind of like the Russians have been for all these years. mspart Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headache 126 Report post Posted February 10 On 2/8/2021 at 7:45 PM, hammerlockthree said: did adding "total" at the end of that make you feel smart? Total means for the series. Why the insult? Did I do something to you to justify that? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
