Jump to content
Plasmodium

Does Iowa recruit Iowa?

Recommended Posts

16 minutes ago, Drake_Mallard said:

What is the lowest common denominator in this example?

ugh...

the typical "grassroots" wrestler circa 1968 who wrestled the same 10 mediocre kids 12 times in a junior high season coming in as a freshman to whatever high school he happened to live closest by who is currently yelling at kids to get off his lawn this morning and going on about the good ole days at the coffee shop to the other retirees...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, The Downington Destroyer said:

You are right.... thanks to FloWrestling, who mainly serves the interests of Tom Brands and John Smith, these coaches have a better 'eye'  now on the blue chips in PA.  Ever since FloWrestling bought the rights to the PIAA Wrestling Tournament, a PA resident can't watch the event on the local public tv anymore.  I remember watching my first PA finals on channel 13 in 1969.  Now, you have to buy a subscription from Flo to watch.  I am sure Brands and Smith get theirs for free.  A PA resident can watch cross country, baseball, basketball and football championships on PA public television but not wrestling.  Also, Young Guns is coached by a former Hawk and he is funneling these kids in that direction as well (Stritmatter).  But then, Penn State only has one PA kid in their line up and that is Starocci.  I like Penn State's chances.  Always have.  

Although I agree with you that PCN still should carry the finals, everything else you said is pretty much wrong.

1.  Flo does not serve the interests of Brands and Smith, Brands and Smith give them tons of coverage while Cael does not, intentionally.
2.  Flo does not give out subscriptions for free to anyone.  All D1 programs have recruiting budgets and their Flo/Track subscriptions come out of that.  I was with a D1 coach at Flonationals at Drexel several years ago and all the big programs coaches were there.  They all paid for their coach pass, all of them including Iowa and Oklahoma State.
3.  Stritmatter has been key to Iowa's recent success but Iowa is not the only program Young Guns recommends.  PSU is on that list and Nolf and Joseph are proof of that (and Teasdale).  Arizona State was on their list too, not sure now.
4.  College coaches do not need to physically watch a state tournament to know who to recruit.  Every PA kid in the top 3 already has dozens if not hundreds of videos of them competing in the offseason going back to elementary.  Places like Super 32, Fargo, NHSCA and Flonationals give coaches all the video they need.  There is so much offseason competing, you can skip being a PIAA wrestler completely and still get nationally ranked and recruited.  This is something the PIAA has not considered with numbers way down here in PA and truthfully, the PIAA has absolutely botched this postseason with their insane super regional.

Edited by Boompa

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Iowa's main recruiting focus is Pennsylvania.  I think 7/10 starters are from PA.  And that is why they are going to win their 1st title in the last decade or so.

The only kid in Iowa's lineup that PSU was 100% on was Lee.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, John Morgan said:

Both are awesome wrestling states with rich histories.   I would say from pure population density alone they would have 3-4 x as many top kids.  Population density helps for competitions, coaching, less travel, club participation, work out partners, etc. 

Explain California then.  Sure they have some standouts but have millions more than PA, OH and NJ combined and would get trounced by an all star team from those 3 states.

Keep in mind, outside of Pittsburgh and Philly...aside from the mountains, there is little difference between PA and Iowa and it is suburbs and rural areas that produce 99% of the state's talent.

Any serious offseason tournament in PA is loaded with NJ teams.

Edited by Boompa

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don’t understand how stupid someone has to be to not understand that the sport could be run better and does not have to be a niche club only sport... and still produce elite wrestlers.. 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, jp157 said:

I don’t understand how stupid someone has to be to not understand that the sport could be run better and does not have to be a niche club only sport... and still produce elite wrestlers.. 
 

are you pot or kettle?

i get you two confused all the time...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, LJB said:

are you pot or kettle?

i get you two confused all the time...

I would expect confusion from you. The ability to only think in extremes about an issue tends to do that to people. 

Like I said. It’s Even more amusing if you are who I think you are. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, jp157 said:

I would expect confusion from you. The ability to only think in extremes about an issue tends to do that to people. 

Like I said. It’s Even more amusing if you are who I think you are. 

this post is chock full of the type of irony that keeps me coming back to this place...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Boompa said:

Although I agree with you that PCN still should carry the finals, everything else you said is pretty much wrong.

1.  Flo does not serve the interests of Brands and Smith, Brands and Smith give them tons of coverage while Cael does not, intentionally.
2.  Flo does not give out subscriptions for free to anyone.  All D1 programs have recruiting budgets and their Flo/Track subscriptions come out of that.  I was with a D1 coach at Flonationals at Drexel several years ago and all the big programs coaches were there.  They all paid for their coach pass, all of them including Iowa and Oklahoma State.
3.  Stritmatter has been key to Iowa's recent success but Iowa is not the only program Young Guns recommends.  PSU is on that list and Nolf and Joseph are proof of that (and Teasdale).  Arizona State was on their list too, not sure now.
4.  College coaches do not need to physically watch a state tournament to know who to recruit.  Every PA kid in the top 3 already has dozens if not hundreds of videos of them competing in the offseason going back to elementary.  Places like Super 32, Fargo, NHSCA and Flonationals give coaches all the video they need.  There is so much offseason competing, you can skip being a PIAA wrestler completely and still get nationally ranked and recruited.  This is something the PIAA has not considered with numbers way down here in PA and truthfully, the PIAA has absolutely botched this postseason with their insane super regional.

  I have close ties with one of the founders of Flo.  

1. You proved my point by saying "Brands and Smith" get tons of coverage. Their programs dominate Flo headlines. Whether Cael is interested in Flo or not, Flo serves the interests of Iowa and Oklahoma State.  Flo showed little interest when Pat Pecora won his 618th  dual meet for DII Pitt Johnstown.  Coach Pecora became the winningest wrestling coach in DI, DII, DIII and NAIA combined.  When an Army West Point wrestler CJ Morgan was tragically killed on a training mission two summers ago at West Point, there was very little if any coverage by Flo.  

2. I have enjoyed a discounted Flo account since it's inception. Why wouldn't others?

3. Just because Nolf and Joseph chose Penn State, that doesn't mean Stritmatter isn't feeding Iowa.   Lee, DeSanto, Murin,  Kemerer and Young, probably wouldn't have gone to Iowa had their club coach wrestled at lets say Michigan, Virginia Tech or NC State. 

4. The internet has made the wrestling world a smaller place.  One of the reasons Team USA now has an edge over the PA all stars (since its inception in 1975) is because the Dapper Dan Committee now can recruit the best national talent via Youtube, Flo the Intermat etc. etc.  And they do.  But that doesn't mean college coaches aren't benefitting from watching the PIAA tournament.  I know for a fact the intent behind buying the rights to the PIAA Tournament was to provide easy access to the best high school wrestlers to fans, coaches and wrestling enthusiasts all around the country.  

Agree to disagree. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, LJB said:

ugh...

the typical "grassroots" wrestler circa 1968 who wrestled the same 10 mediocre kids 12 times in a junior high season coming in as a freshman to whatever high school he happened to live closest by who is currently yelling at kids to get off his lawn this morning and going on about the good ole days at the coffee shop to the other retirees...

You from Iowa? 

I am providing an analysis from what I see on the tourney circuit. I dont really know why you think thats a reason to make fun of me. If you disagree, make your arguement and I may or may not disagree. Dont be a douche.

Edited by Drake_Mallard

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, The Downington Destroyer said:

  I have close ties with one of the founders of Flo.  

1. You proved my point by saying "Brands and Smith" get tons of coverage. Their programs dominate Flo headlines. Whether Cael is interested in Flo or not, Flo serves the interests of Iowa and Oklahoma State.  Flo showed little interest when Pat Pecora won his 618th  dual meet for DII Pitt Johnstown.  Coach Pecora became the winningest wrestling coach in DI, DII, DIII and NAIA combined.  When an Army West Point wrestler CJ Morgan was tragically killed on a training mission two summers ago at West Point, there was very little if any coverage by Flo.  

2. I have enjoyed a discounted Flo account since it's inception. Why wouldn't others?

3. Just because Nolf and Joseph chose Penn State, that doesn't mean Stritmatter isn't feeding Iowa.   Lee, DeSanto, Murin,  Kemerer and Young, probably wouldn't have gone to Iowa had their club coach wrestled at lets say Michigan, Virginia Tech or NC State. 

4. The internet has made the wrestling world a smaller place.  One of the reasons Team USA now has an edge over the PA all stars (since its inception in 1975) is because the Dapper Dan Committee now can recruit the best national talent via Youtube, Flo the Intermat etc. etc.  And they do.  But that doesn't mean college coaches aren't benefitting from watching the PIAA tournament.  I know for a fact the intent behind buying the rights to the PIAA Tournament was to provide easy access to the best high school wrestlers to fans, coaches and wrestling enthusiasts all around the country.  

Agree to disagree. 

Desanto is not a Young Guns wrestler, he is from Exeter (Reading) which is hours away from YG.

I am a fan of non PSU PA talent all going to one program, now if they could stop going to tOSU....but a big fan at Iowa, Cornell, VA tech, NC State and UNC.

Megaludis was a YG wrestler as well.

I agree with you that Flo doesn't cover smaller programs but the big programs are click bait...welcome to the internet.

But coaches do not need to watch the PIAA tournament anymore.  These kids are everywhere today which makes wrestling a much bigger place.

You mention 1969, it isn't even the same sport anymore.  The Dapper Dan is almost pointless now, these kids have already seen each other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Boompa said:

Explain California then.  Sure they have some standouts but have millions more than PA, OH and NJ combined and would get trounced by an all star team from those 3 states.

Keep in mind, outside of Pittsburgh and Philly...aside from the mountains, there is little difference between PA and Iowa and it is suburbs and rural areas that produce 99% of the state's talent.

Any serious offseason tournament in PA is loaded with NJ teams.

Good point.  I think CA could hold their own in a dual meet tournament.  If there were such a weighted average ranking, here is how I would rank the states by quality output of HS wrestlers...

 

1.  PA

2.  OH

3.  NJ

4.  IL

5.  CA

6.  Tie...MN, MI, IA, OK, MO (probably couple others could go in here but who's to say)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Drake_Mallard said:

You from Iowa? 

I am providing an analysis from what I see on the tourney circuit. I dont really know why you think thats a reason to make fun of me. If you disagree, make your arguement and I may or may not disagree. Dont be a douche.

Hey...

not to be that guy, but...

 

i can see your hoo-ha...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Boompa said:

Desanto is not a Young Guns wrestler, he is from Exeter (Reading) which is hours away from YG.

I am a fan of non PSU PA talent all going to one program, now if they could stop going to tOSU....but a big fan at Iowa, Cornell, VA tech, NC State and UNC.

Megaludis was a YG wrestler as well.

I agree with you that Flo doesn't cover smaller programs but the big programs are click bait...welcome to the internet.

But coaches do not need to watch the PIAA tournament anymore.  These kids are everywhere today which makes wrestling a much bigger place.

You mention 1969, it isn't even the same sport anymore.  The Dapper Dan is almost pointless now, these kids have already seen each other.

How would you know that DeSanto is not or has not worked out with Young Guns?  Young Guns has sites in Michigan, Illinois, Pittsburgh, Altoona, Pitt-Johnstown, Franklin-Regional and Latrobe.  Driving 3-4 hours one way to work out with elite partners is common for kids these days. 

The ACC used to be a graveyard for  PA stars.  Now the PA kids are having success at Virginia, Virginia Tech, North Carolina and NC State. And these programs are competitive. That doesn't mean that Iowa isn't recruiting PA or Young Guns kids. 

Yes Megaludis was a Young Guns kid. Megaludis was a member of Young Guns because their first training site was in his high school's wrestling room.  But that does not deter from the fact that Iowa is pulling kids from Young Guns.  

Coaches don't need to watch the PIAA tournament, but they do.  And they use Flo for its access.

We are getting off topic here.  The question or title of this thread is about Iowa recruiting Iowa? Yeah it does but my point is the Brands would not enjoy the same level of success as Gable did without PA 'feeding' Iowa University.  

Also, I can say this objectively and that is Flo has a mid-western bias.  Two or their founders are Northwestern and Mizzou boys.  And, I know they purposely are overindulgent with their coverage of Mizzou, Oklahoma State and Iowa programs. 

Just curious, when was the last time you saw the Dapper Dan Wrestling Classic?  It is far from pointless. It's one of the greatest shows on earth.  And, my point about 1969 is that wrestling enthusiasts in the commonwealth of PA  have after 50 years,  lost the privilege of watching their own high school state wrestling tournament.  Someone is benefitting from this decision and it's not PA high school wrestling fans. 

 

Edited by The Downington Destroyer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a question about Iowa recruiting - and it is not snark or criticism. Why do they have so few African American kids? Is it that kids think the culture of the program won't fit them? The coaches? Recruiting areas? Honestly wondering about it. I'm sure people on here have theories/explanations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

clearly, the brands are racist as is all of iowa...

didn't you see drake ayala making the white power symbol after winning his 3rd state title?

all the "woke white women" let everyone know how horrendous it was and how he should be admonished for the greater good...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, LJB said:

clearly, the brands are racist as is all of iowa...

didn't you see drake ayala making the white power symbol after winning his 3rd state title?

all the "woke white women" let everyone know how horrendous it was and how he should be admonished for the greater good...

I said it wasn't a critical comment. Chill. I lived in the midwest for many years. Don't think they are racist at all. Just wondering why they don't have more black kids on the team as compared to other schools with national reach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

I said it wasn't a critical comment. Chill. I lived in the midwest for many years. Don't think they are racist at all. Just wondering why they don't have more black kids on the team as compared to other schools with national reach.

i am very chill...

it's a divisive question that can only lead to nonsense and can not be answered on this silly forum... nor should it...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, Boompa said:

Explain California then.  Sure they have some standouts but have millions more than PA, OH and NJ combined and would get trounced by an all star team from those 3 states.

Keep in mind, outside of Pittsburgh and Philly...aside from the mountains, there is little difference between PA and Iowa and it is suburbs and rural areas that produce 99% of the state's talent.

Any serious offseason tournament in PA is loaded with NJ teams.

"Outside of Philly and Pittsburgh there is no difference between Iowa and PA." Are you kidding?  Erie County, Johnstown, Cambria County, Harrisburg, and the Lehigh Valley and Washington County are wrestling 'hot beds' quite far from both Pittsburgh and Philadelphia.  These areas are wrestling cradles from where the likes of Jimmy Carr, Nate Carr, Carlton Haselrig, Bobby Weaver, Ed Ruth, Quentin Wright, Jordan Oliver, Keith Gavin, Darian Cruz, Wade Schalles, Pat Santoro, Rob Koll,  Greg Jones and Jack Cuvo originated. Coleman Scott and Cary Kolat are from outlying areas that are not considered Pittsburgh.  Nolf, Megaludis and Lee are from areas 30-50 miles east of Pittsburgh.  Kurt Angle is from Pittsburgh! He grew up in Keystone Oaks and transferred to Mt. Lebanon High School. In fact, in 2012, 12 former PA wrestlers qualified for the Olympic Trials.  Coleman Scott and Drew Headlee (Waynesburg), Jordan Oliver (Easton), Cary Kolat (Jefferson Morgan), Keith Gavin (Lehigh Valley), Quentin Wright (Bald Eagle), Ed Ruth (Susquehanna Township), and Justin Grant (Kutztown) are all from somewhere other than Pittsburgh or Philly. PA would crush Iowa in a dual with or without their WPIAL kids.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, LJB said:

i am very chill...

it's a divisive question that can only lead to nonsense and can not be answered on this silly forum... nor should it...

Well, the second part of your answer may well be accurate. But I don't believe it is inherently a divisive question, unless people choose to treat it as such.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Well, the second part of your answer may well be accurate. But I don't believe it is inherently a divisive question, unless people choose to treat it as such.

there is no reason reasonable adults should not be able to discuss it, but, it has proven here and all over this now incredibly silly country that it can not be discussed without the inevitable...

personally, looking at any roster of any sport and counting the number of kids who have more melanin than others seems just incredibly asinine and counter productive... i just don't think like that...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...