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Desanto sanctioned

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4 minutes ago, GreatWhiteNorth said:

More "internet outrage" over fact less bologna.

It is old and getting older by the minute.

Oh the days when people got away with their abusive behavior!  I pine for them.

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1 minute ago, Class said:

Oh the days when people got away with their abusive behavior!  I pine for them.

Do we know what actually happened in this situation, from beginning to end? No.

Do we know the official wasn't behaving in an abusive manner? No.

Do we know the back-and-forth dialogue that took place? No.

What do we have here for facts? Very little.

Is it time for judgment on who was in the right and who was in the wrong with any type of certainty at all? No.

I rest my case. 

For those of you who feel compelled to be outraged and to think you somehow know more than everyone else, carry on.

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1 minute ago, GreatWhiteNorth said:

Do we know what actually happened in this situation, from beginning to end? No.

Do we know the official wasn't behaving in an abusive manner? No.

Do we know the back-and-forth dialogue that took place? No.

What do we have here for facts? Very little.

Is it time for judgment on who was in the right and who was in the wrong with any type of certainty at all? No.

I rest my case. 

For those of you who feel compelled to be outraged and to think you somehow know more than everyone else, carry on.

But something did happen.  We all know that with 100% certainty as his coach excluded him from the best night of his young life.

the details are coming and they don’t sound good.  Obviously.

the conversation is all relevant even if we don’t know verbatim yet.

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Just now, GreatWhiteNorth said:

Do we know what actually happened in this situation, from beginning to end? No.

Do we know the official wasn't behaving in an abusive manner? No.

Do we know the back-and-forth dialogue that took place? No.

What do we have here for facts? Very little.

Is it time for judgment on who was in the right and who was in the wrong with any type of certainty at all? No.

I rest my case. 

For those of you who feel compelled to be outraged and to think you somehow know more than everyone else, carry on.

i ReSt My CaSe

If DeSanto said that, what would make it justified? If the official said, “hey ******* get the f over here?” Is the appropriate response to threaten their life? Jfc dude. Stay away from women

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I think lots of things can be true at the same time on this one.

  • Probably not great for an NCAA press employee to be giving direction to a wrestler before he's even finished shaking hands with his coach.
  • In this case, she was probably particularly not worried about him reacting negatively because he'd just won, not lost.  Not realizing that this particular guy is as intense as he is and probably still burning up about last night's loss.
  • Regardless, though:  The wrestler appears to have said something unacceptable under any circumstances to an employee of the organization putting on the tournament. 
  • The press release and punishment demonstrate that.
  • DeSanto appears to have made both wrestling and maturity strides since his freshman year.
  • He needs to mature more.
  • There is some tightrope walking in terms of conduct on and around the mats in the Iowa program.  I LOL'd at the Terry hot mic at Big Tens, and the passion there is incredibly productive, but the coaches have got to keep themselves and the athletes on the right side of the line so that their passion and excellence and contributions to the sport don't get undermined such as by a team championship being talked about less than it should be.  

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2 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Right because we wouldn't be willing to nail someone to the wall based on a rumor.  That seems reasonable

Yeah you’re also apparently dumb as a rock. Typically goes along with abusive behavior so that makes sense.

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1 minute ago, drag it said:

I think lots of things can be true at the same time on this one.

  • Probably not great for an NCAA press employee to be giving direction to a wrestler before he's even finished shaking hands with his coach.  

No. Just stop. If it’s all true, the employee could’ve thrown something at him, swore at him, insulted him, called him names, etc. That still doesnt justify threatening to kill someone. There is no middle ground or “both sides messed up” to this if true.

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2 minutes ago, simple said:

i ReSt My CaSe

If DeSanto said that, what would make it justified? If the official said, “hey ******* get the f over here?” Is the appropriate response to threaten their life? Jfc dude. Stay away from women

You seem to have a large chip on your shoulder.

Threatening someone's life is unacceptable. The problem here is that we don't know that is what happened, except for some unverified internet postings. We don't know that Desanto threatened anyone's life.

We simply don't know. (That video that was posted may not even be of the official that the internet rumors are referring to. We really, really don't know.)

The biggest problem is that not knowing the facts doesn't seem to slow you down at all in making judgement - you may not see it right now, but take a breath here. You are acting exactly like the prejudiced people you appear to hate so much. 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, GreatWhiteNorth said:

You seem to have a large chip on your shoulder.

Threatening someone's life is unacceptable. The problem here is that we don't know that is what happened, except for some unverified internet postings. We don't know that Desanto threatened anyone's life.

We simply don't know. (That video that was posted may not even be of the official that the internet rumors are referring to. We really, really don't know.)

The biggest problem is that not knowing the facts doesn't seem to slow you down at all in making judgement - you may not see it right now, but take a breath here. You are acting exactly like the prejudiced people you appear to hate so much. 

 

 

Except for the fact that I never once said as a matter of fact that he did it. Everything I’ve said about the alleged incident is “if true”. Maybe learn how to read. And seriously this is a problem whether DeSanto said anything or not ....

 

“Do we know what actually happened in this situation, from beginning to end? No.

Do we know the official wasn't behaving in an abusive manner? No.

Do we know the back-and-forth dialogue that took place? No.“

 

As if there’s something the employee could’ve said or done to justify what was allegedly said. If DeSanto said what is alleged, none of the above matters.

Edited by simple

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3 minutes ago, simple said:

Except for the fact that I never once said as a matter of fact that he did it. Everything I’ve said about the alleged incident is “if true”. Maybe learn how to read. And seriously this is a problem whether DeSanto said anything or not ....

 

“Do we know what actually happened in this situation, from beginning to end? No.

Do we know the official wasn't behaving in an abusive manner? No.

Do we know the back-and-forth dialogue that took place? No.“

 

if DeSanto said what is alleged, none of the above matters.

Good point, so until we know anything for sure, we can stfu. I'll start.

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3 minutes ago, simple said:

i ReSt My CaSe

If DeSanto said that, what would make it justified? If the official said, “hey ******* get the f over here?” Is the appropriate response to threaten their life? Jfc dude. Stay away from women

You do realize that instead of actually contributing to helping fix the existing issues in our culture you’re actually making it harder to get anything done. The issues exist. They need addressing. You are being less than useless in the work to fix them.

Your behavior comes across as grandstanding, simpering and virtue signaling white knight.. the moment you started the “I hope you aren’t married” and “stay away from women” based off  tiny bit of conversation. You’re accusing people of being abusers as well... 

There are ways to actually help young men, and people in general, understand the issues that exist and ways to actually work on fixing them.. things like making young men more aware of how much physical size and presence change how a woman perceives something vs them.. among other things. All of these ways require time and hard work.. your blind accusing makes people shut down to even acknowledging the bad crap that goes on.. 

and also.. my “personal” experience is that every single “male feminist” type dude being “vocal” the way you are... that I’ve known in person always ends up just being a dude simping so the girls will like him or the kind that resents women and takes advantage of them or hurts them. 

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*and to make clear to everyone... If DeSanto did do what he is accused of.. it’s was disgusting, wrong and should be handled accordingly..

I’m simply sick of of grandstanding idiots making it harder to actually address and fix real issues like the “simple” person on this thread. 

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If Desanto threatened an NCAA employee, he should be barred from competing  at next year's NCAA tournament. If it happened on day 1, he should have been immediately ejected. Not much you can do since it happened after he was done competing. He clearly did something or Iowa wouldn't have sanctioned him.

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11 minutes ago, jp157 said:

You do realize that instead of actually contributing to helping fix the existing issues in our culture you’re actually making it harder to get anything done. The issues exist. They need addressing. You are being less than useless in the work to fix them.

Your behavior comes across as grandstanding, simpering and virtue signaling white knight.. the moment you started the “I hope you aren’t married” and “stay away from women” based off  tiny bit of conversation. You’re accusing people of being abusers as well... 

There are ways to actually help young men, and people in general, understand the issues that exist and ways to actually work on fixing them.. things like making young men more aware of how much physical size and presence change how a woman perceives something vs them.. among other things. All of these ways require time and hard work.. your blind accusing makes people shut down to even acknowledging the bad crap that goes on.. 

and also.. my “personal” experience is that every single “male feminist” type dude being “vocal” the way you are... that I’ve known in person always ends up just being a dude simping so the girls will like him or the kind that resents women and takes advantage of them or hurts them. 

Yes I’m simping so all the females on themat.com will like me. Great argument.

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13 minutes ago, simple said:

No. Just stop. If it’s all true, the employee could’ve thrown something at him, swore at him, insulted him, called him names, etc. That still doesnt justify threatening to kill someone. There is no middle ground or “both sides messed up” to this if true.

Correct.  Nothing justifies threatening to kill someone.  Appreciate the insight on that, although we have exactly the same certainty that that happened as we do that Marinelli broke his rib.  What we do know is what I also said, which I'll paste again here:

  • Regardless, though:  The wrestler appears to have said something unacceptable under any circumstances to an employee of the organization putting on the tournament. 
  • The press release and punishment demonstrate that.
  • DeSanto appears to have made both wrestling and maturity strides since his freshman year.
  • He needs to mature more.

Sorry for the equivocal language about his conduct being "unacceptable under any circumstances" as demonstrated by his "punishment"; and him "needing to mature more."  

If the NCAA employee had done something particularly wrong, she would have been sanctioned, just as DeSanto was.  She didn't and shouldn't be, and I didn't say she did or should be; compare my descriptions of their conduct, which are nothing alike.  

That doesn't mean that there is a problem with observing that it's probably not bad policy for the NCAA -- which celebrates and makes a lot of money off of the extreme and painful nature of the sport generally and the gauntlet of the tournament that it puts on specifically -- to observe that a wrestler immediately emerging from that gauntlet, specifically his sixth time through seven minutes of combat in three days, should be allowed to finish shaking hands with his coach, walk away from the mat, and take a drink of water before being given instructions on where to go and what to do by a stranger.  Two things can be true at once.  Those two things can include both a relatively minor matter of policy that it would be in the interest of both the tournament's organizers and participants to correct, and what we know to have been a much more serious breach of what we (and Tom Brands) view as appropriate conduct.  

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