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Katie

JB fan support thread

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1 minute ago, nyum said:

This thread should be longer. JB da goat 

Totally agree. Shocked the world in 2011 and has been phenomenal for USA wrestling 

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Just now, Jajensen09 said:

dake has been and never be wrestler Dake is. This could be dakes ONLY olympic appearance. To compare him to jb is a disgrace

Shut up about dake. This is the JB thread. 

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Next 12-14 months will be as definitive as anything.  JB is already top two all time I’d say, second only to john smith.  If JB can, or wishes to, keep fighting for a spot and wins one and a world gold to go with it, best to ever do it.

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2 hours ago, Katie said:

Dake won fair and square.  I’m pretty sad, but such is life.  JB had a phenomenal run. Gotta get behind Dake now. 

JB a tremendous representative for USA wrestling.  Dake is better at this point, but I think JB has regressed with Dake getting better.  Probably just behind Smith on International ladder for USA wrestlers. 

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Just now, Drew87 said:

Next 12-14 months will be as definitive as anything.  JB is already top two all time I’d say, second only to john smith.  If JB can, or wishes to, keep fighting for a spot and wins one and a world gold to go with it, best to ever do it.

I'm a big fan but I can't give him that. He's just lost too much. Smith retired when he was 30, I think, after winning 6 straight. Two O golds. There are some arguments for JB being in a different era with more former USSR guys spread around and fewer weights, etc. but I can't unsee all those JB losses and Smith was so good pretty much every time. He lost to Reinoso but still won gold in Seoul, but JB lost and then lost again and didn't even place in Rio. 

John Smith is the US GOAT.

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8 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

I'm a big fan but I can't give him that. He's just lost too much. Smith retired when he was 30, I think, after winning 6 straight. Two O golds. There are some arguments for JB being in a different era with more former USSR guys spread around and fewer weights, etc. but I can't unsee all those JB losses and Smith was so good pretty much every time. He lost to Reinoso but still won gold in Seoul, but JB lost and then lost again and didn't even place in Rio. 

John Smith is the US GOAT.

I did not realize he retired that young, that is absolutely preposterous, thanks for the read up

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1 minute ago, Drew87 said:

I did not realize he retired that young, that is absolutely preposterous, thanks for the read up

Smith also had several very notable wins that never get talked about in the GOAT discussions.

He won the Goodwill Games twice during that insane run, which were a pretty big thing back in the day. In the finals, he beat a Soviet world champ (Isayev) and another very tough Soviet, Stephan Sarkissian, his 1988 Olympic finals opponent.

In a less meaningful but nevertheless awesome exhibition match, he dominated one of the few Soviet all-time greats Sergei Beloglazov who agreed to move up  a weight to take on Smith. 

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57 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

I'm a big fan but I can't give him that. He's just lost too much. Smith retired when he was 30, I think, after winning 6 straight. Two O golds. There are some arguments for JB being in a different era with more former USSR guys spread around and fewer weights, etc. but I can't unsee all those JB losses and Smith was so good pretty much every time. He lost to Reinoso but still won gold in Seoul, but JB lost and then lost again and didn't even place in Rio. 

John Smith is the US GOAT.

Loss of weights is a huge point to factor in as you mentioned.

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JB has been at the same weight since 2011.  I have to think that making weight all that time isn't easy and has affected some of his performances.  I really think he should consider 79KG for worlds.  I could see him cranking out another gold or two there...

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7 hours ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Smith also had several very notable wins that never get talked about in the GOAT discussions.

He won the Goodwill Games twice during that insane run, which were a pretty big thing back in the day. In the finals, he beat a Soviet world champ (Isayev) and another very tough Soviet, Stephan Sarkissian, his 1988 Olympic finals opponent.

In a less meaningful but nevertheless awesome exhibition match, he dominated one of the few Soviet all-time greats Sergei Beloglazov who agreed to move up  a weight to take on Smith. 

I think Smith is number one US wrestler, but it is close. Smith also lost to Sarkissian at least once. And not only was Beloglazov up a weight, he was also retired

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8 minutes ago, Jim L said:

I think Smith is number one US wrestler, but it is close. Smith also lost to Sarkissian at least once. And not only was Beloglazov up a weight, he was also retired

How many times did Smith lose and how many times did JB lose? And how good were the guys he lost to? Sarkissian was an absolute monster. The reason he doesn’t have some yellow hardware himself is because of Smith. JB lost to Marable and got teched by Bekzod (he’s not a slouch but téchese). Both apuren the time of his peak.

i already said the Beloglazov win was less significant but threw it in there because of Sergei’s unique credentials. 

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6 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

How many times did Smith lose and how many times did JB lose? And how good were the guys he lost to? Sarkissian was an absolute monster. The reason he doesn’t have some yellow hardware himself is because of Smith. JB lost to Marable and got teched by Bekzod (he’s not a slouch but téchese). Both apuren the time of his peak.

i already said the Beloglazov win was less significant but threw it in there because of Sergei’s unique credentials. 

It’s not just about who they lost to it’s who they beat. One of Smith’s golds was vs a Canadian who never placed before or after that worlds. The multiple weights and Russians bit is a HUGE factor. Not only did JB have to deal with the Soviet breakup but he had to deal with Russians transferring all over the world to other countries. JBs first gold came against a 2 time defending world champ in the quarters!

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