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Did your state GOAT come from the pool of undefeated’s?

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On 4/16/2021 at 9:58 PM, Mizzoufan01 said:

TJ hill is my Goat for Missouri goat. Fargo finishes:

Junior Free champ 96 & 97 2nd in 95 & 98

Greco Junior Champ 95,96 & 97 2nd 98

Cadet Free Champ 95

1x NCAA D1 AA in his only year. 4x state champ. Schatzman is next. Jaydin Eierman being undefeated in Missouri’s small class hurts him high school wise. Several wrestlers I would place above him. 

 

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't disagree with Hill... Man that kid was amazing at Fargo. A bummer to lose both his finals his senior year. Both guys who beat him were OW. 

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On 4/13/2021 at 12:00 AM, TobusRex said:

Problem with Blair is many of their best wrestlers come from other states.  Hard to claim a guy as the best HS wrestler New Jersey has ever had when the kid was originally from, oh, Texas. 

and they are a year or two older than most high school kids. super seniors. 

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17 minutes ago, TheHeel said:

and they are a year or two older than most high school kids. super seniors. 

Not sure where you get that idea. They can't be 19 before 9/1 like most everyone else to be able to wrestle publics. Years ago they were largely a PG team but that ended early to mid 90s.

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On 4/13/2021 at 7:03 AM, Gasman1 said:

I'd go Ashnault over Suriano...  both 4x undefeated state champs but Ash had a better NCAA career with 4 aa finishes.  And far less drama. 

Ashnault did not have a better college career that’s crazy.

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7 hours ago, scribe said:

Didn’t kish have a ridiculous high school career? 

Yes. Roger Kish was a 4xer and only had 2 losses, both as a freshman at 160lbs in 2000.  MI has 4 divisions, with 1 being the biggest schools based on enrollment and 4 being the smallest. Roger’s school was DII. Both of his losses came to kids that were upper class men that wrestled each other in the DI state semifinals that year (no seeding so the top 2 could hit each other in the semis based on random draw for each of 4 regions).   Roger easily won DII at 160 that season. 
 

One loss was to a senior Brad Anderson. He was a 2xer going into that season. The other was to a Senior Mitch Hancock, a returning finalist. Anderson had beaten Hancock in the Finals the year prior, where Hancock took a solid lead and inexplicably gassed to lose in OT.  Hancock would end up beating Anderson 7-3 and winning DI with a 15-7 victory In the Finals. Anderson easily wrestled back for 3rd. 
 

Both guys would end up going to Central Michigan. It didn’t pan out for Anderson, but Hancock would end up an AA for CMU and is now crazy successful as the Head Coach of his Alma Mater, Detroit(Novi) Catholic Central.  
 

Anderson is also the head coach of his Alma Mater, Grand Rapids Forest Hills Central and has been for the past 17 years. 
 

With that said, Roger did a TON of winning after that…

Edited by MSU158

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17 hours ago, gimpeltf said:

Not sure where you get that idea. They can't be 19 before 9/1 like most everyone else to be able to wrestle publics. Years ago they were largely a PG team but that ended early to mid 90s.

their team is old. always has been. good to know they aren't having post grads like they used to. 

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I’ll throw my home state out there: Georgia. Probably most would say Sean Hage. I never saw him wrestle, but some that I have seen are Peter Yates and Drake McCoy. I think Yates had one loss HS and it came his Sophomore year in the state finals to Garrison Goins. Goins beat Yates for his fourth title. 
 

Drake McCoy was a dominant heavyweight. 3x state champ and their wasn’t anybody close to him. He is the first person I think of when the “What could have been” argument comes up. 
 

We don’t have a long history of national success, but that is starting to change. 

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1 hour ago, TheHeel said:

their team is old. always has been. good to know they aren't having post grads like they used to. 

Still no idea where you get that. I'm not going to release ages but I checked about half the team and no one appears old for their grade. I don't think I even saw anyone that did or would turn 19 before the end of their senior season.

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On 5/14/2022 at 10:31 PM, JasonBryant said:


Other way around.

Re Gardner: Whenever this topic was first posted, I said Gardner immediately, but what do you think? Jeremy Ferry? Seems like there were a bunch of GB kids during their early aughts run who might be goatish. The Grundy HVY? Or what about Andrew Clement -- my personal favorite who also bears mention in the "could have been" discussion. Adam / Aaron Mik? Your fave Gray Simons?

Edited by jackwebster

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Gray is my sentimental favorite, but he only won ONE state title in high school. My high school teammate Mike Akers was a Fargo finalist and was on a Cadet World Team and was a four timer, lost to Josh Moore in the Beast Finals (up a weight). Akers was ranked #1 at one point in his HS career. Qualified for NCAAs as a true freshman at Virginia Tech.

From my era watching for the 95-current era, Quinn Foster was super under appreciated since he was at a private school and then Blair.

Michael Martin gave CP Schlatter his only HS loss. Dynamic folkstyler, modest freestyle success.

Bond, Gardner, Childress check those boxes. I might put Luke Owens ahead of his fellow Grundy heavy as better, but Childress did win four titles. Owens won 3 and a Junior Fargo title. Childress has a Cadet title.

Might have to come back to the thread with some more thought out options.

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On 4/13/2021 at 4:00 PM, BerniePragle said:

NYS:

Troy Nickerson: 5x state champ,  5x Fargo champ, NCAA 4, 3, 2, 1
Yanni:  4x state champ (injured senior year), 2x NCAA champ (more to come?), FS success
Kyle Dake:  (Only) 2x state champ,  4x NCAA champ, and you know the rest

Tough choice

Yianni was 243-3 and 4x champ.  Greg D. was 219-2 and 5x champ.  Arujau was 216-1 (losing only to Yianni) and 4x champ.

(and Yianni is a 3x NCAA champ.  Let's keep up!)

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I'm guessing Brandon Womack gets it for Alabama:

• A six-time state champion at Scottboro HS, Womack was a four-time team captain.
• Was named the state's Most Outstanding Wrestler five times.
• Graduated with a 422-8 record, with five of his losses coming as a seventh grader.
• Was a perfect 77-0 as a senior, the most wins in an undefeated season in state history.
• In all, 327 of his 422 wins came by fall.
• Won the senior 160-pound division at the National High School Coaches Association national championships as a senior.
• Holds state and national records for pins in a season (68).
• Posted a 190-match win streak during his career.
• Has four of the top six single-season win totals in state history, including a record 85 wins as a sophomore.

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16 hours ago, gimpeltf said:

Still no idea where you get that. I'm not going to release ages but I checked about half the team and no one appears old for their grade. I don't think I even saw anyone that did or would turn 19 before the end of their senior season.

times sure have changed then. thanks for educating me brother. always good to learn. 

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On 5/15/2022 at 7:52 AM, Mokoma said:

Ashnault did not have a better college career that’s crazy.

Ashnault went (124-19) and went 8th, 4th , 6th, 1st - 43 % bonus rate but that’s mostly weighed down from his freshman year when he was at 29% , he was over 50 the other 3 years …

best wins are over ncaa champ Seth gross (15-2) ,

3-0 against ncaa finalist Micah Jordan

, 2-0 with 2 techs over ncaa finalist Dellavecchia,

1-0 against lugo the top seed at cancelled ncaas ,

3-0 with a major over Luke pletcher top seed at cancelled ncaas,

5-4 against kolodzik 

 

Suriano  - (86-7), DNP, 2nd ,1st , 1st - suriano 64 % bonus rate with a lot fewer matches -

best wins are ,2-0 against ncaa champ Cruz

he beat 6 ncaa finalists a total of 9 Times ,

3-0 against Lizak with a pin,

2-0 zeke moisey with a pin 

1-1 vs Micic

1-1 vs Fix 

1-0 vs Courtney

1-0 vs Pat Glory

also 1-0 vs Pletcher ncaa top seed 2020, 2-0 against Seabass , 1-1 vs Desanto , 1-0 against pat McKee by major

Overall career someone can argue ashnault bc he stayed at Rutgers , transformed the program , became the first 4xAA, tied for being first champ with suriano and wrestled in way more matches and was available for his team more often but surianos hit list is unmatched he went up against the best guys all the time and almost always won , he helped Rutgers to there only top 10 ncaa finish ever and helped Michigan to a big ten title and ncaa 2nd place trophy…

I think most people would agree with you that suriano had the better career but ashnault played a major part in lifting an entire program to being a consistent top 15ish team when just a few years before he got to Rutgers they were still a total joke so he should get some points for that 

Edited by Antitroll2828

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42 minutes ago, Antitroll2828 said:

I think most people who agree with you that suriano had the better career but ashnault played a major part in lifting an entire program to being a consistent top 15ish team when just a few years before he got to Rutgers they were still a total joke so he should get some points for that 

I would say it's a solid argument. 

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I would say now Arizona has a clear cut #1. It's RBY. 182-0 and 4x state champion. 3x AA and 2x NCAA champion. Behind him is Eric Larkin who narrowly missed being a 3x state champion and had a dominant senior year winning senior nationals and doubling up at Fargo. Then went 4, 3, 2, 1 at NCAAS for ASU. Both went to the same high school btw. 

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10 hours ago, Plasmodium said:

Angel Cejudo deserves mention in Arizona and Henry Cejudo in Colorado.

True. But Angel actually lost once in high school and Henry had several losses to Nick Gallick his freshman year. Plus neither wrestled in college, though Henry sort of one upped that. Angel was one of the best though. His sophomore year he took apart a kid who was bigger and stronger and had basically just been preparing to beat him all year. Think Angel beat him by tech fall 16-1. 

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I don't really know enough about Colorado wrestling to declare a GOAT, but Tom Clum must be close.  He went undefeated all the way to the final match of his career without surrendering any points other than escapes. He was headlocked twice in the final match and lost. 

Based purely on High School, Kyle Sand has to be up there. He was also a JUCO and DII champ.

I was at the Pepsi Center when Clum was put on his back and man did it get loud!! For everyone but Brett Roller, the outcome was a foregone conclusion to Clum’s stellar career.

Ben Cherrington, Dean Lahr, Ryan Deakin, all have to enter the conversation if we are including college.

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On 5/14/2022 at 7:52 PM, Chucktown_Luke said:

But do you think Kirk Wallman was a better wrestler than any of the aforementioned wrestlers?

Not necessarily, but Kirk got the job done, from the beginning of 7th grade on, no hiccups. Sophomore Chad Lamer gave him an OT match in Kirk's final HS match- pretty exciting stuff!

Kirk was solid. I've heard that his older brother Troy was even better! He only had 4 state titles though.

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