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NJDan

Will Koll succeed at Stanford?

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I have my doubts.

It will be very hard to recruit. First, Stanford's admissions criteria are even harder than Cornell's. He has no history of recruiting Californians. (The one high profile recruit from Cali at Cornell was a huge bust.) And if I am a top guy, do I want to go to school that just cancelled my sport? 

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7 minutes ago, NJDan said:

I have my doubts.

It will be very hard to recruit. First, Stanford's admissions criteria are even harder than Cornell's. He has no history of recruiting Californians. (The one high profile recruit from Cali at Cornell was a huge bust.) And if I am a top guy, do I want to go to school that just cancelled my sport? 

Who was the bust? 

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Disagree - Stanford can recruit nationally and with Koll there and a more robust investment in the program every reason they will do well in recruiting in California and everywhere else.  I doubt there is much difference in Ivy and Stanford recruiting and admissions processes and Ivy league rules might be a bigger annoyance than PAC 10.

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1 minute ago, TobusRex said:

Who was the bust? 

Alex Cisneros.

Prior to Cornell
A three-time state champion and four-time state finalist, Cisneros was a consensus top 10 national recruit in high school. He completed his career with a 177-4 record. Cisneros became the youngest wrestler to win a title in state history and earned NWCA Senior Wrestler of the Year accolades as a senior.

Edited by NJDan

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I don’t think Koll would have gone without confidence that Stanford is committed to success.  The guy has charisma for days and is a wizard at building and working his network.  I can already predict some of his actions as he gets to know the admin at Stanford, finds likely friends at the school, and builds an alliance.  And, he will do it while looking them in the eye and being open about his objectives.  The guy is awesome.  
 

Stanford did great here.  I expect big things.

Edited by nom

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5 minutes ago, NJDan said:

Alex Cisneros.

Prior to Cornell
A three-time state champion and four-time state finalist, Cisneros was a consensus top 10 national recruit in high school. He completed his career with a 177-4 record. Cisneros became the youngest wrestler to win a title in state history and earned NWCA Senior Wrestler of the Year accolades as a senior.

I remember the name but don't remember him doing anything in college. I guess you're right, he was a bust. 

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7 minutes ago, Elevator said:

Disagree - Stanford can recruit nationally and with Koll there and a more robust investment in the program every reason they will do well in recruiting in California and everywhere else.  I doubt there is much difference in Ivy and Stanford recruiting and admissions processes and Ivy league rules might be a bigger annoyance than PAC 10.

I'd imagine it will be easier to recruit guys to Stanford than Cornell. For one, the school is better. Secondly the weather is vastly superior to Cornell's weather. Lastly, California girls. Plus Palo Alto is a really cool little city, lots of **** to do there. Stanford isn't a farm school, after all. 

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Stanford had zero leverage to land a big fish like Koll and Koll is a savvy guy, so I expect he would have negotiated: (i) big salary; (ii) big payout ($1MM) if they drop the program again; (iii) big recruiting budget; (iv) investment in building a higher profile competition schedule (i.e. money for travel); and (v) big budget to promote the program.

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https://cornellbigred.com/sports/wrestling/roster/nahshon-garrett/41087 - with being a two-time California champ and a four-time Fargo AA, I'd say that this was was more than just your average high school wrestler.

Also, I don't remember Stanford being a California-cebtric team in recent years. As stated above, the name alone (not to mention the instant access to some of the greatest education in the world) brings in people from across the globe.

The only change that make this move a step down, in some respects, is that Stanford, unlike Cornell, does not have a public component to it. That will make recruiting harder for Koll, but that dude has proven himself time and time and time again that he knows how to work within the system for great gains. I don't expect Stanford to win it all, but I do expect a few top-four trophies out of them in Koll's first decade on "The Farm".

Beyond all of that, I am most curious to know how he fills put his coaching staff. Rob Koll has always been great about placing credit where it is due, and he understands the value of his assistants to the recruitment and development processes for his teams.

Go, Stanford! Go, Rob Koll!

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Furthermore, there are far too many variables as to why a kid with X high school results does not pan out in college. Every program in every sport has that story. To take it close to home for you, did Mike Grey live up to expectation? How about Scott Winston? Andrew Campolattano? College sports are littered with the "shoulda/coulda/woulda" stories, and they rarely have to do with the coach not being competent enough to develop a student-athlete.

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I think he will be successful, even by Stanford standards (Stanford is the most successful athletic program in the country, arguably without a consistent peer). Reasons to believe include:

  • He has explicit support from a donor base that put up $13M (or whatever the final number was) in a matter of weeks for a program that historically failed the Stanford standard of being competitive. He can and will raise more if he starts putting up AAs every year and even looks like he will start to dominate the conference the way Cornell dominated the EIWA.
  • Stanford is such a draw that it was able to attract a solid team last year even to a failing sport with a no-name coach (apologies to Borelli, who did a commendable job, but Koll is a massive upgrade in terms of results and reputation). Is Koll likely to do no better or worse? No.
  • Stanford has the benefit of being in the PAC-12. Yes, he has to deal with ASU, but the PAC-12 is far from the EIWA in depth.
  • He will have practically no competition recruiting locally.
  • Nationally, Stanford will compete very well with Cornell and Princeton for smart elite wrestlers who could credibly gain admission purely on non-wrestling merit (rare, but they're out there every year, and Stanford as a choice is above all but maybe three or four wrestling schools for those kids, so Koll is likely to get his share). If Koll can land just one such unicorn a year (kids like Matt Gentry and Joey McKenna as well as non-Stanford examples like Yianni D, Kolodzik, et al who had perfect grades), he only needs maybe a couple of recruited athlete slots to field a competitive team and start the ball of administrative support rolling. 

Hard, but the setup is better than it was at Cornell way back when Cornell was just another Ivy vying for EIWA honors, in my opinion.

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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34 minutes ago, Tofurky said:

Beyond all of that, I am most curious to know how he fills put his coaching staff. Rob Koll has always been great about placing credit where it is due, and he understands the value of his assistants to the recruitment and development processes for his teams.

Very true.  From what I've heard (A Cornell insider can correct me on this) is that Koll at the helm took on more of CEO role, focused on recruiting, fundraising etc, and put a lot of trust into his assistants when it came to practices/coaching.  Brining on someone like Nolf would be a huge step forward.

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3 minutes ago, kgschalhoub said:

This move may also represent a larger issue in the Ivy League. Sports are not their priority. Who knows what the conference will do post pandemic?

It'll go right back to normal. Nobody cares more about their endowments and annual budgets than Ivies, and sports are still popular with a small but wealthy pan-Ivy donor demographic.

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If Stanford is fully behind wrestling now, which it appears they may be, I have zero doubt that he will turn them into a powerhouse and they might even compete for a team title. The pitch to get a recruit to go to Stanford is going to be much easier than what he had at Cornell. 

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I think the question that really needs to be asked at this point is what will happen to the assistant wrestling coaches at Stanford (under Borelli)?  Namely Ray Blake and Alex Tirappelle and volunteer coach Kerry McCoy.   Koll is not a young man.  He's not going to be getting on the mat to teach.  He needs some young assistants to teach.  So my guess would be the Borelli assistant coaches will be exited stage left in the very near future.   So who will Koll bring in at Stanford in the way of assistant coaches?

 

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3 hours ago, NJDan said:

I have my doubts.

It will be very hard to recruit. First, Stanford's admissions criteria are even harder than Cornell's. He has no history of recruiting Californians. (The one high profile recruit from Cali at Cornell was a huge bust.) And if I am a top guy, do I want to go to school that just cancelled my sport? 

N A S H O N...?!! Come on man, be better. 
 

 

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7 minutes ago, Bronco said:

I think the question that really needs to be asked at this point is what will happen to the assistant wrestling coaches at Stanford (under Borelli)?  Namely Ray Blake and Alex Tirappelle and volunteer coach Kerry McCoy.   Koll is not a young man.  He's not going to be getting on the mat to teach.  He needs some young assistants to teach.  So my guess would be the Borelli assistant coaches will be exited stage left in the very near future.   So who will Koll bring in at Stanford in the way of assistant coaches?

 

Seriously, how do know he won’t Be teaching wrestling? By that do you mean wrestling live with the guys? I’m pretty sure he can still teach wrestling if he chooses. He’s not that old for goodness sakes.

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10 minutes ago, Downtown Brown said:

Seriously, how do know he won’t Be teaching wrestling? By that do you mean wrestling live with the guys? I’m pretty sure he can still teach wrestling if he chooses. He’s not that old for goodness sakes.

55 is old and I say that as someone who is in his mid 60's.  Hell I retired at 55.   55 is very old to be wrestling with 18 to 25 year old guys.

P.S. Nice job of COMPLETELY missing the point I was making here, i.e., the assistant coaches.

 

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Edited by Bronco

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Well I believe he will be bringing Nolf in tow. I don’t think getting on the mat and teaching wrestling is the same as “wrestling with 18-25 year old guys”. Obviously he will know what he wants to do and we will probably find out soon.

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50 minutes ago, Bronco said:

I think the question that really needs to be asked at this point is what will happen to the assistant wrestling coaches at Stanford (under Borelli)?  Namely Ray Blake and Alex Tirappelle and volunteer coach Kerry McCoy.   Koll is not a young man.  He's not going to be getting on the mat to teach.  He needs some young assistants to teach.  So my guess would be the Borelli assistant coaches will be exited stage left in the very near future.   So who will Koll bring in at Stanford in the way of assistant coaches?

 

Koll gets on the mat with his guys.

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