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Eagle26

Why are wrestling OTT so early??

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I noticed the OTT for swimming just started, track and field is this weekend, gymnastics is after that. Seems like the high profile sports are keeping things much closer to the Olympics… wouldn’t it make sense for us to do the same? A lot can change from April to August. Injuries, illness, weight, and just time to improve. We want the best guy for when the games are actually happening. Especially this year with HUGE improvements in the covid situation and vaccinating young people in the last few months. Suriano might be our best guy at 57 but we’ll never know.

The only reason I can think of to have them that early is so that we know who send to qualify the weight at Last chance qualifier. I do really like having the Olympic reps have their own destinies in their hands. If that’s the only reason, does it outweigh the benefits of doing it closer to the games? I don’t think so, and especially not in this year with covid. 

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23 minutes ago, LJB said:

none of those other "sports" have any kind of weight element involved...

this is not rocket science...

That’s another reason to have it closer to the Olympics. It’s much easier to keep your weight down between the events and it gives guys more time to get to their weight classes 

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6 hours ago, flyingcement said:

Weird it seems like you like talking down to people.  Hope you are doing okay

He’s clearly very insecure about his self-image. He feels the need try to “prove” he is smarter than everyone on the internet. In some cases he does know what he’s talking about, but in many cases he is off the mark, will never admit it, and has to resort to put downs.

Anyway, all our guys grew up making weight nearly every week. They know how to do it. I don’t think it’s wise to make weight as much as we do in our folkstyle system,  but I think having OTT 4-6 weeks before the games would produce no issues with weight and could actually help guys that need the extra time to get weight down. I’d love to hear from someone in the know what the main reasons are. If weight is the only reason we really need to reconsider.

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10 hours ago, Eagle26 said:

That’s another reason to have it closer to the Olympics. It’s much easier to keep your weight down between the events and it gives guys more time to get to their weight classes 

If it’s much easier to keep your weight down, why would you also need the benefit of having more time to get to your weight class?

These guys mold their adult peak body into a place, if they can, to where they just barely touch this weight for the scale, and that’s it. For the most part theyre no where near it before or after. 

Our system is such that our guys are spread out over a vast area. It benefits us to go a little earlier so that our national coaches and leading program developers have the time to zero in on our Olympic team, to give the guy/gal going full benefit of resources. 
 

Wrestling, quite obviously, is a completely different performance than track, swimming, et al, with completely different demands, and therefore completely different training and training cycles. The comparison isn’t there. 
 

Or in short, you base your wrestling timing on what’s best for wrestlers, now what’s best for runners and swimmers. 

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1 hour ago, Lurker said:

If it’s much easier to keep your weight down, why would you also need the benefit of having more time to get to your weight class?

These guys mold their adult peak body into a place, if they can, to where they just barely touch this weight for the scale, and that’s it. For the most part theyre no where near it before or after. 

Our system is such that our guys are spread out over a vast area. It benefits us to go a little earlier so that our national coaches and leading program developers have the time to zero in on our Olympic team, to give the guy/gal going full benefit of resources. 
 

Wrestling, quite obviously, is a completely different performance than track, swimming, et al, with completely different demands, and therefore completely different training and training cycles. The comparison isn’t there. 
 

Or in short, you base your wrestling timing on what’s best for wrestlers, now what’s best for runners and swimmers. 

Thanks for the thoughtful response. I agree we need to do what is best for wrestling and not just go by other sports. I’m just not sure if doing it early is best for wrestling… at least not in regards to weight cutting. I’m thinking of a guy like James Green who had to shrink his body and atrophy his muscles to make weight. There’s no way he could keep his muscles from rebuilding for 4 months. So if he made the team he would have to do it twice. If it were 4-6 weeks away his muscles wouldn’t rebuild much. He would have plenty of time to rehydrate and feel good for another peak training cycle but wouldn’t have to go through the body shrinking phase again. Also, in regards to having more time to get there, I just meant they wouldn’t have to get down to weight until June instead of April. For anyone whose training situation was affected by Covid, that could be helpful.

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I think a sport like swimming is based so much on physical readiness and preparation that the timing of the trials is set to maximize that for the Olympics. Australia is also doing their trials right now, so there must be something to that. The tapering and peaking cycle for swimming is such that this timing makes sense for them. The NCAA swimming championships is a full month after the conference championships, for example.

In wrestling, there is less of that because the physical demands of the sport are so different. I don’t think wrestling “has” to have trials when it does, and it does seem to be related to the timing of the Last Chance events. I do think a decent gap between the trials and Olympics is helpful for anyone who needs to recover from a minor injury suffered at the event, but four months seems more related to the Last chance than any physical prep needs.

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More time to recover from nagging injuries ( or get sidelined by one). 

Either way it would be great to have time to prepare for your opponents with video, practice etc.

Swimming/gymnastics - you only need to work on your routine.

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1 hour ago, IronChef said:

In wrestling, there is less of that because the physical demands of the sport are so different. I don’t think wrestling “has” to have trials when it does, and it does seem to be related to the timing of the Last Chance events. I do think a decent gap between the trials and Olympics is helpful for anyone who needs to recover from a minor injury suffered at the event, but four months seems more related to the Last chance than any physical prep needs.

Not much else to say other than this.  As long as the last chance OQT's are in late April or early May, OTT's will be in early April.  

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Because OTT and Olympics are separate training regimens. It's a grind like no other, and sport science has proven that modern athletes need rest and recovery to return optimal results. So keeping the trials and the event spaced out are a-okay.

Program 1 (OTT): Train, peak, taper, travel, maintain weight, get beat to hell, and need at least 2 weeks of physical recovery. Though I obviously haven't competed at OTT, I would assume it feels very comparable to competing for the top spot in an Ironman when you wake up Monday morning.

Recovery program: At least 2 weeks of physical recovery

Program 2: 12-14 week training cycle with a peak and taper focused on international travel + circadian rhythm adjustment + weight management + physical maintenance, then put it all together on game day.

 

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4 hours ago, Eagle26 said:

He’s clearly very insecure about his self-image. He feels the need try to “prove” he is smarter than everyone on the internet. In some cases he does know what he’s talking about, but in many cases he is off the mark, will never admit it, and has to resort to put downs.

Anyway, all our guys grew up making weight nearly every week. They know how to do it. I don’t think it’s wise to make weight as much as we do in our folkstyle system,  but I think having OTT 4-6 weeks before the games would produce no issues with weight and could actually help guys that need the extra time to get weight down. I’d love to hear from someone in the know what the main reasons are. If weight is the only reason we really need to reconsider.

IMar.  J'Den.  DC.  All the guys who don't bother wrestling day 2 of OTT because the cut was too hard...

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24 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Because OTT and Olympics are separate training regimens. It's a grind like no other, and sport science has proven that modern athletes need rest and recovery to return optimal results. So keeping the trials and the event spaced out are a-okay.

Program 1 (OTT): Train, peak, taper, travel, maintain weight, get beat to hell, and need at least 2 weeks of physical recovery. Though I obviously haven't competed at OTT, I would assume it feels very comparable to competing for the top spot in an Ironman when you wake up Monday morning.

Recovery program: At least 2 weeks of physical recovery

Program 2: 12-14 week training cycle with a peak and taper focused on international travel + circadian rhythm adjustment + weight management + physical maintenance, then put it all together on game day.

 

Shhhhhh about the sport science. They don’t want to hear it. If they did they couldn’t justify making their 10 year wrestle hundreds of matches in a year and brag about their stud. 
 

on a less flippant note. People should start listening to the top coaches. They’ve started adopting the sports science en mass and the ones who haven’t are getting left behind 

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12 hours ago, flyingcement said:

Weird it seems like you like talking down to people.  Hope you are doing okay

Agree with this.  LJB definitely loves to talk down to people (just read his posts) - Talk about a superiority complex  (overcompensating for other shortcomings?)

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44 minutes ago, Dartsingle said:

Agree with this.  LJB definitely loves to talk down to people (just read his posts) - Talk about a superiority complex  (overcompensating for other shortcomings?)

aaaaaaaaaaaawe...

poor little fellas...

i feel for each and everyone of you...

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It's unfortunate a$$hats go unchecked and diminish otherwise good dialogue. Like that douche Billy Bob character from Tomb Stone. It keeps people away from the forum. I'm sure Billy Bob will respond as all narcissists do. :)

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13 hours ago, IronChef said:

I think a sport like swimming is based so much on physical readiness and preparation that the timing of the trials is set to maximize that for the Olympics. Australia is also doing their trials right now, so there must be something to that. The tapering and peaking cycle for swimming is such that this timing makes sense for them. The NCAA swimming championships is a full month after the conference championships, for example.

In wrestling, there is less of that because the physical demands of the sport are so different. I don’t think wrestling “has” to have trials when it does, and it does seem to be related to the timing of the Last Chance events. I do think a decent gap between the trials and Olympics is helpful for anyone who needs to recover from a minor injury suffered at the event, but four months seems more related to the Last chance than any physical prep needs.

As a former swimmer I can attest you have it pretty spot on. It is hard to hold a taper for an extended period, so you don't.

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11 hours ago, LJB said:

really...

i'm pulling for all of you...

just know you guys have someone in your corner just hoping you can make it through your day...

 

Narcissistic personality disorder — one of several types of personality disorders — is a mental condition in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for excessive attention and admiration, troubled relationships, and a lack of empathy for others.

 

People with this behavior were most likely treated as if they were superior or above others during childhood. These expectations can follow them as they become adults. They tend to brag and be elitist.

Those with grandiose narcissism are aggressive, dominant, and exaggerate their importance. They are very self-confident and aren’t sensitive.

 

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34 minutes ago, Dartsingle said:

 

Narcissistic personality disorder — one of several types of personality disorders — is a mental condition in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for excessive attention and admiration, troubled relationships, and a lack of empathy for others.

 

People with this behavior were most likely treated as if they were superior or above others during childhood. These expectations can follow them as they become adults. They tend to brag and be elitist.

Those with grandiose narcissism are aggressive, dominant, and exaggerate their importance. They are very self-confident and aren’t sensitive.

 

don't worry, son... i do not hold it against you... you are just another in a long line...

i pray to odin for all of you...

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i love each and every one of the peanut gallery diagnoses...

it makes me giggle every time...

don't any of you ever change...

you have a role to play and you boys follow the script to a t...

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