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Continuation

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Forgive me if I'm just flat out wrong, but there were several instances in Tokyo that I thought points for a takedown could have been awarded, but the referee only gave 1 for a step out point. Is there a hard and fast rule concerning this, or is this something that can vary slightly from ref to ref? Curious to see what others think about this. 

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3 hours ago, WrestleNJ said:

Forgive me if I'm just flat out wrong, but there were several instances in Tokyo that I thought points for a takedown could have been awarded, but the referee only gave 1 for a step out point. Is there a hard and fast rule concerning this, or is this something that can vary slightly from ref to ref? Curious to see what others think about this. 

Like passivity, it is enforced almost completely arbitrarily.  I watched the 97kg “italian” get thoroughly thrown under the bus with continuation call at the end of the match…throw started out of bounds deemed continuation…

Then a bunch of others got no credit on stuff that clearly started inbounds.  It has to be said, if you are an american in wrestling, you MUST dominate, otherwise  the chances of the cards falling in your favor are very low.  

Something just seems to always pop up at the last minute with a score, a ref, a penalty.  I would not assert that things are stacked in favor of one country in particular, but they are stacked towards some parts of the world on the eastern side of the atlantic.

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International refs did not seem to call continuation the same as we do in the US. In the US, as long as you start the move in bounds, you can finish it anywhere with in a four state region. Internationally it seemed they blew the action dead almost immediately.

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i watched several of the "bad calls" that have been complained about here and every one was exactly the right call as per the rules...

if the defensive wrestlers steps out before initiation it is a step out, period...

if the offensive wrestler starts the move in bounds then steps out continuation comes into effect...

now...

as to what people "see" as the that move starting seems to be entirely dependent on who they are cheering for and not any real objective criteria...

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20 hours ago, Drew87 said:

Like passivity, it is enforced almost completely arbitrarily.  I watched the 97kg “italian” get thoroughly thrown under the bus with continuation call at the end of the match…throw started out of bounds deemed continuation…

Then a bunch of others got no credit on stuff that clearly started inbounds.  It has to be said, if you are an american in wrestling, you MUST dominate, otherwise  the chances of the cards falling in your favor are very low.  

Something just seems to always pop up at the last minute with a score, a ref, a penalty.  I would not assert that things are stacked in favor of one country in particular, but they are stacked towards some parts of the world on the eastern side of the atlantic.

was this against the canadian? b/c i saw that... and started doing something else, i thought no way they allow that... 

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I think sometimes the call looks bad because the ref blew the whistle early (although that is in itself a bad call). After the whistle is blown there’s no continuation. Sometimes we can’t hear that from tv though. I believe that was case of Stevesons potential 4 pointer that was not given… ref just stopped it too soon.


If I need to know anything about wrestling or sports, I ask@ShakaAloha because he knows more than me.

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I think sometimes the call looks bad because the ref blew the whistle early (although that is in itself a bad call). After the whistle is blown there’s no continuation. Sometimes we can’t hear that from tv though. I believe that was case of Stevesons potential 4 pointer that was not given… ref just stopped it too soon.


If I need to know anything about wrestling or sports, I ask@ShakaAloha because he knows more than me.

This is the case. Initially, I was told it was blown dead once both feet were out. No continuation there but ultimately, it was a quick whistle.

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7 hours ago, JasonBryant said:


This is the case. Initially, I was told it was blown dead once both feet were out. No continuation there but ultimately, it was a quick whistle.

Flo claims he admitted that he blew the whistle too soon.

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4 hours ago, AHamilton said:

Flo claims he admitted that he blew the whistle too soon.

This is why I said "this is the case." 

It was blown early, but the first thought, as I was told, was they thought both feet were out. I didn't ask that specific match official, rather tried to get an understanding from another who was nearby. As I left Tokyo, I was told "it was blown too early," which was a mistake. 

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16 hours ago, JasonBryant said:

This is why I said "this is the case." 

It was blown early, but the first thought, as I was told, was they thought both feet were out. I didn't ask that specific match official, rather tried to get an understanding from another who was nearby. As I left Tokyo, I was told "it was blown too early," which was a mistake. 

I wasn't disputing what you said, just offering more specific info.

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On 8/9/2021 at 11:15 AM, LJB said:

i watched several of the "bad calls" that have been complained about here and every one was exactly the right call as per the rules...

if the defensive wrestlers steps out before initiation it is a step out, period...

if the offensive wrestler starts the move in bounds then steps out continuation comes into effect...

now...

as to what people "see" as the that move starting seems to be entirely dependent on who they are cheering for and not any real objective criteria...

I wouldn't say every one was exactly the right call as per the rules.

Here we see Gable initiating his own attack on Petriashvili before the georgian got his foot out, it should have been 4 for him.

Screenshot_2021-08-15-19-04-17-837_com.twitter.android.jpg

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10 hours ago, Coachp said:

Over all, I thought the officiating was some of the worst at the international level, I have seen in my lifetime. Not particularly bias, or anti USA, just overall bad.

I didn't see it that way, but if that is the case, I'd rather have bad officiating than officials with an agenda.

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On 8/15/2021 at 6:00 PM, Axe_Spartan said:

I wouldn't say every one was exactly the right call as per the rules.

Here we see Gable initiating his own attack on Petriashvili before the georgian got his foot out, it should have been 4 for him.

Screenshot_2021-08-15-19-04-17-837_com.twitter.android.jpg

Does his left foot being in the zone play a role?

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1 hour ago, Plasmodium said:

Does his left foot being in the zone play a role?

No, as per the rules:

"An action or a hold may not be commenced in a standing position in the passivity zone, except under the strict condition that the wrestlers engaged in the hold have only two feet in the zone (...)"

It's just one feet in the zone when Gable started his attack. Besides that, Pat Pollard, U.S. Wrestling Officials Association mat official, says the refs aren't counting how many feet are in the passivity zone anymore.

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On 8/15/2021 at 10:41 PM, Coachp said:

Over all, I thought the officiating was some of the worst at the international level, I have seen in my lifetime. Not particularly bias, or anti USA, just overall bad.

I hope you're only five. I kid, I kid. 

There were a couple iffy instances I noticed in the arena, but in large, there was nothing glaring that even gives me an inclination to call the officiating anywhere remotely close to the worst. Bad calls happen in every sport. I think we're so sensitive about being hosed (by actual bad officiating historically) that we will always jump to "horrible" when very few actually watch freestyle and Greco through the freestyle and Greco lens. We're watching with a college/folkstyle mindset and a casual understanding of the rulebook compared to those who actually live in that world 100% of the time. Even good officials make bad calls. A bad call at the NCAA gets the vitriol from the fans - some refs names become verbs as a result - but rarely is the word "corrupt" thrown at a bad call on the college mats. As soon as we go overseas, it's always corrupt, corrupt, corrupt. Let's not confuse corruption and blowing a call. 

 I've been closely covering/attending world-level events since 2003. Prior to the current UWW regime (Martinetti era), things were really unbalanced. What we have now is light years better than it used to be. 

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12 hours ago, JasonBryant said:

I hope you're only five. I kid, I kid. 

There were a couple iffy instances I noticed in the arena, but in large, there was nothing glaring that even gives me an inclination to call the officiating anywhere remotely close to the worst. Bad calls happen in every sport. I think we're so sensitive about being hosed (by actual bad officiating historically) that we will always jump to "horrible" when very few actually watch freestyle and Greco through the freestyle and Greco lens. We're watching with a college/folkstyle mindset and a casual understanding of the rulebook compared to those who actually live in that world 100% of the time. Even good officials make bad calls. A bad call at the NCAA gets the vitriol from the fans - some refs names become verbs as a result - but rarely is the word "corrupt" thrown at a bad call on the college mats. As soon as we go overseas, it's always corrupt, corrupt, corrupt. Let's not confuse corruption and blowing a call. 

 I've been closely covering/attending world-level events since 2003. Prior to the current UWW regime (Martinetti era), things were really unbalanced. What we have now is light years better than it used to be. 

Only since 2003? I have underwear older than that, and where did I use 'corrupt'?  In fact I said no particular bias.

For me, the word inept would fit better.

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11 hours ago, Coachp said:

Only since 2003? I have underwear older than that, and where did I use 'corrupt'?  In fact I said no particular bias.

For me, the word inept would fit better.

Might want to throw those underwear out then ... the corrupt line is for context, since many American issues with bad calls center around that word. 

If it's the worst you've seen in your lifetime, got any examples? A handful of bad calls over thousands made in the course of a week don't validate ineptness either. Individually perhaps. What makes it the worst in your lifetime? 

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