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Gable Steveson not going to Worlds?

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1 hour ago, bnwtwg said:

So you're saying that a reasonable viewer of ordinary intelligence would know that Pat Mineo is not a credible source of news and any reasonable viewer would arrive with an appropriate amount of skepticism about the statement he makes? That sounds about right.

Yeah pretty much.  I mean he "can" be a credible source of news, but not always.  Which I guess basically means he's not really a credible source of news.

 

1 hour ago, dman115 said:

Wow...nice try and backing out of what you posted...man...you guys should be in politics.  

Supposedly Lee is transferring to Penn St. so he can get his knee's fixed.  I am not claiming it as fact because I used the word "supposedly".  And I am not personally going to look anything up to see if it is true...because I used the word "supposedly". <eye roll>

No, I'm not.    The difference between your second paragraph and what I posted is I specifically said Mineo "claimed" that...I didn't say it myself like you're doing.   

And honestly I did try to look it up, and don't see anything.  That was a serious question (I guess mainly directed at Lurker), where can it be looked up in 5 minutes that college athletes are eligible to win money from the Living the Dream fund twice in one year?

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https://www.mmafighting.com/2021/8/24/22639132/henry-cejudo-gable-steveson-could-beat-jon-jones-and-francis-ngannou-in-the-next-couple-of-years

Interesting quotes here:

“I actually talked to Gable yesterday,” Cejudo told TMZ Sports. “I’m just giving him pointers, saying listen, you’ve got your manager, you’ve got your agent but you’ve got to strike while the iron is hot. You’ve got to push them, you’ve got to work, and whatever it is you decide to do, you’ve got to focus in on that and actually have a game plan because you cannot just try to dabble in all of them. A master of all trades is a master of none. Focus on one and then go to the others. I think he should do two years here, two years there, and then decide because he really does - he’s 20 years old and he has the ability to do all of them.”

“The UFC can’t afford him,” Cejudo said. “I’m sorry, they can afford him but they’re not gonna pay him, unfortunately. I do believe in the next couple of years he could beat a guy like Jon Jones or even Francis Ngannou. He’s the biggest threat because of his wrestling base which is extremely scary...

“He’s a real heavyweight. If you were to put him in there right now, Jon Jones would hurt him, Francis Ngannou would hurt him. I’ve been there before. When I first fought Demetrious Johnson, I had already had standup and I got knocked out at 2 minutes and 36 seconds. So you do have to respect the game.”

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Perhaps, Gable has no interest in continuing college or freestyle wrestling. But, if he did, could he compete in college wrestling AND MMA (or WWE) in the way John Elway played professional baseball (in the minors) and college football? And unlike Elway in his day, he could make money off his image and likeness as well.

Edited by NJDan

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21 hours ago, 1032004 said:

Curious where this can be "looked up" though?  Doesn't seem to be many details provided on this page -  https://donate.usawrestling.org/pages/living-the-dream-medal-fund

Doesn't seem to say anything about college.  For example, isn't the money placed in a trust or something for those in college?  

Obviously the 'five seconds' was exaggeration.  But....we know the living dream fund exists, we know he is eligible to receive while still in college.....so all you have to do is spend a couple minutes doing some keyword searches pertaining to not being able to receive twice in the same year.  When absolutely nothing comes up in the NCAA by-laws through a variety of keyword searches on the topic, you can deduce that it is in fact just not the case.

There is also a payout for medals that comes from the USOC ($37,500, or in that neighborhood, for gold).  I don't believe this USOC payment applies to world championships (haven't looked at that in a while).....maybe that is the confusion?

Edited by Lurker

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From the NCAA bylaws:

12.1.6 Elite-Level Participation. An individual (prospective student-athlete or enrolled student-athlete) may receive the following benefits at any time without jeopardizing their amateur status:

© Operation Gold Grant. Funds that are administered by the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee pursuant to its Operation Gold Program; (Adopted: 1/14/02, Revised: 2/4/10, 1/22/20 effective 8/1/20)
(d) Incentive Program for International Athletes. An international prospective student-athlete or international student-athlete may accept funds from their country's national Olympic governing body (equivalent to the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee) based on place finish in one event per year that is designated as the highest level of international competition for the year by the governing body.

Living the Dream falls under Operation Gold. There is a limit for international athletes to once per year. There is no limit listed for US athletes. It’s possible that the NCAA or Minnesota compliance are interpreting the rule a certain way, but I don’t count Mineo as an NCAA compliance expert.

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12 minutes ago, IronChef said:

From the NCAA bylaws:

12.1.6 Elite-Level Participation. An individual (prospective student-athlete or enrolled student-athlete) may receive the following benefits at any time without jeopardizing their amateur status:

© Operation Gold Grant. Funds that are administered by the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee pursuant to its Operation Gold Program; (Adopted: 1/14/02, Revised: 2/4/10, 1/22/20 effective 8/1/20)
(d) Incentive Program for International Athletes. An international prospective student-athlete or international student-athlete may accept funds from their country's national Olympic governing body (equivalent to the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee) based on place finish in one event per year that is designated as the highest level of international competition for the year by the governing body.

Living the Dream falls under Operation Gold. There is a limit for international athletes to once per year. There is no limit listed for US athletes. It’s possible that the NCAA or Minnesota compliance are interpreting the rule a certain way, but I don’t count Mineo as an NCAA compliance expert.

That's about as close as it gets but with it specifically designating "international student-athlete" I took it as not relative to Gable. 

I would like to see where Mineo got his info from (I know, good luck with that), because I have literally not seen anything that would lend toward him not being eligible for the payout if he were to compete.  I mean, it's all a moot point anyway since he is not, but I'm curious.

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Yes, Gable would fall under Part C which does not put an annual limit on the awards. Myles Amine, however, would only be able to accept one award per year as an international athlete (assuming San Marino even gives medal bonuses, since they never had a medalist before last month).

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9 hours ago, IronChef said:

From the NCAA bylaws:

12.1.6 Elite-Level Participation. An individual (prospective student-athlete or enrolled student-athlete) may receive the following benefits at any time without jeopardizing their amateur status:

© Operation Gold Grant. Funds that are administered by the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee pursuant to its Operation Gold Program; (Adopted: 1/14/02, Revised: 2/4/10, 1/22/20 effective 8/1/20)
(d) Incentive Program for International Athletes. An international prospective student-athlete or international student-athlete may accept funds from their country's national Olympic governing body (equivalent to the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee) based on place finish in one event per year that is designated as the highest level of international competition for the year by the governing body.

Living the Dream falls under Operation Gold. There is a limit for international athletes to once per year. There is no limit listed for US athletes. It’s possible that the NCAA or Minnesota compliance are interpreting the rule a certain way, but I don’t count Mineo as an NCAA compliance expert.

This limitation is almost certainly unenforceable under the Supreme Court's recent Alston decision.  This sort of compensation-restricting rule is, like the ban on NIL freedoms, a clear Sherman Act violation and I'd be shocked if the NCAA even attempted to enforce it.  Its moot since Gable isn't competing, but if this rule played a part in his decision, that's a real shame since it isn't worth the paper its printed on anymore.

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This limitation is almost certainly unenforceable under the Supreme Court's recent Alston decision.  This sort of compensation-restricting rule is, like the ban on NIL freedoms, a clear Sherman Act violation and I'd be shocked if the NCAA even attempted to enforce it.  Its moot since Gable isn't competing, but if this rule played a part in his decision, that's a real shame since it isn't worth the paper its printed on anymore.

I don’t want to go too far down a legal rabbit hole, but Alston was about non-cash compensation for educational purposes and has nothing to do with this.

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4 hours ago, BAC said:

This limitation is almost certainly unenforceable under the Supreme Court's recent Alston decision.  This sort of compensation-restricting rule is, like the ban on NIL freedoms, a clear Sherman Act violation and I'd be shocked if the NCAA even attempted to enforce it.  Its moot since Gable isn't competing, but if this rule played a part in his decision, that's a real shame since it isn't worth the paper its printed on anymore.

The guys on FRL are pretty convinced that Gable will wrestle for Minnesota this year.

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15 hours ago, BAC said:

This limitation is almost certainly unenforceable under the Supreme Court's recent Alston decision.  This sort of compensation-restricting rule is, like the ban on NIL freedoms, a clear Sherman Act violation and I'd be shocked if the NCAA even attempted to enforce it.  Its moot since Gable isn't competing, but if this rule played a part in his decision, that's a real shame since it isn't worth the paper its printed on anymore.

NCAA, will cease to exist in the not to far off future. Little bites off their jurisdiction now. It will snowball and they will either reform into something we’ve never seen before with no teeth or they will cease to exist all together. 

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Gable isn't an international athlete so he wouldn't fall under that rule. Operation Gold Grant is only providing money for the Olympics this year and Living the Dream doesn't fall under Operation Gold Grant because it is funded by outside donors and wrestling specific.
 

Living the Dream states that it incorporates money from the USOPC:
"It is important to note that contributions to this Fund will only go directly to pay the awards referred to above to each athlete that achieves their spot on a World or Olympic podium. The Fund will incorporate existing bonuses from USA wrestling and funds as made available by the USOPC."


This is what Operation Gold Grant is providing to USAW for medals and when they pay:
Operation Gold Awards are designed to reward athletes for top-place finishes in a sport’s most competitive senior international competition of the year (i.e. the Olympic and Paralympic Games in even-numbered years and typically world championship/world cup events in non-Games years). 
Olympic & Paralympic Games Operation Gold payments: 
Olympic Games: $37,500 (gold), $22,500 (silver), $15,000 (bronze)


https://donate.usawrestling.org/pages/living-the-dream-medal-fund
https://www.teamusa.org/Team-USA-Athlete-Services/Financial-Resources

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3 hours ago, nhs67 said:

I will give Chael this, as much of an earsore as he was he had a completely valid point in regards to scholarship(s).

If you accept a scholarship, you should honor your end of it.

If I accept a job at a company, I should never leave for a better opportunity.

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1 hour ago, bnwtwg said:

If I accept a job at a company, I should never leave for a better opportunity.

That isn't the same to me.

If Jennifer Aniston shows up at your door because you earned a big promotion at work, are you leaving your wife?

Now, if you sign a contract stating you will be working through a certain time frame or project at work, then you should honor that contract.  Unless something toxic or extraordinary comes up that prevents you from doing that job to the best of your ability, then you should honor that.

He isn't hurt.  Coaching staff hasn't changed.  Minnesota isn't requiring some absurd 5 covid tests per day to be on campus.  He should honor his commitment.

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14 hours ago, IronChef said:


I don’t want to go too far down a legal rabbit hole, but Alston was about non-cash compensation for educational purposes and has nothing to do with this.

Disagree.  I'm talking about the rationale of Alston, not the actual holding.  There is no chance this once-a-year limit on compensation for World/Olympic success survives the rationale of Alston.

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10 hours ago, nhs67 said:

That isn't the same to me.

If Jennifer Aniston shows up at your door because you earned a big promotion at work, are you leaving your wife?

Now, if you sign a contract stating you will be working through a certain time frame or project at work, then you should honor that contract.  Unless something toxic or extraordinary comes up that prevents you from doing that job to the best of your ability, then you should honor that.

He isn't hurt.  Coaching staff hasn't changed.  Minnesota isn't requiring some absurd 5 covid tests per day to be on campus.  He should honor his commitment.

That's apples to grapefruits, but if you are asking me gun to my head then the answer is hell no. Jennifer Aniston didn't give blood sweat and tears to give birth to our kid, push through every physically and mentally breaking moment that is required of the first few months alone of raising a kid with a g0ddammed smile on her face, and sacrifice literally everything in between. And my wife is Friesian so double win.

But you know who else didn't do everything and put someone else's best interests first? The University of Minnesota. Maybe Eggum and Co. did. But absolutely not UM.

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