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5 minutes ago, Fletcher said:

Been practicing law for 25 yrs. This is wrong. Also the law schools and med schools very much care where you did your undergrad.

Not law schools. It's virtually all LSAT and GPA. With the same LSAT, A 3.9 from Oklahoma State  beats a 3.8 from NU. Doesn't seem right, but it's the reality

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5 minutes ago, Fletcher said:

Been practicing law for 25 yrs. This is wrong. Also the law schools and med schools very much care where you did your undergrad.

Maybe in certain thin markets but generally your 2nd and 3rd employer care about what and how you did in your 1st and 2nd job respectively not where you completed your undergrad.  Likewise PhD program acceptance is about how you did in Master &/or standardized tests not your undergrad (unless of course straight undergrad to PhD).  Education is about what you learned and how you use it not just where you got it. 

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25 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Agreed. NCAA wrestling champion is basically irrelevant on a resume. 

Are you serious or being facetious?

While it's true you would not hire a surgeon for that reason. But for many many businesses-- anything involving sales, finance or anything where proven achievement or determination-- that line would be a huge benefit.

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8 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Not law schools. It's virtually all LSAT and GPA. With the same LSAT, A 3.9 from Oklahoma State  beats a 3.8 from NU. Doesn't seem right, but it's the reality

This is insane. I went to an Ivy League law school. We had ZERO from OSU or OU or any Big 12 school.  The vast majority went to top undergrad schools.  But this is not the issue. We were talking about whether elite athletic success is helpful on a resume. I believe it is. Employers who like sports and respect athletes-- which is many on them-- will like to surround themselves with good athletes. That's not to say they will hire an idiot who was a varsity athlete. But being a varsity athlete-- to say nothing of an NCAA champion-- is a big leg up.

Edited by NJDan

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Well, not sure when you went, but google it if you don't believe me. There is of course some correlation between high LSAT scores and elite undergrad schools. My son is at HLS now and he experienced this first hand - his top 3 undergrad meant very little - it is almost entirely a numbers game today.

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As usual, the truth lies somewhere in the middle...as many are saying a NU degree is unquestionably more valuable than a OSU degree. A "wrestling degree" from John Smith is also unquestionably more valuable than a wrestling degree from Matt Storniolo.

I think this shows CY fully (as fully as possible as a teenager, at least) committing to a career in wrestling instead of hedging his bets with a better degree from (all due respect) a lesser wrestling school. It's a gamble, if he doesn't break through and make it as a top senior level athlete then this was probably not a good move and he might wish he had the better degree. If he makes it, then it was a good move.

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26 minutes ago, NJDan said:

This is insane. I went to an Ivy League law school. We had ZERO from OSU or OU or any Big 12 school.  The vast majority went to top undergrad schools. 

Is Harvard a decent law school?  Best man in my wedding was from small town western Nebraska, Nebraska (Big 8) undergrad ag major aced LSAT, you'll find his photo same yearbook page as BO, grad photo with 4 friends included current Supreme, top national law firm.  There are plenty of Harvard, Columbia grads who didn't pan out just like plenty of small town folks who did well on ACT/SAT/LSAT/GMAT & did well from a lower ranked school.  But your going to hear more about the big school big city etc folks cause larger population and numbers.  I could give numerous specific examples. 

PS:  Harvard didn't make he what he is, he is the same guy shaped by his experiences, jobs, education, work ethic etc he had pre Harvard law.

Edited by ionel

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14 minutes ago, SignificantACCBias said:

As usual, the truth lies somewhere in the middle...as many are saying a NU degree is unquestionably more valuable than a OSU degree. 

T. Boone Pickens would disagree.  

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Here’s the question-knowing that there will only be more vaccine mandates on the way for everything from travel to restaurants, are these two coaches basically done with the sport? Who is going to hire somebody so stubborn who won’t make such an easy decision in the best interest of the team? If so, it’s a sad turn of events, all because of fear of a vaccine that has proven to be one of the most safe ever developed. 

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22 minutes ago, ionel said:

Is Harvard a decent law school?  Best man in my wedding was from small town western Nebraska, Nebraska (Big 8) undergrad ag major aced LSAT, you'll find his photo same yearbook page as BO, grad photo with 4 friends included current Supreme, top national law firm.  There are plenty of Harvard, Columbia grads who didn't pan out just like plenty of small town folks who did well on ACT/SAT/LSAT/GMAT & did well from a lower ranked school.  But your going to hear more about the big school big city etc folks cause larger population and numbers.  I could give numerous specific examples. 

PS:  Harvard didn't make he what he is, he is the same guy shaped by his experiences, jobs, education, work ethic etc he had pre Harvard law.

That you know one person from an ag major who went to Harvard Law shows nothing. Ask your friend. Or ask anyone in the world who knows anything about law schools or statistics.

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1 hour ago, Major Kong said:

Not law schools. It's virtually all LSAT and GPA. With the same LSAT, A 3.9 from Oklahoma State  beats a 3.8 from NU. Doesn't seem right, but it's the reality

This statement could not be more wrong with regard to top law schools.

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35 minutes ago, ionel said:

T. Boone Pickens would disagree.  

LOL. I know someone who survived a car crash because he didn't have a seatbelt on...therefore, no one should wear seatbelts.

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3 minutes ago, Fletcher said:

This statement could not be more wrong with regard to top law schools.

This is getting ridiculous. Guess what this list is:

Alabama State University
Amherst College
Arizona State University
Bais Medrash Ateres Shlomo
Barnard College
Boston College
Boston University
Bowdoin College
Brandeis University
Brigham Young University
Brock University
Brown University
California State University, Long Beach
Calvin College
Carleton College
Carnegie Mellon University
Chapman University
China Foreign Affairs University
Colgate University
College of William and Mary
Colorado College
Columbia University, Columbia College
Columbia University, School of General Studies
Cornell University
CUNY Baruch College
CUNY Hunter College
Curtis Institute of Music
Dalhousie University
Dartmouth College
Denison University
Dickinson College
Duke University
Eastman School of Music
Emory University
Ewha Womans University
Florida Atlantic University
Florida International University
Florida State University
Fordham University
Franklin & Marshall College
Fudan University
George Washington University
Georgetown University
Georgia State University
Gettysburg College
Hamilton College
Hamline University
Hampton University
Harvard College
Howard University
Instituto Tecnológico Autónomo de México
Johns Hopkins University
Louisiana State University
Loyola University Chicago
Marquette University
Massachusetts Institute of Technology
McMaster University
Mesivta Torah Vodaath Seminary
Middlebury College
Morehouse College
New York University Abu Dhabi
New York University College of Arts & Sciences
New York University Gallatin School of Individualized Study
New York University Stern School of Business
Northeastern University
Northwestern University
The Ohio State University
Ohio Wesleyan University
Oklahoma State University
Panjab University
Peking University
Pennsylvania State University
Pepperdine University
Pomona College
Princeton University
Recinto Universitario de Mayagüez
Rhodes College
Rice University
Rutgers University
Scripps College
Skidmore College
Spelman College
St. Mary’s College of Maryland
St. Olaf College
Stanford University
Sungkyunkwan University
SUNY Albany
SUNY Binghamton
SUNY Buffalo
SUNY Maritime College
Swarthmore College
Temple University
Texas A&M University
Torah Temimah Talmudical Seminary
Tsinghua University
Tufts University
Tulane University
Union College
United States Air Force Academy
United States Coast Guard Academy
United States Military Academy
United States Naval Academy
Universidad Autónoma de Madrid
The University of Alabama
University of Alberta
The University of Arizona
The University of British Columbia
University of Calgary
University of California, Berkeley
University of California, Davis
University of California, Irvine
University of California, Los Angeles
University of California, San Diego
University of Cambridge
The University of Chicago
University of Colorado Boulder
University of Delaware
University of Florida
University of Georgia
University of Houston
University of Idaho
University of Illinois Chicago
University of Illinois Urbana–Champaign
University of Indianapolis
University of Kansas
University of London
University of Louisville
University of Maryland
University of Massachusetts Amherst
University of Miami
University of Michigan
University of Minnesota
University of Mississippi
University of Nebraska–Lincoln
University of Nevada, Las Vegas
University of New Hampshire
The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
University of Notre Dame
The University of Oklahoma
University of Oregon
University of Ottawa
University of Pennsylvania
University of Pittsburgh
University of Redlands
University of Rhode Island
University of Rochester
University of South Carolina
University of Southern California
University of Sulaimani
The University of Texas at Austin
The University of Texas at Dallas
The University of Texas at San Antonio
University of Toronto
University of Vermont
The University of Virginia
University of Wisconsin–Madison
University of Wisconsin–Stevens Point
University of Wyoming
University of Washington
University of Waterloo
Vanderbilt University
Vassar College
Villanova University
Wake Forest University
Washington and Lee University
Washington University in St. Louis
Wesleyan University
Wheaton College
Williams College
Yale College
Yeshiva University

 

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1 minute ago, Major Kong said:

This is getting ridiculous. Guess what this list is:

Alabama State University
Amherst College
Arizona State University
Bais Medrash Ateres Shlomo
Barnard College
Boston College
Boston University
Bowdoin College
Brandeis University
Brigham Young University
Brock University
Brown University
California State University, Long Beach
Calvin College
Carleton College
Carnegie Mellon University
Chapman University
China Foreign Affairs University
Colgate University
College of William and Mary
Colorado College
Columbia University, Columbia College
Columbia University, School of General Studies
Cornell University
CUNY Baruch College
CUNY Hunter College
Curtis Institute of Music
Dalhousie University
Dartmouth College
Denison University
Dickinson College
Duke University
Eastman School of Music
Emory University
Ewha Womans University
Florida Atlantic University
Florida International University
Florida State University
Fordham University
Franklin & Marshall College
Fudan University
George Washington University
Georgetown University
Georgia State University
Gettysburg College
Hamilton College
Hamline University
Hampton University
Harvard College
Howard University
Instituto Tecnológico Autónomo de México
Johns Hopkins University
Louisiana State University
Loyola University Chicago
Marquette University
Massachusetts Institute of Technology
McMaster University
Mesivta Torah Vodaath Seminary
Middlebury College
Morehouse College
New York University Abu Dhabi
New York University College of Arts & Sciences
New York University Gallatin School of Individualized Study
New York University Stern School of Business
Northeastern University
Northwestern University
The Ohio State University
Ohio Wesleyan University
Oklahoma State University
Panjab University
Peking University
Pennsylvania State University
Pepperdine University
Pomona College
Princeton University
Recinto Universitario de Mayagüez
Rhodes College
Rice University
Rutgers University
Scripps College
Skidmore College
Spelman College
St. Mary’s College of Maryland
St. Olaf College
Stanford University
Sungkyunkwan University
SUNY Albany
SUNY Binghamton
SUNY Buffalo
SUNY Maritime College
Swarthmore College
Temple University
Texas A&M University
Torah Temimah Talmudical Seminary
Tsinghua University
Tufts University
Tulane University
Union College
United States Air Force Academy
United States Coast Guard Academy
United States Military Academy
United States Naval Academy
Universidad Autónoma de Madrid
The University of Alabama
University of Alberta
The University of Arizona
The University of British Columbia
University of Calgary
University of California, Berkeley
University of California, Davis
University of California, Irvine
University of California, Los Angeles
University of California, San Diego
University of Cambridge
The University of Chicago
University of Colorado Boulder
University of Delaware
University of Florida
University of Georgia
University of Houston
University of Idaho
University of Illinois Chicago
University of Illinois Urbana–Champaign
University of Indianapolis
University of Kansas
University of London
University of Louisville
University of Maryland
University of Massachusetts Amherst
University of Miami
University of Michigan
University of Minnesota
University of Mississippi
University of Nebraska–Lincoln
University of Nevada, Las Vegas
University of New Hampshire
The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
University of Notre Dame
The University of Oklahoma
University of Oregon
University of Ottawa
University of Pennsylvania
University of Pittsburgh
University of Redlands
University of Rhode Island
University of Rochester
University of South Carolina
University of Southern California
University of Sulaimani
The University of Texas at Austin
The University of Texas at Dallas
The University of Texas at San Antonio
University of Toronto
University of Vermont
The University of Virginia
University of Wisconsin–Madison
University of Wisconsin–Stevens Point
University of Wyoming
University of Washington
University of Waterloo
Vanderbilt University
Vassar College
Villanova University
Wake Forest University
Washington and Lee University
Washington University in St. Louis
Wesleyan University
Wheaton College
Williams College
Yale College
Yeshiva University

 

Schools you got rejected by?

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8 minutes ago, Fletcher said:

LOL. I know someone who survived a car crash because he didn't have a seatbelt on...therefore, no one should wear seatbelts.

ahh ... T Boone was just lucky to make a $B+ ... is this NU logic?  ;)

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4 minutes ago, ionel said:

ahh ... T Boone was just lucky to make a $B+ ... is this NU logic?  ;)

The NU logic is that making your point via outliers (the one billionaire from OSU; the one hick at HLS) is stupid.

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5 minutes ago, NJDan said:

It is certainly very wrong, but could be even more wrong.

Please, do some research. See what people who know (admissions people) say. At most, an elite undergrad is worth a .1 gpa bump or a couple LSAT points. A 3.9 from Rutgers is better than a 3.75 from U Chicago, all else being equal. There is no confusion about this among counselors, admission officers or the students applying.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Close, but I got into a couple! It's the undergrad schools of this years 1ls at Harvard Law.

Unless HLS told you everyone's LSAT and GPA, this doesn't prove your (erroneous) point. Quality of undergraduate school is a big factor in admission decisions.

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1 hour ago, Fletcher said:

Been practicing law for 25 yrs. This is wrong. Also the law schools and med schools very much care where you did your undergrad.

Been practicing medicine for 3 years. I interviewed for 10 locations before settling on my current one. My residency and, to a lesser extent, medical school got brought up at each interview. Where I went to undergrad? Only made it into the conversation once, and that was only because the department head had a daughter currently enrolled there.

Undergrad can certainly have an impact on one's chances into getting into a professional degree program. My point was that where you get your professional degree, your performance at that school, and the various research and internship opportunities you pursue while enrolled at the professional degree program weighs much more heavily during the job search than where you went for undergrad. This was mine and my cadre's experience when applying for residencies and, much later, for locums and permanent job placements. If it is vastly different in other fields, then I overspoke

Edited by Mr. Poopy butthole

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1 hour ago, NJDan said:

Are you serious or being facetious?

While it's true you would not hire a surgeon for that reason. But for many many businesses-- anything involving sales, finance or anything where proven achievement or determination-- that line would be a huge benefit.

I actually considered taking varsity wrestling off my resume out of concern employers would think I got in thru lower academic standards for athletes.

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4 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Please, do some research. See what people who know (admissions people) say. At most, an elite undergrad is worth a .1 gpa bump or a couple LSAT points. A 3.9 from Rutgers is better than a 3.75 from U Chicago, all else being equal. There is no confusion about this among counselors, admission officers or the students applying.

 

 

You say, "A 3.9 from Rutgers is better than a 3.75 from U Chicago, all else being equal." But the point you refuse to understand is that all else is not equal because the Rutgers and U Chicago are not equal. Rutgers may put a kid or two per year into Harvard Law. Chicago and other top schools will put many. That said, being an All American in any sport will, I think, be worth quite a bit.  Even tho grad schools have no sports teams, they do respect achievement outside the classroom.

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