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Yianni - 2021 worlds

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Seems like on the feet in neutral, Yianni's only setup or the only setup he uses is to shoot from space, and he often gets extended and countered as was mentioned above by other posters. Also seems like his opponents know it's coming. 

How about mixing in new setups or different types of takedowns? Throw-bys, slide-bys, something else. Look how easy Sadulaev (yes, I know I'm using the p4p king as example) took down Snyder with 1:25 left in 2nd period. Just a gorgeous underhook to throw-by and duck-under or whatever it was. Didn't have to touch legs. Spencer Lee was also hitting that same type of underhook throw-by in last season he competed. 

Just a keyboard scouting report here, but looks like Yianni is too one-dimensional on his feet and elite opponents know it. 

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31 minutes ago, 2td3nf said:

Seems like on the feet in neutral, Yianni's only setup or the only setup he uses is to shoot from space, and he often gets extended and countered as was mentioned above by other posters. Also seems like his opponents know it's coming. 

How about mixing in new setups or different types of takedowns? Throw-bys, slide-bys, something else. Look how easy Sadulaev (yes, I know I'm using the p4p king as example) took down Snyder with 1:25 left in 2nd period. Just a gorgeous underhook to throw-by and duck-under or whatever it was. Didn't have to touch legs. Spencer Lee was also hitting that same type of underhook throw-by in last season he competed. 

Just a keyboard scouting report here, but looks like Yianni is too one-dimensional on his feet and elite opponents know it. 

Also has elbow control to leg attacks... Zain gameplanned for it in their court appointed 4th match, and it was never an issue again.

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2 hours ago, 2td3nf said:

Seems like on the feet in neutral, Yianni's only setup or the only setup he uses is to shoot from space, and he often gets extended and countered as was mentioned above by other posters. Also seems like his opponents know it's coming. 

How about mixing in new setups or different types of takedowns? Throw-bys, slide-bys, something else. Look how easy Sadulaev (yes, I know I'm using the p4p king as example) took down Snyder with 1:25 left in 2nd period. Just a gorgeous underhook to throw-by and duck-under or whatever it was. Didn't have to touch legs. Spencer Lee was also hitting that same type of underhook throw-by in last season he competed. 

Just a keyboard scouting report here, but looks like Yianni is too one-dimensional on his feet and elite opponents know it. 

In all fairness Tevanyan has stubs for legs and he doesn’t do squat. I watched his match after Yianni and he literally did nothing. Not one attack. He defends and counters well however. Helps when your legs are 24”. 

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Yianni is way better than most of you are saying. He's not a medalist level guy, obviously, but he is absolutely a threat at every tournament he enters, even in a fully attended 65 kg. He wrestled a very poor match strategically against a surprisingly good defensive opponent: his opponent just stood there waiting to counter and Yianni kept taking the bait repeatedly with the same strategy of attempting to use motion to set up shots from space.

Yianni does have good setups, they just didn't work against a guy with lead hips who looked 4 inches shorter and just stood there. Yianni's main setups are misdirection from space and excellent reshots. Buth when a guy doesn't engage, neither works that well.

Yianni still has a lot of upside. Yes, he has wrestled the vast majority of his life and has focused on freestyle for a while, but he is also transitioning from a somewhat plodding stance to much more motion, from highly defensive offense to offense he initiates, and from countering deep shots to downblocking them. It took a freak like Kyle Dake a few years to adjust to a different style, and even Dake is still figuring out how to improve it. Give Yianni more time.

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1 hour ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Yianni is way better than most of you are saying. He's not a medalist level guy, obviously, but he is absolutely a threat at every tournament he enters, even in a fully attended 65 kg. He wrestled a very poor match strategically against a surprisingly good defensive opponent: his opponent just stood there waiting to counter and Yianni kept taking the bait repeatedly with the same strategy of attempting to use motion to set up shots from space.

Yianni does have good setups, they just didn't work against a guy with lead hips who looked 4 inches shorter and just stood there. Yianni's main setups are misdirection from space and excellent reshots. Buth when a guy doesn't engage, neither works that well.

Yianni still has a lot of upside. Yes, he has wrestled the vast majority of his life and has focused on freestyle for a while, but he is also transitioning from a somewhat plodding stance to much more motion, from highly defensive offense to offense he initiates, and from countering deep shots to downblocking them. It took a freak like Kyle Dake a few years to adjust to a different style, and even Dake is still figuring out how to improve it. Give Yianni more time.

Agree with all of this.  Yianni is young, and closer to the top guys than a lot of people on here think.  It will take a couple of years, but I'm confident that he will put it all together.

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Agree with all of this.  Yianni is young, and closer to the top guys than a lot of people on here think.  It will take a couple of years, but I'm confident that he will put it all together.
Close to the top guys = yes
Not a top guy = yes

Otoguro 22
Tevanyan 21
Shakiev 22
Ochir 23
Yaz 20
(I can't think of anyone else I want to Google)

Are all his age. So I don't like the age being a crutch.
Aliyev, Muz, Rashidov, Bajrang, Tobier , are all approaching the end of their careers but the talent his age is a substantial hurdle .

I hope we all stay delusional, but ABSOLUTELY NOTHING based on results or similarly aged wrestlers suggests if we give him 3 years he will all of a sudden be better than these guys?
I'm guessing y'all assume he's such a mind that he will get better at freestyle by wrestling a couple more college seasons, while those guys who are currently better, wrestle Freestyle year-round so they'll stop improving all together?

Seems plausible

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On 10/7/2021 at 9:45 AM, spladle08 said:

I mean he is the same age as the guy who won it.

And older than the guy who beat him

 

Yeah so what?  Maybe Yianni will not move forward or maybe he has a lot of growth to gain and will surpass the world.   Maybe he, his own person, not others persons, but just him, needs more time.  He is young afterall.  We have a number of examples of late bloomers. 

mspart

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Yeah so what?  Maybe Yianni will not move forward or maybe he has a lot of growth to gain and will surpass the world.   Maybe he, his own person, not others persons, but just him, needs more time.  He is young afterall.  We have a number of examples of late bloomers. 
mspart
Yeah you just said, he's still in college.
Like "give the guy a chance to get older" .
Was just saying the guys who are winning tournaments (Olympics and Worlds) are the same age.... That's all

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I'm just saying that perhaps Yianni needs a little more time to percolate....  That's all. 
mspart
Oh clearly he does.
And I really believe he is a coinflip with most of the top guys. If he won a world title in the next 8 years or never made the finals, I wouldn't be surprised.
:) I hope he can become the most consistently successful 65kg guy we've ever had, but the world is big

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Yianni is an excellent wrestler and I agree with spladle that he is a coin flip with most of the world's top guys. I believe he can scramble and score on anyone at 65kg.

My point was that those dive shots from space was the reason he lost in Oslo. And I've seen Yianni dive shoot in other recent matches as well. I feel if he can tidy up his neutral position on his feet he will be right there and can win a medal next year, of course if he makes the team. And while I'm at it, I'll pick Yianni to make our team and medal next year.  

Interesting against Bajrang, Yianni didn't shoot from space at all and scored nice takedowns off of tie-ups. Here it is:

 

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On 10/7/2021 at 6:09 PM, spladle08 said:

Close to the top guys = yes
Not a top guy = yes

Otoguro 22
Tevanyan 21
Shakiev 22
Ochir 23
Yaz 20
(I can't think of anyone else I want to Google)

Are all his age. So I don't like the age being a crutch.
Aliyev, Muz, Rashidov, Bajrang, Tobier , are all approaching the end of their careers but the talent his age is a substantial hurdle .

I hope we all stay delusional, but ABSOLUTELY NOTHING based on results or similarly aged wrestlers suggests if we give him 3 years he will all of a sudden be better than these guys?
I'm guessing y'all assume he's such a mind that he will get better at freestyle by wrestling a couple more college seasons, while those guys who are currently better, wrestle Freestyle year-round so they'll stop improving all together?

Seems plausible

Yianni's focus is divided between his college wrestling with Cornell and his freestyle aspirations for Spartan/USA Wrestling.  At this point, I anticipate that he finishes out his last two years of collegiate eligibility with Cornell and wins two more NCAA titles and continues working on freestyle in the offseason.  The jump will happen when he turns his focus solely to freestyle, which will be just in time for Paris 2024.   I am confident that this happens as he has a great coach and training partners in Coach Grey, Kyle Dake, and Vito Arujau.  

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Yianni's focus is divided between his college wrestling with Cornell and his freestyle aspirations for Spartan/USA Wrestling.  At this point, I anticipate that he finishes out his last two years of collegiate eligibility with Cornell and wins two more NCAA titles and continues working on freestyle in the offseason.  The jump will happen when he turns his focus solely to freestyle, which will be just in time for Paris 2024.   I am confident that this happens as he has a great coach and training partners in Coach Grey, Kyle Dake, and Vito Arujau.  
I hope you're right, cause I am all about USA wrestling.
However, I mean his last folkstyle match was when March 2019? Over 2 years of strict freestyle focus yielded a win over Realbuto,
I'm just not convinced finishing out folkstyle in March 2023 then focusing strictly on Freestyle until summer 2024 will provide some wild jump. Maybe he will beat Realbuto faster ?

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20 hours ago, 2td3nf said:

Yianni is an excellent wrestler and I agree with spladle that he is a coin flip with most of the world's top guys. I believe he can scramble and score on anyone at 65kg.

My point was that those dive shots from space was the reason he lost in Oslo. And I've seen Yianni dive shoot in other recent matches as well. I feel if he can tidy up his neutral position on his feet he will be right there and can win a medal next year, of course if he makes the team. And while I'm at it, I'll pick Yianni to make our team and medal next year.  

Interesting against Bajrang, Yianni didn't shoot from space at all and scored nice takedowns off of tie-ups. Here it is:

 

Most of his set ups from ties are “slicker” type elbow and drag stuff. He doesn’t really have a under-hook, club or power set up. From a pure offense standpoint. He either dives from space or relies on slick stuff in close

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15 minutes ago, spladle08 said:

I hope you're right, cause I am all about USA wrestling.
However, I mean his last folkstyle match was when March 2019? Over 2 years of strict freestyle focus yielded a win over Realbuto,
I'm just not convinced finishing out folkstyle in March 2023 then focusing strictly on Freestyle until summer 2024 will provide some wild jump. Maybe he will beat Realbuto faster ?

LOL, you're funny.  Yianni was on the stacked side of the bracket with Tevanyan, Ochir, and Shakiev.  He is competitive with all the guys on the other half of the bracket.  Undersized Sebass Rivera was on that side and he came in 7th.  I think Yianni techs him, beats Poland and Osmonov.  Yianni would have won bronze if he were randomly drawn into that half of the bracket.

16 minutes ago, spladle08 said:

And I have to me mention
All those guys currently at the weight not splitting time between folkstyle and freestyle, I'm not sure they're sitting around getting worse as they develop into their mid 20s

I would argue that there is less room for Otoguro, Shakiev, Yaz, Tevanyan, Ochir, etc. to improve.  They are already the top 5 or so guys in the world and train freestyle only their entire lives.  Only Shakiev has better training partners than Kyle Dake and Vito Arujau.

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Most of his set ups from ties are “slicker” type elbow and drag stuff. He doesn’t really have a under-hook, club or power set up. From a pure offense standpoint. He either dives from space or relies on slick stuff in close
The David Taylor shot.
Lol people disagree with me there but part of what makes Taylor so successful is as those big guys get a little tired he just has to get to a leg.
Dive in/force wrestling positions/it's over .

In folkstyle Yainni can do this all day.
At world level freestyle in the deepest, most terrifying weight, against explosive muscular little humans, forget about it.

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I would argue that there is less room for Otoguro, Shakiev, Yaz, Tevanyan, Ochir, etc. to improve.  They are already the top 5 or so guys in the world and train freestyle only their entire lives.  Only Shakiev has better training partners than Kyle Dake and Vito Arujau.
I agree with your initial posts. Had Yainni had a fortunate draw in a depleted field at worlds he could have ended up with a bronze.

But since he didn't, he lost to a guy who didn't medal.

I don't see how this implies he should be a medal threat in a full weight in 2024 when the best guys participate?

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1 hour ago, spladle08 said:

The David Taylor shot.
Lol people disagree with me there but part of what makes Taylor so successful is as those big guys get a little tired he just has to get to a leg.
Dive in/force wrestling positions/it's over .

In folkstyle Yainni can do this all day.
At world level freestyle in the deepest, most terrifying weight, against explosive muscular little humans, forget about it.

Agreed. Though Taylor has vastly improved in his hand fighting and snaps 

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Agreed. Though Taylor has vastly improved in his hand fighting and snaps 
I hate his schtick. Just a sore loser (seemingly jerk of a human) .
However .
Always cheer for him and really respect his approach to wrestling. Always improving, always learning.
Even though these boards have expressed they hate learning and once you're an adult you should be at your ceiling.

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3 hours ago, spladle08 said:

I hate his schtick. Just a sore loser (seemingly jerk of a human) .
However .
Always cheer for him and really respect his approach to wrestling. Always improving, always learning.
Even though these boards have expressed they hate learning and once you're an adult you should be at your ceiling.

Oh he’s very much an arrogant borderline entitled jerk. But he is a winner

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On 10/9/2021 at 2:44 PM, spladle08 said:

I hope you're right, cause I am all about USA wrestling.
However, I mean his last folkstyle match was when March 2019? Over 2 years of strict freestyle focus yielded a win over Realbuto,
I'm just not convinced finishing out folkstyle in March 2023 then focusing strictly on Freestyle until summer 2024 will provide some wild jump. Maybe he will beat Realbuto faster ?

I understand your skepticism, but matchups are a real thing and this was a blatantly bad one for yianni. I like his chances against anyone other than otoguro better.

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1 minute ago, Cradle1 said:

I understand your skepticism, but matchups are a real thing and this was a blatantly bad one for yianni. I like his chances against anyone other than otoguro better.

I mean, Yes he has "Better" match-ups but lets say he was 35% in that match. 
Bajrang, Aliyev, Rashidov, Oto, Muz, Ochir,  etc.... you're not giving him better than lets say 60/40 in his favor and there are several 2nd tier guys, I didnt mention, like Tev and Tobier.... 

I don't know how anyone can expect him to win 3-4 coinflips in a row, it's just hard. 
I fully believe he is capable of pulling "An Upset", but when you gotta upset, upset, upset, to place..... reality kind of sets in. 
 

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1 minute ago, spladle08 said:

I mean, Yes he has "Better" match-ups but lets say he was 35% in that match. 
Bajrang, Aliyev, Rashidov, Oto, Muz, Ochir,  etc.... you're not giving him better than lets say 60/40 in his favor and there are several 2nd tier guys, I didnt mention, like Tev and Tobier.... 

I don't know how anyone can expect him to win 3-4 coinflips in a row, it's just hard. 
I fully believe he is capable of pulling "An Upset", but when you gotta upset, upset, upset, to place..... reality kind of sets in. 
 

Totally agree.  The reality here- there are almost as many world class wrestlers at 65 kg than there are at the other five Olympic weights combined.  At 86 and 97 kg you basically have to worry about the Russian and the Iranian these days.  At 65 kg, virtually every wrestler in the 32 man bracket is a threat.  Typically Russia has a half dozen guys that can beat our best guy on any given day.  There's a reason we haven't medaled here in 15 years, despite sending a variety of guys that were considered legends.  What's ironic is that it's arguably the least heralded guys we sent (Zadick and Molinaro) that did the best.  Go figure. 

 

 

 

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