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My 2 Cents on Yazdani Vs Taylor

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1 minute ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

I don't follow.  The original poster framed Yazdani as "just a better handfighter" than Taylor, and that Taylor was the "better wrestler."  

Well, this isn't a newsflash or anything, but handfighting is a huge component of wrestling.  

If you're looking for support behind the "DT isn't way better than Yaz" argument, just re-watch their match in Oslo.  

I don't disagree with any of this post but that's not what you said/implied previously. You only mentioned hand fighting which was just a statement that in and of itself doesn't back up your argument. It would have been better to have included the watch the Oslo match statement the first time.

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16 hours ago, de4856 said:

So speaking of Iranians and under hooks, I watched a match in the 2016 Olympics between Novachkov and the Iranian Nassiri. And throughout this match the Iranian dug the undertook and Boris just took a step to the side and completely nullified the Iranian’s underhook. And in doing so, the Iranian was left walking into numerous leg attacks by Novachkov. I always thought that this match should be required watching for USA wrestlers and coaches. ( I have no idea if it has been or hasn’t been ), but it was fascinating to watch. 

Hes is actually retreating to make space to slide over the underhook.  It started costing him as the Iranian figured out what he was doing and how to time it.  Novachov did a good job at realizing that and switching his tactics to controlling the fingers.  Nice pull that was an interesting match from a tactics point of view

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16 hours ago, de4856 said:

So speaking of Iranians and under hooks, I watched a match in the 2016 Olympics between Novachkov and the Iranian Nassiri. And throughout this match the Iranian dug the undertook and Boris just took a step to the side and completely nullified the Iranian’s underhook. And in doing so, the Iranian was left walking into numerous leg attacks by Novachkov. I always thought that this match should be required watching for USA wrestlers and coaches. ( I have no idea if it has been or hasn’t been ), but it was fascinating to watch. 

Hes is actually retreating to make space to slide over the underhook.  It started costing him as the Iranian figured out what he was doing and how to time it.  Novachov did a good job at realizing that and switching his tactics to controlling the fingers.  Nice pull that was an interesting match from a tactics point of view

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1 hour ago, gimpeltf said:

I don't disagree with any of this post but that's not what you said/implied previously. You only mentioned hand fighting which was just a statement that in and of itself doesn't back up your argument. It would have been better to have included the watch the Oslo match statement the first time.

I asked a rhetorical question regarding handfighting to point out that the original poster's statements were inconsistent.  I did not once say that wrestling is only handfighting.  

I thought that was pretty easy to understand, sorry for the confusion.  

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On 10/19/2021 at 12:30 PM, Le duke said:

Taylor’s wife had a kid less than two weeks before Worlds. He also had to resume the business(es) he had been neglecting since before the Olympics, attend other events such as Bo Nickal’s MMA training center grand opening, etc.

I think he’ll be alright for round 5.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah.  Attending that grand opening prevented him from clearing underhooks!  That was a crucial couple of hours !  Let's not forget the empty calories he consumed from the congratulatory cake that the M2 parents surprised him with!

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Hey Plasmodium - That was a great match - thanks for posting.  The misdirection shot Novachkov took at 4:40 was a thing of beaty - it faked Nasiri out of his socks.  Then he did the same shot 2 more times in the last 40 seconds of the match.  Great stuff.

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1 hour ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

I asked a rhetorical question regarding handfighting to point out that the original poster's statements were inconsistent.  I did not once say that wrestling is only handfighting.  

I thought that was pretty easy to understand, sorry for the confusion.  

don't you worry...

what you were saying was simple enough for a child to understand...

but...

**shrugs**

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2 hours ago, lu1979 said:

Hey Plasmodium - That was a great match - thanks for posting.  The misdirection shot Novachkov took at 4:40 was a thing of beaty - it faked Nasiri out of his socks.  Then he did the same shot 2 more times in the last 40 seconds of the match.  Great stuff.

:) I really enjoyed watching Novachkov wrestle.  Very innovative and unpredictable.

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6 hours ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

I asked a rhetorical question regarding handfighting to point out that the original poster's statements were inconsistent.  I did not once say that wrestling is only handfighting.  

I thought that was pretty easy to understand, sorry for the confusion.  

My point was Yazdani is a better hand fighter and underhooker (part of handfighting) and better pusher but imo Taylor is better in all other aspects of wrestling. Now I understand that sometimes that’s all that’s needed and obviously was in a Oslo, but to say he will never beat him again is laughable. Again some great Iranian fans on this board just two months earlier thought there was no way Yazdani could beat Taylor. There’s a reason that statement was made. 

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9 minutes ago, AnklePicker said:

 There’s a reason that statement was made. 

Whatever the reason for the statement, they were proven to be wrong, so that will add very little weight to the case you are making...

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Two things… There is always bound to be a let down after achieving a lifelong dream in this case winning an Olympic gold medal.

Second thing, is it just me or have Taylor‘s leg attacks become more infrequent since he tore his ACL? I think that people who have never had a major knee injury probably don’t fully appreciate that you are never the same, and he won in spite of this. I think 2017-2018 was likely peak DT…. Especially given his age, but I sure hope I’m wrong.

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12 hours ago, AnklePicker said:

My point was Yazdani is a better hand fighter and underhooker (part of handfighting) and better pusher but imo Taylor is better in all other aspects of wrestling. Now I understand that sometimes that’s all that’s needed and obviously was in a Oslo, but to say he will never beat him again is laughable. Again some great Iranian fans on this board just two months earlier thought there was no way Yazdani could beat Taylor. There’s a reason that statement was made. 

I don't think it's laughable.  Of course Taylor can still beat him.  But he's not the better wrestler at this moment, and with each passing year it's a little less likely, IMO.  

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Taylor has a more durable technique-centric style, so I can see him being similarly effective through the next Olympic cycle … but a stronger, more athletic opponent with similar skill is his kryptonite. See Dake, JB. Yazdani has a more physical style, which is less durable, but he is so damn young that I see him having that significant edge over DT for the rest of their rivalry. 
 

I feel future outcomes will depend on Yazdani’s mindset. If he wrestles like he got the monkey off his back and can now wrestle freely, with his highly effective constant pressure, I favor Yaz every time. If he is relieved to have gotten one over DT and wrestles not to lose so he can even the series, the pressuring style disappears, and I like DT in those matchups. Can’t wait to see which approach he takes. 

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15 minutes ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Taylor has a more durable technique-centric style, so I can see him being similarly effective through the next Olympic cycle … but a stronger, more athletic opponent with similar skill is his kryptonite. See Dake, JB. Yazdani has a more physical style, which is less durable, but he is so damn young that I see him having that significant edge over DT for the rest of their rivalry. 
 

I feel future outcomes will depend on Yazdani’s mindset. If he wrestles like he got the monkey off his back and can now wrestle freely, with his highly effective constant pressure, I favor Yaz every time. If he is relieved to have gotten one over DT and wrestles not to lose so he can even the series, the pressuring style disappears, and I like DT in those matchups. Can’t wait to see which approach he takes. 

Just to counter your point a bit, Iranian wrestlers seem to reach their peak a lot younger and are on the downward slope by 25 if not sooner.  

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23 minutes ago, Cradle1 said:

Just to counter your point a bit, Iranian wrestlers seem to reach their peak a lot younger and are on the downward slope by 25 if not sooner.  

But when do US wrestles hit a peak? They’re both at the same point of their respective age continuum (if what you say is true) if you want to adjust for country of origin. I’m not a fan of that theory but I acknowledge the point.

Edited by wrestlingnerd

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1 hour ago, wrestlingnerd said:

Taylor has a more durable technique-centric style, so I can see him being similarly effective through the next Olympic cycle … but a stronger, more athletic opponent with similar skill is his kryptonite. See Dake, JB. Yazdani has a more physical style, which is less durable, but he is so damn young that I see him having that significant edge over DT for the rest of their rivalry. 
 

I feel future outcomes will depend on Yazdani’s mindset. If he wrestles like he got the monkey off his back and can now wrestle freely, with his highly effective constant pressure, I favor Yaz every time. If he is relieved to have gotten one over DT and wrestles not to lose so he can even the series, the pressuring style disappears, and I like DT in those matchups. Can’t wait to see which approach he takes. 

Having spoken to Yaz after his win, I can tell you very much that it is now the former. It was a massive relief and weight off his shoulders, maybe in years to come he will value the world title more, but for now he is just happiest that he has proven that Taylor isn't the big boogeyman for him. But I still think it is a close one. If this had gone 4-0 I think Yaz would have been crushed emotionally.

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Lots of good points on both sides. (Yeah! A nice wrestling thread.)

Hopefully we get Yazdani vs Taylor in Arlington this February, and if we do I'm predicting Taylor to really open it up and make Yazdani chain wrestle for 6 minutes, or less. Looking for DT to win this one handily and maybe even another pin.  

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Hopefully, DT puts together some real shots in the first 30 seconds or so of their next match. 

'I think he has to force Yazdani into scrambles and exchanges..  If he scores on him early, Yazdani will have to open up and shoot rather than just go for underhooks and pressure pushouts.

That will play into Taylor's wheelhouse.

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10 hours ago, dmm53 said:

Hopefully, DT puts together some real shots in the first 30 seconds or so of their next match. 

'I think he has to force Yazdani into scrambles and exchanges..  If he scores on him early, Yazdani will have to open up and shoot rather than just go for underhooks and pressure pushouts.

That will play into Taylor's wheelhouse.

Maybe?  Yazdani doesn't just look for push outs with the underhook.  It's where he generates most of his offense, and also how he took down Taylor.  It's not like he's going to abandon that and start shooting from space if Taylor has a 2-0 lead.  

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11 hours ago, dmm53 said:

Hopefully, DT puts together some real shots in the first 30 seconds or so of their next match. 

'I think he has to force Yazdani into scrambles and exchanges..  If he scores on him early, Yazdani will have to open up and shoot rather than just go for underhooks and pressure pushouts.

That will play into Taylor's wheelhouse.

In all 4 of their matches, has DT ever been the first to score? Yazdani is very strong and can usually dominate the first period. Oslo aside, DT tries to shoot but Yaz usually does a good job of shutting his attacks down (Tokyo), until he gets tired at least. 

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