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dclark145

Walking on in Division 1

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All the cheerleaders on this board are ignoring the very real possibility that he could hate it. College wrestling is not like high school. Then he's left with the choice of: (i) sticking with something he hates for 4 years, or (ii) being a quitter.

 

I think the best advice was summarized in some of the above posts - if you truly love wrestling, stick with it. If you're doing it to scratch a proverbial itch, because you're unhappy with your HS career, or to say you were a D-I wrestler, don't.

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All the cheerleaders on this board are ignoring the very real possibility that he could hate it. College wrestling is not like high school. Then he's left with the choice of: (i) sticking with something he hates for 4 years, or (ii) being a quitter.

 

I think the best advice was summarized in some of the above posts - if you truly love wrestling, stick with it. If you're doing it to scratch a proverbial itch, because you're unhappy with your HS career, or to say you were a D-I wrestler, don't.

 

"cheerleaders"??? c'mon fletch, you would look better in a skirt than i would.

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This thread has made its way to some of the Penn State wrestling message boards. On BWI's Penn State wrestling board, a former PSU walk-on made a post, and asked if somebody could post it on this forum. dclark145, this is a message to you from a former PSU walk-on.

 

"If someone who has access to that site can post this for me that would be great. Don't feel like signing up for another site. I rarely ever post anything to any site, but this one hit home for me. Hope you all enjoy reading this story and get a little feel as to what it is like walking on to PSU's wrestling team.

 

I hope the kid goes to PSU for the educational experience alone. If he never wrestles again, he will come away with a great education and set himself up for a good job opportunity. Unless he's planning on going to the Olympics, he should look at the education and take the full academic scholarship. I think everyone who is a PSU grad on this board can agree with that.

 

As far as walking on, I think I can probably give the best advice of anyone, especially at PSU. Granted back in the early 2000's, when I walked-on, it was a different time as opposed to the dominance that PSU has shown lately. However I think my story will resonate with the kid.

 

I am a former walk-on at PSU, who was told by Coach Sunderland as a freshman that I would not make the team, despite being a 2x Prep All American and ranked the #1 Prep wrestler in the country my senior year before being upset at Prep Nationals. I never won Prep states (3x runner-up). Never won Prep Nationals. I am also from Southeastern PA, and now give back to the sport as one of the two coaches of an extremeley successful youth club and high school. I had 1 scholarship offer as a senior and that was to SUNY Binghamton, which I turned down for the education of PSU. Here's my story...

 

I decided to walk-on at PSU and was more than holding my own. As a walk-on, you start much later than the regular team, so the odds are even more stacked against you. You have to train on your own, while the kids on scholarship are going thru the designated team runs and practices. A week before wrestle-offs (already practicing for a month) the remaining 4 walk-ons, myself included, were finally given PSU wrestling gear (t-shirts and shorts) so that we felt part of the team. On the way up to get the gear, Coach Sunderland told us that we wouldn't make the team because he had a 40 roster limit. I was crushed because I knew I belonged and had proven myself in the practice room. I believed him like a fool, and another walk-on and I quit two days later. The other two walk-ons ignored Coach Sunderland's comment, stuck with it, and made the team. I was shocked and angry. I was lied to and deceived and there was nothing that I could do about it. Or so I thought...

 

Two months later when I got back from Christmas break to my freshman dorm in East Halls, I had an email from Coach Sunderland telling me that I had an open offer to come back and try out if I wanted to. I was shocked, especially since it was sent in the middle of the season. After thinking about it for a month, I decided I had to take the opportunity to prove that I belonged no matter what a coach or others thought. I got myself back into shape, since I had been "fratastic" for a couple months after I quit, and was back on campus in late August running with the team. A few weeks later, I am in a meeting with all new athletes from every sport, being told that I couldn't take steroids or hire an agent. I remember leaving that meeting and calling my dad saying, "I think I made the team?". A few months later, I won wrestle-offs and was the starting 174lber for the entire season. Although I never placed 1st at a collegiate tournament or even won a Big Ten Tournament match for that fact (Drawing UFC fighter Rashad Evans from Mich St. first round and then the #3 seed from Minn being upset didn't help.). I did what people told me wasn't possible.

 

I saw posters on that board saying that they weren't trying to be mean but that he shouldn't even try. If I were him, I would use that as fuel to the fire. If this kid wants to walk-on and wrestle for PSU, then he should go get his dream. It will not be easy. You will have to work your tail off, but it can be done. I am one of only a handful of people ever at PSU to walk-on and start their first year making the team. I am proof it can be done. WE ARE...PENN STATE!!! "

 

 

Maybe if you weren't a National Prep runner-up I'd say your story was inspirational. Don't you people realize were talking about a kid that failed to qualify for a state tournament. I've read all your great "walk-on" stories, but those "walk-ons" were WAY more accomplished than this guy. You are all setting him up for failure and the beatings of a lifetime. I'm surprised no one has told the kid to go watch Rudy for some inspiration.

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What many of you may not understand is, this kid wrestled in Philadelphia. Before this year, Philly had never had a state champ - Joey Galasso from Father Judge won states this year as a Jr and he is a big-time stud!

 

But getting back to our boy of the thread: it is totally possible that he has only scratched the surface of his talent. I'm not trying to demean Philly wrestling, but the Public League teams have practically no experience and the coaches aren't very well known either.

 

Now the Philly Catholic league is a different story. Until recently, LaSalle College high school had Vic Stanley as its coach. Vic had won the state team championship with Council Rock in the seventies and has consistently put out great wrestlers. When LaSalle entered the PIAA they hit the ground running. They had several state place winners their first year.

 

I guess what I'm saying is: our boy of the thread may have a heap of untapped potential just waiting to be cultivated by a great coaching staff. That is, if the staff takes the time to cultivate it.

 

Your average PIAA District runner up is a pretty good wrestler, but will not necessarily improve exponentially at college. But the District 12 (Philly) runner up could be good or mediocre. But he may also have a heck of an upside as well.

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Open the link-->Vote Wresting-->Comment please-->share this message.

 

http://www.themat.com/section.php?secti ... leID=26415

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://keepwrestlingintheolympics.com/

 

 

We're only winning by 10% now, dramatically lower than before. We keep this up and SQUASH will beat us by the end of the month!

 

Everyone should clear out their web browser 'cookies' and vote again. I guarantee the other sports are doing that and even if this won't make a difference to the IOC, it still doesn't look good to lose a popularity contests to a sport no one has even heard of.

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We have multiple threads discussing how the sport is dying. Yet here we have a kid who wants to continue in the sport, and several posters have told him to not bother. Not cautioning him, but deterring him.

 

Let's put on our thinking caps for a second here: Philly Public School kid, started in 9th grade ... decent chance he's a product of the Beat the Streets program. And he wants to become a teacher. He could become a coach in an underserved area, and grow the sport for 30+ years.

 

Or, he could not bother supplementing his college degree with a college education in the sport.

 

Maybe it works out for him, maybe it doesn't. Either way: nothing ventured, nothing gained.

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What many of you may not understand is, this kid wrestled in Philadelphia. Before this year, Philly had never had a state champ - Joey Galasso from Father Judge won states this year as a Jr and he is a big-time stud!

 

But getting back to our boy of the thread: it is totally possible that he has only scratched the surface of his talent. I'm not trying to demean Philly wrestling, but the Public League teams have practically no experience and the coaches aren't very well known either.

 

Now the Philly Catholic league is a different story. Until recently, LaSalle College high school had Vic Stanley as its coach. Vic had won the state team championship with Council Rock in the seventies and has consistently put out great wrestlers. When LaSalle entered the PIAA they hit the ground running. They had several state place winners their first year.

 

I guess what I'm saying is: our boy of the thread may have a heap of untapped potential just waiting to be cultivated by a great coaching staff. That is, if the staff takes the time to cultivate it.

 

Your average PIAA District runner up is a pretty good wrestler, but will not necessarily improve exponentially at college. But the District 12 (Philly) runner up could be good or mediocre. But he may also have a heck of an upside as well.

 

You should help out with BTS-Philadelphia! Lots of great kids there.

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What many of you may not understand is, this kid wrestled in Philadelphia. Before this year, Philly had never had a state champ - Joey Galasso from Father Judge won states this year as a Jr and he is a big-time stud!

 

But getting back to our boy of the thread: it is totally possible that he has only scratched the surface of his talent. I'm not trying to demean Philly wrestling, but the Public League teams have practically no experience and the coaches aren't very well known either.

 

Now the Philly Catholic league is a different story. Until recently, LaSalle College high school had Vic Stanley as its coach. Vic had won the state team championship with Council Rock in the seventies and has consistently put out great wrestlers. When LaSalle entered the PIAA they hit the ground running. They had several state place winners their first year.

 

I guess what I'm saying is: our boy of the thread may have a heap of untapped potential just waiting to be cultivated by a great coaching staff. That is, if the staff takes the time to cultivate it.

 

Your average PIAA District runner up is a pretty good wrestler, but will not necessarily improve exponentially at college. But the District 12 (Philly) runner up could be good or mediocre. But he may also have a heck of an upside as well.

 

I think this is the same for most every big city in the U.S. It certainly is true for Chicago in terms of the "product" the Chicago Public League puts out on the mats vs. the "product" the Chicago Catholic League puts out on the mats. They couldn't be further apart from one another for countless reasons.

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All the cheerleaders on this board are ignoring the very real possibility that he could hate it. College wrestling is not like high school. Then he's left with the choice of: (i) sticking with something he hates for 4 years, or (ii) being a quitter.

 

It would seem you have three options in life:

 

1) Try new things, and then keep doing them even if you hate them because you're not a quitter;

 

2) Don't try new things, because you might hate them and you don't want to be a quitter; or

 

3) Try new things, and if you hate them, quit. You big quitter.

 

I'll go with #3; I call it "learning". As I see it, there's a difference between quitting something you really want to do because you lack the fortitude to keep at it, and quitting something you don't want to do, and have no reason to stick with.

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A subject near and dear to my heart.

 

I was technically a "walk-on" at Michigan State. The head coach, my freshman year there, told my high school coach that I would never make the team. (My college coach admitted he said that.) I didn't get a penny my first year there.

 

I think that experience made me hungry to show the the coach -- and everyone else -- that I could make the team. Three years later, I was a two-time NCAA champion. It can be done -- but it takes determination and a lot of work...

 

The most important thing a walk-on has to do is not listen to anybody who tells you you can't do it. (And that goes for reaching goals in every area of life. There will always be people who are negative -- stay away from them. Do what you love -- and strive to be the best.)

 

Finally, I have two things I'd like to say generally about walk-ons.

 

1. The walk-ons on our team were always able to pick up the baton and run just as fast as the rest of us. One walk-on on our team was an all-american and another was a Big Ten champion and alternate to the Olympic team.

Why ?? -- because they WANTED IT. I had incredible respect for our walk-ons -- and always will because they were doing it for the LOVE of the sport.

 

2. When I went back to MSU to get my doctorate, I saw kids leaving the wrestling room crying -- CRYING! Why? Because they just got cut. Why did they get cut? Because of title 9. How did that work? Well I asked the AD. She said that because the female track coach couldn't get anyone to walk-on -- it set up a disproportionate relationship between mens and womens "participation" -- meaning male non-revenue sports had to cut their athletes (even though they weren't costing the school a penny). In reality, the female track coach just didn't want any walk-ons -- becasue the they just waste everyone's time and space.

 

(Unfortunately, once I start bitching about t9, it's hard for me to stop. As alot of you know I've been in about 8,000,000 arguments about t9 on this website. And I long ago burned out on the subject.)

 

Suffice it to say for now, that a lot of athletes / wrestlers who were happy to buy their own jocks just to be able to work out with the varsity were "cut" from the team just to satisfy a ridiculous quota. I told the wrestling community 20 years ago that if it didn't kill the quota, the quota was going to kill wrestling -- starting with the walk-ons.

 

So, in conclusion -- I love walk-ons (because they are wrestling solely for the love of the sport) -- (and I hate t9 -- and I always will because it destroyed the [male] walk-on).

 

Best -

 

DA

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This thread has made its way to some of the Penn State wrestling message boards. On BWI's Penn State wrestling board, a former PSU walk-on made a post, and asked if somebody could post it on this forum. dclark145, this is a message to you from a former PSU walk-on.

 

"If someone who has access to that site can post this for me that would be great. Don't feel like signing up for another site. I rarely ever post anything to any site, but this one hit home for me. Hope you all enjoy reading this story and get a little feel as to what it is like walking on to PSU's wrestling team.

 

I hope the kid goes to PSU for the educational experience alone. If he never wrestles again, he will come away with a great education and set himself up for a good job opportunity. Unless he's planning on going to the Olympics, he should look at the education and take the full academic scholarship. I think everyone who is a PSU grad on this board can agree with that.

 

As far as walking on, I think I can probably give the best advice of anyone, especially at PSU. Granted back in the early 2000's, when I walked-on, it was a different time as opposed to the dominance that PSU has shown lately. However I think my story will resonate with the kid.

 

I am a former walk-on at PSU, who was told by Coach Sunderland as a freshman that I would not make the team, despite being a 2x Prep All American and ranked the #1 Prep wrestler in the country my senior year before being upset at Prep Nationals. I never won Prep states (3x runner-up). Never won Prep Nationals. I am also from Southeastern PA, and now give back to the sport as one of the two coaches of an extremeley successful youth club and high school. I had 1 scholarship offer as a senior and that was to SUNY Binghamton, which I turned down for the education of PSU. Here's my story...

 

I decided to walk-on at PSU and was more than holding my own. As a walk-on, you start much later than the regular team, so the odds are even more stacked against you. You have to train on your own, while the kids on scholarship are going thru the designated team runs and practices. A week before wrestle-offs (already practicing for a month) the remaining 4 walk-ons, myself included, were finally given PSU wrestling gear (t-shirts and shorts) so that we felt part of the team. On the way up to get the gear, Coach Sunderland told us that we wouldn't make the team because he had a 40 roster limit. I was crushed because I knew I belonged and had proven myself in the practice room. I believed him like a fool, and another walk-on and I quit two days later. The other two walk-ons ignored Coach Sunderland's comment, stuck with it, and made the team. I was shocked and angry. I was lied to and deceived and there was nothing that I could do about it. Or so I thought...

 

Two months later when I got back from Christmas break to my freshman dorm in East Halls, I had an email from Coach Sunderland telling me that I had an open offer to come back and try out if I wanted to. I was shocked, especially since it was sent in the middle of the season. After thinking about it for a month, I decided I had to take the opportunity to prove that I belonged no matter what a coach or others thought. I got myself back into shape, since I had been "fratastic" for a couple months after I quit, and was back on campus in late August running with the team. A few weeks later, I am in a meeting with all new athletes from every sport, being told that I couldn't take steroids or hire an agent. I remember leaving that meeting and calling my dad saying, "I think I made the team?". A few months later, I won wrestle-offs and was the starting 174lber for the entire season. Although I never placed 1st at a collegiate tournament or even won a Big Ten Tournament match for that fact (Drawing UFC fighter Rashad Evans from Mich St. first round and then the #3 seed from Minn being upset didn't help.). I did what people told me wasn't possible.

 

I saw posters on that board saying that they weren't trying to be mean but that he shouldn't even try. If I were him, I would use that as fuel to the fire. If this kid wants to walk-on and wrestle for PSU, then he should go get his dream. It will not be easy. You will have to work your tail off, but it can be done. I am one of only a handful of people ever at PSU to walk-on and start their first year making the team. I am proof it can be done. WE ARE...PENN STATE!!! "

 

 

Maybe if you weren't a National Prep runner-up I'd say your story was inspirational. Don't you people realize were talking about a kid that failed to qualify for a state tournament. I've read all your great "walk-on" stories, but those "walk-ons" were WAY more accomplished than this guy. You are all setting him up for failure and the beatings of a lifetime. I'm surprised no one has told the kid to go watch Rudy for some inspiration.

 

This is the only post I read on this thread.

 

I'll say it -- Go watch Rudy -- and HOosiers -- and anything else that inspires you to do better -- or be better.

 

DA

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Dale, i didn't realize you were a walkon. Coming out of West Waterloo i figured you were on scholarship the whole time. I made a post on Stan Abel who was about as close to being a walkon without being one, getting only books. Dale and Stan are two greats that won NCAA championships starting at the bottom. Both had the drive to prove they belonged. That is the one thing you can't excel without having.

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I read these posts and there is truth in the majority of them. I do believe that walking into a DI room is a very difficult thing to do depending on your skills/ability. I don't think, however, that accomplishments alone are an indication of how you will do and many posts on here back this up. I am surprised at some of the stories of coaches telling kids right off the bat, that they will not be able to compete. This is surprising to me. My son walked on to a DI program after a decent high school career and he was encouraged by the coach to do so. He was a 3rd place kid from Pa who never made it to states before but really put it together his senior year. He competed well in opens and was competitive in his room but has not yet broken the starting lineup. However, the lessons learned and the friendships that he has made have certainly made it all worth it, despite at times being difficult. I believe that even if he never starts(and he has two more years), his efforts are something to be proud of.

 

Now, I believe he always has had some talent, just played other sports and never focused on wrestling until later in high school and believe he is still learning. I have told him from the beginning, be ready to be completely humbled when you step foot in the room but never stop learning/getting better and never accept a role as a back up. Always expect to be the starter and don't settle for less. Although Dad's advice has not made a starter out of him as of yet(lol), I do think he has developed into a much tougher wrestler, both physically and mentally. I have also told him to not make any decisions until after he finishes his first year in its entirety. At that time, if you still have the desire to continue to wrestle, then commit to getting better and keep at it. If at the end of your first year, the beatings are so bad that you don't like the sport, I have no problem with him not continuing. Look at a guy who labors in the minor leagues for years before he gets his big chance. I'm sure they are doubting their decision the whole time but it all comes down to desire and a dream.

 

Now, I also agree that it can be a tough lesson for kids who don't have enough talent but who are we to be the judge of a kid's talent. Other posters have proven that high school success does not necessarily mean you can't accomplish alot. I can never picture myself telling a kid not to try what they want to do. It all goes back to Teddy Roosevelt's quote about it's not the critic who counts but the man who is in the arena.

 

Here is another good article and I wish the kid good luck.

 

http://newyorkwrestlingnews.com/a-shot- ... nal-title/

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Isn't the obvious solution to go to a college where the wrestling team is NOT the number 1 team in the country? Perhaps Division III is a better idea. We aren't eliminating a lot of options, and we should not pretend that Penn State's academics are not easily equalled by hundreds of other universities.

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He has an academic scholarship to Penn State, so walking on there is a reasonable choice. Now he may get crushed and quit, or he makes improvement. If he can survive in the Penn State room, but isn't anywhere near making the team then he's got these options.

 

1 quit wrestling and continue with his academic studies at Penn State

2 transfer to another very good academic institution maybe D3 level. He'll be ahead of many teammates because of one or two years in the Penn State room.

 

Now if he has offers of an academic scholarship at another good academic school he could consider that option.

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Isn't the obvious solution to go to a college where the wrestling team is NOT the number 1 team in the country? Perhaps Division III is a better idea. We aren't eliminating a lot of options, and we should not pretend that Penn State's academics are not easily equalled by hundreds of other universities.

 

http://www.usnews.com/education/worlds- ... rld?page=5

 

Or, if you prefer: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog ... -education

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I have been offered full tuition to Drexel, as well, but Penn State's College of Education is #25 in the nation, with the only other university with a better College of Education that i got into is American, which is #24. PSUs education, by any legitimate means, is NOT equal with hundreds of other universities.

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If at the end of your first year, the beatings are so bad that you don't like the sport, I have no problem with him not continuing. Look at a guy who labors in the minor leagues for years before he gets his big chance. I'm sure they are doubting their decision the whole time but it all comes down to desire and a dream.

 

 

Do you understand how long the college wrestling season is? For some guys an entire year of getting absolutely pounded 2X a day is way longer than they should "stick it out." Obviously, your son is very talented and likely holds his own, but to expect the "average" walk-on to stick it out for an entire year if they are miserable is a little much. Given that these guys have "stuck it out" all the way through high school and have had the motivation to give it a go in college, I think the moment they realize their other interest are more important is the time to quit, even if this realization comes during thanksgiving or winter break. As some previous posters have mentioned, you don't get your time back.

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Isn't the obvious solution to go to a college where the wrestling team is NOT the number 1 team in the country? Perhaps Division III is a better idea. We aren't eliminating a lot of options, and we should not pretend that Penn State's academics are not easily equalled by hundreds of other universities.

 

http://www.usnews.com/education/worlds- ... rld?page=5

 

Or, if you prefer: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog ... -education

 

I've found that many people from the east coast tend to perceive that B1G = SEC caliber academics due to the conferences' similar emphasis on athletics.

 

I can't blame them completely though.

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I would love nothing more than to see the OP go out and and work like he never thought possible as Mark Cuban writes in his book the formula to success is 24*7*365. If you fully devote yourself to a dream I encourage the OP to give it 150% and dedicate to something you truly want. You may never see a live match but if you fully devote to a goal and leave absolutely nothing to chance I promise you will not be dissappointed or left wandering people would be amazed at what others are capable of. Go out and prove to others why they themself have not reached success!

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I told the wrestling community 20 years ago that if it didn't kill the quota, the quota was going to kill wrestling -- starting with the walk-ons.

 

Dale, I know you know this but didn't say it in your post, the application of the "quota" standard component of Title IX is a choice made by the school/AD - it's not specifically mandated by Title IX. The quota standard is offered as but one of three options for establishing compliance. Schools could employ one of the other standards if so inclined and then not have to cut male athletes from sports. I say this only to fix responsibility with those who are truly responsible - the schools/AD.

 

I was a walk-on at a DI program. After a year I transferred out to a smaller university to get the opportunity to wrestle on the varsity. Some of my good friends stayed and were journeymen with the program...and in retrospect, pleased with their decision. Participation had value to them, even if they weren't ever in the lineup. It had value to them. My point is that being the man isn't the only value to be derived from participation.

 

I think it's a crime that institutions of public education (sponsored by public money) have programs from which they exclude tuition paying students; the whole notion is antithetical to the stated goals of higher education. The experience of participation at that level can be as transformative to a "lowly" walk-on as it might be to an NCAA champ. To remove that opportunity from a student based on physical abilities just runs contrary to what higher education holds out as its mission.

 

I realize that there may be an actual physical limitation with participation, e.g. a coaching staff might not be able to accommodate 60 wrestlers showing up in a given room, but the nature of the beast is also part of the problem - some NCAA sports have morphed into something far different than originally envisioned (see for example football and basketball). The whole system is now "upside down," it's not simply Title IX. We want our cake and to eat it, too.

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I told the wrestling community 20 years ago that if it didn't kill the quota, the quota was going to kill wrestling -- starting with the walk-ons.

 

Dale, I know you know this but didn't say it in your post, the application of the "quota" standard component of Title IX is a choice made by the school/AD - it's not specifically mandated by Title IX. The quota standard is offered as but one of three options for establishing compliance. Schools could employ one of the other standards if so inclined and then not have to cut male athletes from sports. I say this only to fix responsibility with those who are truly responsible - the schools/AD.

 

 

I made the comment about t9 -- only to point out that t9 goes after the weakest programs and the weakest athletes -- ones that cannot defend themselves -- i.e. walk-ons. That's another reason I hate it / t9 so much.

 

I hate to say this -- and I hope not to turn this thread into a debate about t9 -- but since you are addressing me personally, I must rebut -- as I couldn't disagree with you more that there are three ways to comply with t9. All roads lead to proportionality.

 

Another reason I hate it / the quota is that I spent 10 years -- the vast majority of that time pro bono --fighting the quota advocates -- even at the Supreme Court and in every other venue -- including the administration / President and Congress -- including wasting three years of my life on the Hill in Washington DC.

 

I concluded that 1. The three-prong approach to gender equity was nothing but smoke and mirrors. I have explained why this is true dozens of times on this site, but to no avail, so I'm not going to do it again.

2. The anti quota side has been dead in the water since day one -- probably 1972, but certainly since 1979 -- and absolutely sime the 80's..

 

Frankly, there were times when we had a chance to survive and thrive -- the quota leadership was willing to concede ground that they would not even consider now. I watched at the beginning when the quota advocates and male sport advocates met to decide how t9 would work with sports at the college level. It was all on video too. The women chose their smartest advocates -- we chose our dumbest.

 

During one discussion, the women (quota advocates) conceded during those early debates that football and basketball are unique and probably should not be counted in the quota / proportionality equation -- just to be fair.

 

Your leader / "our" leader -- a football coach -- and a guy who played too many games without his helmet said something like every football and basketball player is the same athlete as as every other athlete on campus -- and should be counted the same. (he thought the women were trying to demean the football player, when in fact, the women wanted to give male athletes a break.) I could only burn with embarrassment that this football coach was our spokesman.

 

He really had NO IDEA what the women were conceding.

 

My dog could have figured out that the was concession / deal we should have died for.

 

Instead we missed our chance --

 

Since that time -- since the quota advocates know that they are smarter than we are -- the quota advocates have used smoke and mirrors to fool us.

 

Using AD's or football as the bad guys here is nothing but a ruse.

 

I could spend 800 hours to explain why but when I was done -- most people in the wrestling community would still say Isn't the problem really football? Or isn't the probem really administrators?

 

Let me give you a quick example from the old days that I used to use to explain why all roads lead to proportionality -- the quota.

 

Let's say the prong is satisfying female interest on campus. Now what happens is that 5 females come to you, (you are the AD), and say, "We're not satisfied." We want a bowling team -- or a ping pong team -- or whatever happens to be the flavor of the month -- maybe a rowing team -- or a volleyball team -- whatever. You must satisfy these five girls as they are, by definition, reflecting "interest" -- at least that's the way it worked back in the 80's and 90's when all of these issues were being sorted out by administrators. YOu do realize -- at that moment when those girls face off with you in your office -- you are no longer the AD -- these five girls are.

 

There is ONLY one way that nobody / no female can demand a team -- achieving proportionality. So why wouldn't every administrator attempt to do that -- and how? by destorying opportunity for the walk-on (because who cares about them?)

 

I can't tell you the number of times AD's basically told me this type of story back in the 80's and 90's when they were destroying male non-revenue sports -- and opportunities for walk=-ons to participate. And, to me, it made sense. That prong made it impossible for AD's to be Athletic DIRECTORS.

 

I frankly have not been involved in the t9 fight for at least 10 years, but the only people I trust to tell me what is presently going on is Leo Kocher (UNiversity of Chicago) and Eric Pearson and Clay McEndowney (Princeton) as IMO, they are able to cut through the smoke (and mirrors) to view the truth during this period since I left the fight. They are very smart -- and I have really concluded that unless you work very hard to see the truth -- or you are very smart, the logic of it will escape you. Those three that have helped to form some sort of foundation basically tell me that all the problems that I addressed in 80's and 90's are the same now -- except maybe worse -- I'll take their word for it -- and thank God that he gave me the good sense to get out when I did. I have encouraged people on this site to join their crusade as it is my opinion that your side / our side is leaderless -- except for them.

 

I wrote way longer than I wanted to -- as I told myself a long time ago -- I would never again indulge in these t9 debates as they are a BIG waste of time for me now. I served my term. When I was done -- I was done.

 

Trust me, though --- if you spent ten years on the t9 issue, as I did , you would never say the problem is AD's or football or the two other prongs. Those are just smoke and mirrors.

 

Best -

 

DA

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