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TBar1977

Tougher Weight at NCAAs 157 or 165?

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Yeah, it’s 165 and I don’t think it is even close.  I think there is a significant drop off after Carr and Deakin.  Those 2 are the only guys at the weight that I would put up against the top 10 or so at 165.  Even then, that is only if the NCAA tournament version of Deakin isn’t what it has been so far. 
 

 

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28 minutes ago, BigTimeFan said:

Hands down 165. Between the frosh talent, returning champ (Griffith) and Wick who’s beaten Griffiths and Marienelli I don’t see the argument for 157. 

I will give you an argument. In SHPs Index posted today the 157 wrestlers across the board are rated higher than those at 165. The number 1, 5, 10 and 15 are all higher at 157 than 165. 

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11 minutes ago, goStanford18 said:

Doesn’t Carr have a Junior world title at 74kg? If 165 was easier, why would he cut the extra weight to go 157? 

Because 99% of D1 college athletes wrestle at the weight they think is best in terms of their performance, not what is "easier".

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22 minutes ago, dman115 said:

Because 99% of D1 college athletes wrestle at the weight they think is best in terms of their performance, not what is "easier".

So his best performance is at 163lbs in FS but not 165lbs in college? 70kg exists in FS, but it’s very possible he wants to compete at an Olympic weight. Maybe 157lbs is a sweet spot for him. I don’t think ISU has anyone keeping him from going 165. 

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How do you want to define Tough?

Using SHP's rantings and looking at distributions, 157 has both the higher average (line with value) and median (border between light grey and dark grey boxes), but 165 has the tightest distribution (both from high to low and from range of the middle 50% shown in the box).

 

image.thumb.png.ad602c577c62fc2caa0d929336fdbeae.png

Other observations:

  • Gable is the outliers outlier. He singlehandedly gives HWT the highest average rating. But HWT has just the fifth highest median.
  • 165 has the most parity. In addition to a four man race at the top, the bottom end is very tightly packed (there are over-the-counter meds for that). 165 also has the best worst wrestler.

 

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7 hours ago, goStanford18 said:

Doesn’t Carr have a Junior world title at 74kg? If 165 was easier, why would he cut the extra weight to go 157? 

Might as well ask why Suriano, who won an NCAA title at 133, is wrestling at 125. I'm sure it's because he took an Olympic redshirt for 126 pounds and decided to just stay at that weight for the college season. I bet he'd have moved up to 133 during the season if Lee didn't get injured. 

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I don’t really think 157 is in the conversation for toughest weight. The only 3 I can see a debate for is 165, 174, 285. I would rank them in that order, but I do think it’s debatable.

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55 minutes ago, Eagle26 said:

I don’t really think 157 is in the conversation for toughest weight. The only 3 I can see a debate for is 165, 174, 285. I would rank them in that order, but I do think it’s debatable.

I like 174 personally if everyone is healthy.

Of course if Spencer were wrestle 125 would have some serious consideration.

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8 hours ago, MSU158 said:

Yeah, it’s 165 and I don’t think it is even close.  I think there is a significant drop off after Carr and Deakin.  Those 2 are the only guys at the weight that I would put up against the top 10 or so at 165.  Even then, that is only if the NCAA tournament version of Deakin isn’t what it has been so far. 
 

 

Disagree on the gap between Carr/Deakin and the rest. I think Teemer will give Deakin a hell of a match, just like he did in their 3rd place match last season at NCAA’s. 

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38 minutes ago, Mokoma said:

I like 174 personally if everyone is healthy.

Of course if Spencer were wrestle 125 would have some serious consideration.

Hwt has an Olympic champion and multiple age level champions in Cassiopi, Kerk, Paris and Shultz. I think Hwt takes the cake rather easily. 

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285 has a decent group this year:

  • Olympic gold (Gable)
  • World Greco 14th (Schultz)
  • U23 world gold (Cassioppi)
  • U23 world 5th (Kerkvliet)
  • U23 world Greco 10th (Orndorff)
  • Junior world gold (Parris)
  • Junior world silver (Elam)
  • Junior world silver (Davison)
  • Junior world 5th (Hendrickson)
Edited by Katie

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2 hours ago, Katie said:

285 has a decent group this year:

  • Olympic freestyle gold medalist (Gable)
  • World Greco 14th place (Schultz)
  • U23 world gold medalist (Cassioppi)
  • U23 world 5th place (Kerkvliet)
  • U23 world Greco 10th (Orndorff)
  • Junior world gold (Parris)
  • Junior world silver (Elam)
  • Junior world silver (Davison)
  • Junior world 5th place (Hendrickson)

Plus Wood Cadet world Silver 

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13 hours ago, BSUBroncoDynasty said:

Disagree on the gap between Carr/Deakin and the rest. I think Teemer will give Deakin a hell of a match, just like he did in their 3rd place match last season at NCAA’s. 

Trust me, I am a big Teemer fan. But, the version of Deakin at NCAA’s simply hasn’t been the version we have seen in the off season or most of the regular season, for that matter. That is why I specified that exact thing when putting Deakin in that category. 

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26 minutes ago, MSU158 said:

Trust me, I am a big Teemer fan. But, the version of Deakin at NCAA’s simply hasn’t been the version we have seen in the off season or most of the regular season, for that matter. That is why I specified that exact thing when putting Deakin in that category. 

You're saying Deakin is like Marinelli? 

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38 minutes ago, TBar1977 said:

You're saying Deakin is like Marinelli? 

I think Deakin has had considerable health/injury issues at the wrong times. Where Marinelli just happened to be the victim of some really tough brackets.   Meaning, Deakin, at his best, was only maybe getting beat by maybe 1 or 2 guys at his weight. While, Marinelli, even though at or near the top has had a half dozen or so guys that could beat him at their best. 

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