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The lack of importance of the team scoring again put on front Street today

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1 minute ago, jammen said:

Well, this is completely wrong.  Here's some history for you so you can see the great teams that have battled for a National Duals title:http://wrestlingstats.com/NWCA/PDF/NWCA National Duals.pdf

Also, Cael had a 2-6-1 dual record versus Minny, Iowa, Okie St, and OH St when he campaigned against the National Dual Championship proposal and published his infamous blog post.  That was the deciding factor.

Nothing in my post is wrong. An NWCA National Duals Championship is not a national title. Never was. It doesn't matter what great teams competed thought its history. At best, it's the NIT of championships and I'm not talking about when the NIT was a national title back in the 1930s. Record books show one national champion and it's from the NCAA tournament.

Is there another D1 individual sport where team titles and individual titles are decided separately? There may be, but I can't think of one.

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6 minutes ago, southend said:

Point is the national championship is meaningless for teams. As it is presented now 

It's not meaningless at all. It's just not exciting when the team race is decided well before the finals.

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So in other words ...........
Since my team stinks and is totally uncompetitive, please, please ,pretty please change the rules!
Jesus Christ, man. Not everything is about you or your favorite team. I've said this same thing for years, including the last two years when my favorite team was a prohibitive favorite and won a title. The national title is diminished by how we present it now. It has no prestige, no cache. Penn State didn't win by beating Michigan, they won because a Michigan guy didn't get a pin vs. an Arizona State guy.

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What I don’t understand is if PSU would dominate and win anyway what the heck are you afraid of? What don’t you like about watching wrestling outside of 3 days in March?

I’m tired of the counter argument “oh we just don’t want to be hurt for NCAAs”. Man, the history of this sport is not rooted in only worrying about 3 days in March it was and should be about stepping on the mat as much as you can and competing against your opponent.

Let’s fricken wrestle…


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24 minutes ago, Jrr277 said:

Is there another D1 individual sport where team titles and individual titles are decided separately? There may be, but I can't think of one.

i believe track and field, swimming, and gymnastics all do it the same as wrestling.  cannot even think of another individual/team sport.  i wonder what tennis and golf does.

Edited by boathead

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Or maybe they won bc they got 5 in the finals and only a couple of their qualifiers crapped the bed?
You understand what I mean. Their championship moment, the moment they became champions was nondescript and in front of very few people. That's a diminishment of the product.

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Yes, we need to make duals matter and a National duals tournament is the way to do it. I’d love to see the NCAA recognize both the dual tournament champions and the individual tournament champion team, but my understanding is the ncaa doesn’t want to award both. Easy solution is that the NCAA needs to award the dual championship to add prestige to it. The NWCA can award the team trophies at the individual tournament and tradition alone will be enough to keep that prestigious. 

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Last I checked, duals matter, in that they are scored based on the results of individuals against other individuals.

Those results also impact your seed at the conference and NCAA tournament, as well as qualifying for the latter, too.


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It’s an individual team sport. You’re not going to get a ‘good’ unified way to determine a champion.

This year, Penn State dominates in a tourney or dual.

 

In a dual you know what time the champion is decided.

A tourney, it happens when it happens, but all teams theoretically have a chance, and more fan bases can stay involved to the end for their individuals.

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2 hours ago, JeanGuy said:

I disagree. I'm not sure how you qualify teams. The big ten teams for instance don't even wrestle everybody in the conference.

It leads your to subjective rankings just like football. 

Maybe the FBS/Division 1 guys. Everh other division has a full playoff to a real Champion - not a limited participation 4 team farce.

In fact, because of this and the history of Polls voting on who the champion is - North Dakota State University has more NCAA football titles than Alabama, Oklahoma, Penn State and the others combined. A real title, not a poll winner.

Keep wrestling with the NCAA tournament as it is. Very good competition.

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14 hours ago, 4awrestler said:

What I don’t understand is if PSU would dominate and win anyway what the heck are you afraid of? What don’t you like about watching wrestling outside of 3 days in March?

I’m tired of the counter argument “oh we just don’t want to be hurt for NCAAs”. Man, the history of this sport is not rooted in only worrying about 3 days in March it was and should be about stepping on the mat as much as you can and competing against your opponent.

Let’s fricken wrestle…


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Speculation but I’m guessing it has to do with “peaking twice” and they wouldn’t want to pick one or the other to be more focused on.

I agree though, I think team champion should be determined by a dual tournament.  NCAA would make a lot more money too because you’d still get the same amount of people at/watching the individual tournament but would maybe get even more interest in a team tournament.  

In reality you probably only need like 8-10 teams so you’re only adding 2 or 3 matches.  And make the regular season matter in qualifying for the tournament.  Kill 2 birds with one stone.


 

14 hours ago, boathead said:

i believe track and field, swimming, and gymnastics all do it the same as wrestling.  cannot even think of another individual/team sport.  i wonder what tennis and golf does.

Looks like tennis does both.  Golf seems combined.

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The team race at NCAAs seems to get a lot of play because of how vocal the fans of the few teams that have a chance are. Having maybe 5 teams maximum the have even an outside shot at the team title is bad for the sport and for the fans of all the other teams or fans that just love the sport and have no favorite team

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