Being reported on Intermat that NWCA withdrawing proposal

[Eagle26 598]

Lol if you've read Kolls latest attempt to fool coaches into approving this, you'd likely think twice about your statement.

 

link?

[luchador150 0]

It wasn't a link. It was an email sent out to all the coaches. "vote or else" was the just of it.

 

As a friend put it, Roberts Rules of Chaos was instilled during this matter.

[scribe 1,838]

Simple up or down vote. No blind claims of conspiracy will overwhelm that.

[Eagle26 598]

It wasn't a link. It was an email sent out to all the coaches. "vote or else" was the just of it.

 

As a friend put it, Roberts Rules of Chaos was instilled during this matter.

 

Well you are right, I did not see that, but I liked what Koll said in his letter posted on Flo

[scribe 1,838]

http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/10571

[luchador150 0]

Here's the problem with that though, the way it reads is they don't even need all coaches to vote in order to pass. Just says majority and it passes. So if 20 votes come in and 11 vote yes, it passes.

 

Not exactly democratic.

[luchador150 0]

Yup "vote yes or else."

[Mustang84 0]

Yup "vote yes or else."

If this was the case, you think the coaches will be smart enough to see through this and vote it down. You obviously do and seem very knowledgable.

[Eagle26 598]

http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/10571

 

 

Thanks. I definitely still agree with Koll and the other coaches on the NWCA board.

 

As a side note, one of the only valid arguments against this idea is that it will make it harder for teams with only a few very good individuals to place higher in the team championships. The best recent example of this is American U placing 5th in 2010. I find it interesting that both of their coaches (Cody and Rogers) were on the board that voted for the new proposal. So I guess if they still see the benefit, I would think anyone could.

[scribe 1,838]

http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/10571

 

 

Thanks. I definitely still agree with Koll and the other coaches on the NWCA board.

 

As a side note, one of the only valid arguments against this idea is that it will make it harder for teams with only a few very good individuals to place higher in the team championships. The best recent example of this is American U placing 5th in 2010. I find it interesting that both of their coaches (Cody and Rogers) were on the board that voted for the new proposal. So I guess if they still see the benefit, I would think anyone could.

I am not so sure that American squad couldn't have pressed some teams in dual emphasis format. But fear not, American can still place fifth at the individual tournament official team scoring as agreed to by the NCAA. They might even do better than fifth if one of the other teams decides to soft pedal on bonus points.

[luchador150 0]

No one of the major valid arguments against this is the assumption that lower tier programs will be saved, brought back, ADs will all of the sudden care about a fringe sport and somehow infused with millions of dollars.

 

No supporting facts, no research, no hard data just their word that will somehow happen.

[luchador150 0]

Umm it's not really official scoring unless it says NCAA.

[redblades 322]

http://intermatwrestle.com/articles/10571

 

I would encourage folks to read this for themselves, not just the bile that is getting regurgitated on various fora. I definately get a different take reading the E-mail from what is being reported (distorted?) here and elswhere. Go read for yourself, and form your own opinion.

 

Seems pretty straight forward to me - NCAA told the NWCA to go back to the table, try again. It's a straight up yes or no vote. No conspiracy. A yes vote from a majority of the 77 coaches is needed for the NWCA to continue to support the proposal. If not, it gets pulled for the forseeable future.

 

Go see for yourself.

[Husker_Du 853]

[highlight=#e1ebf2]NCAA told the NWCA to go back to the table, try again[/highlight]

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that's kind of the opposite of what happened. but whatever.

what i find interesting is that every one of you agree with your head coach.

all cornell fans = for

all psu fans = against

loyal much?

[Husker_Du 853]

Simple up or down vote. No blind claims of conspiracy will overwhelm that.

 

 

scribe, that would be great if the coaches actually knew the details they were voting on.

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[highlight=#e1ebf2]NCAA told the NWCA to go back to the table, try again[/highlight]

[highlight=#e1ebf2]

[/highlight]

that's kind of the opposite of what happened. but whatever.

what i find interesting is that every one of you agree with your head coach.

all cornell fans = for

all psu fans = against

loyal much?

 

For years, I've been frustrated with Koll giving away dual meets to protect an individual for the post season. I've been anything but loyal to that philosophy leading up to this effort by SOME of the coaches to give meaning to the dual meet season.

[scribe 1,838]

Simple up or down vote. No blind claims of conspiracy will overwhelm that.

 

 

scribe, that would be great if the coaches actually knew the details they were voting on.

 

You see the comment by Jim Harshaw at the bottom of the Intermat article? This feigning of ignorance about what the NWCA have been working toward for years is absurd.

[AnklePicker 646]

.

[luchador150 0]

Um the coaches on the board knew. Everyone else was out of the loop.

 

Big10 coaches didn't even receive the proposal until Aug 28th of this year.

[Mustang84 0]

Um the coaches on the board knew. Everyone else was out of the loop.

 

Big10 coaches didn't even receive the proposal until Aug 28th of this year.

How different is the actual proposal from what was written and put on the message boards. I have not heard anything that is out there in this proposal that I was not aware of really since it really first broke.

[SetonHallPirate 990]

Here's the problem with that though, the way it reads is they don't even need all coaches to vote in order to pass. Just says majority and it passes. So if 20 votes come in and 11 vote yes, it passes.

 

Not exactly democratic.

That's not democratic? I didn't know that our elections were decided as if all voters who didn't show up at the polls were counted as votes against a referendum...in that case, George Washington would be the most recent President of the United States, as nobody would have gotten enough votes since then!

[luchador150 0]

No it's how dictators decide how things are done.

[Wahawk90 0]

thanks Tirapell, I was interested in your thoughts becuase of your statement of 5-6 teams that have won over the past 30 yrs. and you have a unique perspective based on being on a contending team. (I may have just had wishful thinking).

 

I think the reason why those teams have enjoyed more success winning national titles than the others has alot to do with the tradition of winning of the 5-6 teams that have won. Those teams are just plain out recruiting the other teams for the best wrestlers in the country. Guys have gone to Iowa for less money than they could have gotten at other schools and I am sure that is happening now at PSU. The last 2 teams that have won have won with the benefit of 2 recruiting classes and that probably has cost Cornell, Minnesota and Ohio State team titles. But, in a dual meet format the only team that would have won a dual meet title is Minnesota.

 

I dn't trust the NCAA that somehow the dual meet competition will one-day mean a reduction or elimination of the individual championship. I also happen to believe that the only reason they are interested is because they have the opportunity to squeeze more money from ESPN and less interested in seeing the growth of wrestling. Over the past 20 years as university has cut wrestling programs, they have stood by and done very little as the individual tournament became better and profitable.

[Husker_Du 853]

Simple up or down vote. No blind claims of conspiracy will overwhelm that.

 

 

scribe, that would be great if the coaches actually knew the details they were voting on.

 

You see the comment by Jim Harshaw at the bottom of the Intermat article? This feigning of ignorance about what the NWCA have been working toward for years is absurd.

 

 

scribe, fwiw, i'm for creating change and a new, sanctioned and televised espn event.

 

that being said,

 

1) when you talk to a dozen coaches to ask their stance and they say 'i don't have all the facts' there's a communication problem to the extent that you can't expect them to vot on a decision of this magnitude.

 

2) i don't think the coaches are 'feigning interest'. and if they are, well, that tells you how they feel.

 

*notice those two items don't help my assertion that we have to capitalize on the opportunity. im just relating what i see/am told.

[scribe 1,838]

If it doesn't pass the sniff test after all the water has passed under the bridge they can vote it down. If it doesn't pass the coaches vote, they might elect more time and effort into crafting concerns on another proposal. That's if the NCAA and ESPN are still interested.

 

I not getting the opposition to even having a vote on proceeding on the work that has been to date.