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App State Coach JohnMark Bentley says Millner was being recruited at NCAA's

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7 hours ago, RealAmericanHero said:

If these allegations against Iowa & Michigan are true and verifiable, then the schools in question should suffer serious consequences. Can't have this type of thing.

I am not a fan of the portal, think it is good for individuals but bad for the sport, but if are going to have a portal then I don't think it's productive to have rules about talking about it. 

I get that this behavior is gross, but if portals and NIL are real I don't know why people shouldnt be allowed to talk as if they are real....

If you are not on scholarship, can you transfer without penalty?

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9 hours ago, BAC said:

One of the less-selfish reasons that the NCAA was so strongly opposed to NIL was that it would lead to an avalanche of schools circumventing bribery rules by having school proxies contact students.  It was much easier to police when a kid suddenly drove into school in a Porsche.  But these days, its going to be the norm that top athletes are pulling in the money, and it won't be a violation just because it was siphoned to them by boosters of a given school.  The question is now whether the booster was acting in coordination with the school, which will be extremely hard to prove. 

This is the brave new world of NIL.  Every major program is going to be at risk, as major programs tend to have major boosters with money, who will be sorely tempted use that $1 million they were going to donate for a new gym to instead fund sketchy licensing deals.  Its early, and a lot of these boosters will fail to create the necessary separateness of their activities and will get their schools in trouble. 

But make no mistake, this will soon be set up in a more sophisticated way, sort of like PACs in politics that create a fiction of separateness from a candidate to keep it legal, even though everyone knows they're acting in lockstep.  We'll see lots of boosters suddenly forming or funding shadowy NIL licensing companies who throw above-market numbers at recruits to lure them in.  A few have already formed and others are strongly suspected of being shills for particular schools.  This will get much, much worse before it gets better.

Is that correct? I thought NIL deals were administered by the athletic departments, with disclosure requirements to the NCAA and/or conference. I thought undisclosed p2p deals were straight up violations.

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7 minutes ago, Better Call Stall said:

Is that correct? I thought NIL deals were administered by the athletic departments, with disclosure requirements to the NCAA and/or conference. I thought undisclosed p2p deals were straight up violations.

I believe they have to be approved by the school but not administered by. Could be kind of a distinction without a difference.

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10 hours ago, hammerlockthree said:

I am not a fan of the portal, think it is good for individuals but bad for the sport, but if are going to have a portal then I don't think it's productive to have rules about talking about it. 

I get that this behavior is gross, but if portals and NIL are real I don't know why people shouldnt be allowed to talk as if they are real....

If you are not on scholarship, can you transfer without penalty?

As far as not on scholarship.. pretty much

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Actually tbar is saying golden boy Carl is above this free agent marketplace. Good luck holding that position. 
 

RIP small programs. They are all coming for your top wrestlers and will do it any time, any place. 

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17 hours ago, moodybooty said:

I’d love to hear how the athletes feel about all of this.

what if you’re only recruited by a George Washington or Clarion, but you’ve wanted to go to Michigan or Stanford this whole time? You make do with what you’re given, make some noise, and now have the attention you were looking for coming out of HS. Isn’t that fair? Would you tell a kid at a local public high school that’s offered a full scholarship at a prestigious boarding school or Catholic school nearby that they shouldn’t go because of loyalty? Would you tell a MiLB player that they shouldn’t take a Major League deal with a different MLB team because of loyalty? 

College athletics was always a business — NIL dealings did nothing but standardize it. These aren’t nebulous concepts; these are real young adults trying to set themselves up for a solid life after college and have a good time while doing it. I don’t know about y’all, but if I gotta spend half the year cutting weight and working out twice a day, I’d want it to be as comfortable as possible.

Good points but I don’t see the long term impact being positive for wrestling. 

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Starting to look like the business world. Individuals working their way through their industry, carefully making career moves any way they can.

Top employers attracting talent any way they can including poaching talent. Once you’re a top employer, the momentum makes it easier than your competitors for a very long time.

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18 hours ago, VakAttack said:

Bentley's thoughts about the health and welfare of the sport move me quite a bit.  I don't want to keep bleeding off schools.

But I also have some internalized problems with the inherent non-capitalistic thought processes that amateur sports almost requires for it's existence.  In a capitalist society, you should be able to make whatever your worth, and you are worth what somebody is willing to pay for your services.

I also love the sport of wrestling and want to see it survive and thrive.  Tough moral conundrum.

100% agreed.  Well stated as always.

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This is the first time I've heard of this, but the first guys that came to mind for me were Tom Brands and Cael Sanderson. Cael has "poached" at least a couple good wrestlers over the years, I immediately thought of Hildebrandt and Max Dean. Tom Brands poached half of VT's squad when he took the Iowa job. I'm not saying either of those guys is guilty, but they are the first guys I thought of. 

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18 hours ago, ionel said:

Kaffee: Then how did you find the mess hall if it wasn't in this book?

Bormet: Well, sir, like everybody else, I just followed the crowd at chow time, sir.

Or the Blagojevich “everybody does it” argument.

If everybody’s doing it… There’s a lot of guys doing it.
-Vincent Lauria

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11 minutes ago, Hufarted said:

This is the first time I've heard of this, but the first guys that came to mind for me were Tom Brands and Cael Sanderson. Cael has "poached" at least a couple good wrestlers over the years, I immediately thought of Hildebrandt and Max Dean. Tom Brands poached half of VT's squad when he took the Iowa job. I'm not saying either of those guys is guilty, but they are the first guys I thought of. 

Dean and Hildebrandt I don't think can be considered poaching.  His heavyweight, though...

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3 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie v2 said:

Dean and Hildebrandt I don't think can be considered poaching.  His heavyweight, though...

Well I don't really consider those "poaching" all that much. From what I understand Dean was angry he was forced to sit out due to COVID, and who can blame Hildebrandt for transferring from a MAC school to a Big 10 program? What's the rub on Kerkvliet....how did Cael poach him, I haven't heard this one. 

Tom Brands on the other hand...oh yeah, I'd believe he was poaching. 

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8 hours ago, Mizzoufan01 said:

Same with Eierman. Announcing he was leaving Mizzou, next day he’s a Hawkeye. 

I never liked Eierman after that. I don't like guys with a mercenary disposition. I was pleased he crapped out in the 2nd round of NCAAs this year, frankly. Karma. 

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2 hours ago, scribe said:

Actually tbar is saying golden boy Carl is above this free agent marketplace. Good luck holding that position. 
 

RIP small programs. They are all coming for your top wrestlers and will do it any time, any place. 

Oh I know. I was attempting to be.. I think the word is nice 

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1 hour ago, Hufarted said:

Well I don't really consider those "poaching" all that much. From what I understand Dean was angry he was forced to sit out due to COVID, and who can blame Hildebrandt for transferring from a MAC school to a Big 10 program? What's the rub on Kerkvliet....how did Cael poach him, I haven't heard this one. 

by poaching Kyle Snyder first

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19 hours ago, VakAttack said:

Bentley's thoughts about the health and welfare of the sport move me quite a bit.  I don't want to keep bleeding off schools.

But I also have some internalized problems with the inherent non-capitalistic thought processes that amateur sports almost requires for it's existence.  In a capitalist society, you should be able to make whatever your worth, and you are worth what somebody is willing to pay for your services.

I also love the sport of wrestling and want to see it survive and thrive.  Tough moral conundrum.

My issue is that I don’t get why people don’t understand that “pure” capitalism isn’t going to be the best answer in every case. Especially on the macro scale. I’m not talking about adopting communism. I’m talking about this weird idea pure capitalism should be applied everywhere 

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4 minutes ago, jp157 said:

My issue is that I don’t get why people don’t understand that “pure” capitalism isn’t going to be the best answer in every case. Especially on the macro scale. I’m not talking about adopting communism. I’m talking about this weird idea pure capitalism should be applied everywhere 

Exactly.  Almost all segments of our society require some "rules"... traffic laws, criminal laws, regulations on professions, doctors, engineers, lawyers, etc, etc, in order to function optimally.  Why are regulations on economics so opposed?  Unless you are one of the very few that benefit from no regulations?

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2 minutes ago, jp157 said:

My issue is that I don’t get why people don’t understand that “pure” capitalism isn’t going to be the best answer in every case. Especially on the macro scale. I’m not talking about adopting communism. I’m talking about this weird idea pure capitalism should be applied everywhere 

Most people are wildly ignorant on communism, socialism, and capitalism. Especially ignorant people use words like "socialist" as a pejorative while having no idea what the word actually means. 

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