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Yianni to MMA?

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2 hours ago, Billyhoyle said:

 

These are great questions. I don’t know the answers, but I’m pretty sure between RTC income, endorsements, medal bonuses, clinic fees, side businesses, Dake and Taylor are doing very well for themselves. Metcalf too.  I consider Pico to have been at the level of Dake/Taylor and better than Metcalf.

 

In MMA, athletes have to assume the costs of their training and health insurance. That is a huge drain and why the money is really in being like a Jones, Cormier, Masvidal, McGregor where you can draw PPV buys. 
 

For somebody like Nickal, who wouldn’t have made a world team for years, or Cormier/Askren, who had already gone as far as they would have in wrestling, the decision to switch is low risk (other than health). Pico left a lot on the table when he moved though, and at this point somebody like Yianni, who has an extremely high ceiling in wrestling, should view it as a cautionary tale. I think Pico was a better MMA prospect than Yianni. 

I won't deny that Pico showed potential at times...but his actual on-the-mat results do not put him within a country mile of the Dake/Taylor level.

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32 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Yeah if the debate is about “when” Pico went to MMA, I can get on board with the argument that he probably didn’t have to do it so early.

If the debate is he could have made similar money without ever going to MMA, I’m not sure I buy that.  I’d guess Burroughs is the only full-time wrestler making close to what Pico makes (maybe more).  So basically the bar is set at being possibly the greatest US wrestler of all time in order to make as much money as Pico is making being above average in the minor leagues of MMA.

Dake (and probably Snyder) may be doing “very well for themselves,” but I doubt making as much as Pico.  Taylor may be but his club is probably what puts him ahead.  Metcalf is a college coach but I doubt makes as much as Pico.

I’m sure Yianni will coach once he’s done competing, so will probably have a comfortable career.  But even Askren (without his wrestling club) probably made more money than even Burroughs by being a champion in the minor leagues without being very successful in the UFC.

 

I think we are getting closer to agreeing.  I think Dake/Taylor make more than Pico currently does though and probably significantly more given all the costs associated with training that Pico has to pay for.  MMA as a career has a potential to make way more than you can in amateur wrestling, but it's far from guaranteed, even for the most promising prospects.  

7 minutes ago, EM_1996 said:

I won't deny that Pico showed potential at times...but his actual on-the-mat results do not put him within a country mile of the Dake/Taylor level.

Pico was a runner up at the OTT at age 19...That is far beyond where Dake and Taylor were at the same age. The only recent athletes better at that age were Cejudo, Snyder, and Gable. Molinaro even ended up taking 5th at the olympics that year, and Pico  almost beat him in the 2/3. He also had a junior world silver losing to Yazdani. Sometimes we forget how good Pico was, but he really was exceptionally talented at wrestling and was supposedly a great striker as well.  We were all sure that he'd be a UFC champion by this point, which would have validated the move financially without question.  That's why i made the point before that I hope the move to MMA so soon was driven by his own passion for the sport and not pressure from his sponsors to cash in on their investment.  

Edited by Billyhoyle

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23 minutes ago, Billyhoyle said:

I think we are getting closer to agreeing.  I think Dake/Taylor make more than Pico currently does though and probably significantly more given all the costs associated with training that Pico has to pay for.  MMA as a career has a potential to make way more than you can in amateur wrestling, but it's far from guaranteed, even for the most promising prospects.  

 

I guess we’re both just speculating but I don’t see any way Dake currently makes more than Pico.  Are we sure Pico has to pay for training costs?  I’d think a guy who signs a “long-term contract” wouldn’t have to pay for his own training but I’m no MMA expert. 
 

I think along the same lines of saying guys could still do MMA after wrestling post-college, you could probably argue if guys try MMA and fail, while they may not be able to go back to competing in wrestling, they could most likely still go back to coaching, which is where most of the long-term income in wrestling comes from anyway.

 

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17 hours ago, 1032004 said:

I guess we’re both just speculating but I don’t see any way Dake currently makes more than Pico.  Are we sure Pico has to pay for training costs?  I’d think a guy who signs a “long-term contract” wouldn’t have to pay for his own training but I’m no MMA expert. 
 

I think along the same lines of saying guys could still do MMA after wrestling post-college, you could probably argue if guys try MMA and fail, while they may not be able to go back to competing in wrestling, they could most likely still go back to coaching, which is where most of the long-term income in wrestling comes from anyway.

 

Your mma coach (some have specific striking, bjj, and wrestling coaches) takes a % of your fight purse.  If you have a manager, they are taking % of the same purse and any endorsement $.  Fighters also have to pay nutritionists and S/C coach.

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It's true that Pico is on a six fight winning street but those fights have been against guys whose records were 7-6, 9-5, 14-10, 10-6, 12-1 and 9-2.
Although the last two guys had good records, all of their fights but two had been in lower-promotions. Clearly Bellator sees Pico as a star in the
making, but 13 fights into his career, he is still not fighting high-level opponents.

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On 4/20/2022 at 6:32 PM, 1032004 said:

I guess we’re both just speculating but I don’t see any way Dake currently makes more than Pico.  Are we sure Pico has to pay for training costs?  I’d think a guy who signs a “long-term contract” wouldn’t have to pay for his own training but I’m no MMA expert. 
 

I think along the same lines of saying guys could still do MMA after wrestling post-college, you could probably argue if guys try MMA and fail, while they may not be able to go back to competing in wrestling, they could most likely still go back to coaching, which is where most of the long-term income in wrestling comes from anyway.

 

MMA standards for purses are 20% for agents and corner people/coaches also get about 20%.  The promotion pays for travel during competition week.  At this point, I doubt he employs sparring partners and an entourage for training camps, so that is about it for expenses.  Maybe a nutritionist as well.

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On 4/12/2022 at 3:58 PM, spladle08 said:

I wouldn't say Nickal was no, I would say he is an elite level grappler at a heavier weight where the skill-set is less prominent, so he has a little more of a ceiling than I'd give a Bryce Meredith....   but......
I hold the same idea that "When being fed cans (fighters who are underdogs against almost everyone they face) D1 AA caliber wrestlers are going to win 90+% of the time" 

Looks like Nickal is done with the cans?

 

 

 

 

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Looks like Nickal is done with the cans?
 
 
 
 
I'd assume he gets fed a lesser opponent on fight-pass . Gotta build him up before throwing him to the savages. Def tougher competition though, excited to see how he does in the UFC

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12 hours ago, Plasmodium said:

Let's not get ahead of ourselves.  He is years from a competitive fight.

Cormier put in 2 years and 3 months of bum fights before he made it to the UFC. He had 7 fights prior to making it to the big leagues. I'd guess Nickal would have the same timeframe. 

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On 5/4/2022 at 6:12 AM, TheHeel said:

Cormier put in 2 years and 3 months of bum fights before he made it to the UFC. He had 7 fights prior to making it to the big leagues. I'd guess Nickal would have the same timeframe. 

Times have changed.  Bo gets only 1.5 years of bum fights before they move him to the regular UFC card.

Edited by ShakaAloha

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Looks like Nickal is done with the cans?
 
 
 
 
Had to come back and say.... Naw ..... Going full can crusher


As for his opponent, Noland, who has also gone by the name John Conner, is 36 years old and based out of Alabama. He has a 6-3 record as an amateur, but has lost three of his most recent four outings. Three of his six amateur wins have come inside the distance with two submissions and one stoppage due to strikes.

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Brock Lesnar deserves some credit. He had fought 1 time prior to fighting in the UFC, and his first UFC bout was a former HW champion (Frank Mir). He fought ranked fighters right from the start, and won the UFC HW title in only his fourth professional fight.

It was a different era, sure, and fighters are more skilled and well-rounded today. But Lesnar took the tough road to the top. You'll almost certainly never see an MMA fighter repeat what Brock Lesnar did.

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1 hour ago, wrestleFan12 said:

Brock Lesnar deserves some credit. He had fought 1 time prior to fighting in the UFC, and his first UFC bout was a former HW champion (Frank Mir). He fought ranked fighters right from the start, and won the UFC HW title in only his fourth professional fight.

It was a different era, sure, and fighters are more skilled and well-rounded today. But Lesnar took the tough road to the top. You'll almost certainly never see an MMA fighter repeat what Brock Lesnar did.

I dunno. Michael Spinks won the heavyweight title in his 7th pro fight. Rare, but possible. Of course, he fought a lot as an amateur.

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