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Two out of three format.

Session I - June 8th, 2pm ET.
Session II - June 8th, 6pm ET.

77 kg GR - Kamal Bey vs. Britton Holmes
72 kg WFS - Skylar Grote vs. Amit Elor
65 kg MFS - Yianni Diakomihalis vs. Evan Henderson
87 kg GR - Alan Vera vs. Timothy Young
125 kg MFS - Hayden Zillmer vs. Nick Gwiazdowski
67 kg GR - Alejandro Sancho vs. Alston Nutter
53 kg WFS - Felicity Taylor vs. Dom Parrish
60 kg GR - Dalton Roberts vs. Ildar Hafizov
97 kg GR - G'Angelo Hancock vs. Braxton Amos
50 kg WFS - Sarah Hildebrandt vs. Alyssa Lampe
74 kg MFS - Kyle Dake vs. Jason Nolf
57 kg WFS - Helen Maroulis vs. Alex Hedrick
79kg MFS - Jordan Burroughs vs. Chance Marsteller
86kg MFS - David Taylor vs. Zahid Valencia

62 kg WFS Kayla Miracle vs. Jennifer Rogers has been postponed.


Challenge Matches June 8th, 12:30 ET

GR 97 kg - Hadyn Maley vs. Luke Sheridan
WFS 55 kg - Lauren Mason vs. Alisha Howk
FS 61 kg - Daniel DeShazer vs. Nico Megaludis
WFS 57 kg  Cameron Guerin vs. Amanda Martinez
FS 79 kg - Vincenzo Joseph vs. Carter Starocci (Word is that Joseph isn't going to wrestle.)
WFS 62 kg - Macey Kilty vs. vs. Alexandria Liles
FS 86 kg - Mark Hall vs. Trent Hidlay
WFS 65 kg - Emma Bruntil vs. Maya Letona
FS 92 kg - Isaac Trumble vs. Jonathan Aiello

Edited by Mphillips

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It appears I am not going to bed until ~2:00 AM US-Eastern.
I expect ~6 of the series to go to the third match.
Why isn't Joseph wrestling?

I still just can’t believe they didn’t schedule this one for a Friday too

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My predictions:

72 kg WFS - Skylar Grote vs. Amit Elor  -  Elor in 2 by techs
53 kg WFS - Felicity Taylor vs. Dom Parrish  -  Parrish in 2 by techs
50 kg WFS - Sarah Hildebrandt vs. Alyssa Lampe  -  Hildebrandt in 2 by decisions
57 kg WFS - Helen Maroulis vs. Alex Hedrick  -  Maroulis in 2 by techs


Challenge:
WFS 55 kg - Lauren Mason vs. Alisha Howk  -  Mason by tech
WFS 57 kg  Cameron Guerin vs. Amanda Martinez  -  Guerin by tech
WFS 62 kg - Macey Kilty vs. vs. Alexandria Liles  -  Liles by VFO (Kilty is injured)
WFS 65 kg - Emma Bruntil vs. Maya Letona  -  Bruntil by tech




 

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I have some former wrestlers i coached in high school competing in this and one of them texted me tonight that Final X is postponed. I didnt hear back about whether or not it is this athlete's series or if the entire event is postponed. Anybody else hear about this rumor?  Im glad i didnt fly in if true. 

Edited by Garrett Lane

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4 hours ago, ugarte said:

are the challenge matches true third or something else? i wasn't planning on getting to MSG until 2 but i'll probably watch some of the early session on my phone.

Yes - challenge matches are for true third and a spot on the national team. 

You should check when doors open - in Stillwater, the true third matches took place 30 minutes before they allowed fans in the building. 

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7 hours ago, ugarte said:

are the challenge matches true third or something else? i wasn't planning on getting to MSG until 2 but i'll probably watch some of the early session on my phone.

Challenge matches are for true third.  Not only for national team placing, but (at least at 92kg) for determining if the winner of said match can take the U23 spot if qualified by age.

Flo says the challenge matches start at 12:30.

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One thing that bothers me about this WTT cycle is that due to the US Open winner getting the WTT #1 seed and that there will only be a true third match where there was a returning world medalist, it means that you don't always get the top three in the national team.

Women's 53kg:
#3 seed Parrish meets #2 seed Heaton in the semis
#1 seed Taylor never faces Heaton

National team ranking is screwed up out of a desire to see US Open participation.

 

Edited by Mike Parrish

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5 minutes ago, Mike Parrish said:

One thing that bothers me about this WTT cycle is that due to the US Open winner getting the WTT #1 seed and that there will only be a true third match where there was a returning world medalist, it means that you don't always get the top three in the national team.

Women's 53kg:
#3 seed Parrish meets #2 seed Heaton in the semis
#1 seed Taylor never faces Heaton

National team ranking is screwed up out of a desire to see US Open participation.

 

Was the open not available to all or the seeding criteria not published beforehand?

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8 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

Was the open not available to all or the seeding criteria not published beforehand?

That's not the point I am making and I think you know it.
The seeding criteria should force the best ordering of the National Team; it currently doesn't.

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7 minutes ago, Mike Parrish said:

That's not the point I am making and I think you know it.
The seeding criteria should force the best ordering of the National Team; it currently doesn't.

I understand your point.   However, Felicity Taylor earned her seed and those that didn't participate...............

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5 minutes ago, Plasmodium said:

I understand your point.   However, Felicity Taylor earned her seed and those that didn't participate...............

For the record, Heaton did participate, but she was up at 55s.
Parrish was off to Pan Ams wrestling for Team USA............... 


I'm not critiquing Felicity Taylor.
I'm critiquing the seeding process for not enforcing the best national team ordering.
For example, why are there true third matches only in weights where there is a 'returning medalist' waiting in Final X?
Why isn't there a true second|third match for those athletes who haven't faced each other, regardless of 'returning medalist' status?

Edited by Mike Parrish

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I don't understand the complaint. Of course a true third match is only needed when there is someone sitting in Final X. In the other weights, "true third" is determined by who placed third in the trials. The only reason third place matters is to decide who is on the national team. It seems like you're actually arguing for true second in weights with no world medalist and have no problem with true third. (edited to add: any true 2nd match would have to wait until some time after Final X since the necessity of the match wouldn't be known until after the world team member was determined).

How much of a difference does it make whether you're 2nd or 3rd on the national team? Is there a significant financial difference, or is it more about competition opportunities?

Regarding the seeding situation, I think the only wrestlers with a real gripe are those who wrestled in the Pan Ams and thus had no chance to earn the top seed at the trials. Everyone else faced the exact same situation and had the chance to earn the top seed.

Edited by IronChef

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5 minutes ago, IronChef said:

I don't understand the complaint. Of course a true third match is only needed when there is someone sitting in Final X. In the other weights, "true third" is determined by who placed third in the trials. The only reason third place matters is to decide who is on the national team. It seems like you're actually arguing for true second in weights with no world medalist and have no problem with true third. 

How much of a difference does it make whether you're 2nd or 3rd on the national team? Is there a significant financial difference, or is it more about competition opportunities?

Regarding the seeding situation, I think the only wrestlers with a real gripe are those who wrestled in the Pan Ams and thus had no chance to earn the top seed at the trials. Everyone else faced the exact same situation and had the chance to earn the top seed.

True seconds and true thirds.

I'm in favor of seeding that gives you the best 3 in order.
I don't think that USAW should be warping what 'seeding' is meant to do to encourage specific tournament participation.

There is a difference in compensation for 2nd v 3rd on the national team from both USAW and from club stipends.
There is a difference in terms of international event participation, since they usually offer the spot 1-2-3 down the National team places.

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16 hours ago, Mike Parrish said:

My predictions:

72 kg WFS - Skylar Grote vs. Amit Elor  -  Elor in 2 by techs
53 kg WFS - Felicity Taylor vs. Dom Parrish  -  Parrish in 2 by techs
50 kg WFS - Sarah Hildebrandt vs. Alyssa Lampe  -  Hildebrandt in 2 by decisions
57 kg WFS - Helen Maroulis vs. Alex Hedrick  -  Maroulis in 2 by techs


Challenge:
WFS 55 kg - Lauren Mason vs. Alisha Howk  -  Mason by tech
WFS 57 kg  Cameron Guerin vs. Amanda Martinez  -  Guerin by tech
WFS 62 kg - Macey Kilty vs. vs. Alexandria Liles  -  Liles by VFO (Kilty is injured)
WFS 65 kg - Emma Bruntil vs. Maya Letona  -  Bruntil by tech
 

Your Amit over Grote in techs is an interesting prediction - I thought it was one of the more compelling matchups among the women. Grote seems to be progressing well in the last year, but Elor is an obvious phenom. Parrish winning with such dominance also seems surprising to me. You obviously know the field better than I do, which makes me curious about an extended analysis - And it's totally cool if the Parrish pick is, well, yours for your own reasons!

Hildebrandt - Lampe looks like the closest matchup on Wednesday. 

I can't imagine Hedrick slowing down Maroulis. Hedrick looked stingy at the challenge tournament, but Maroulis is so freaking versatile. 

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26 minutes ago, denger said:

Your Amit over Grote in techs is an interesting prediction - I thought it was one of the more compelling matchups among the women. Grote seems to be progressing well in the last year, but Elor is an obvious phenom.

Elor is a technician, albeit a young one.
Grote is not.
Grote not going be able to muscle Elor and that'll be the deciding factor.

 

Quote

Parrish winning with such dominance also seems surprising to me. You obviously know the field better than I do, which makes me curious about an extended analysis - And it's totally cool if the Parrish pick is, well, yours for your own reasons!

I admit some small bias here...
However, Dom just took out the UWW ranked #5(Valverde(ECU) Olympian) and #7(Stewart(CAN) 3rd at worlds(Oslo)) at Pan Ams.

Not a knock on Taylor who is having a good college run, but this is a different level and we got to see that close up with Dom's 10 matches against Winchester over the years.
Additionally, Taylor's international experience is thin and the competition is a couple of levels above US women collegiate wrestlers.
Someone will inevitably point to the US Open win, but the 53kg bracket was really weak. Villeascusa got hurt(I suspect Areana would have beaten Taylor), Heaton was up at 55s, and Parrish was getting ready to go to Pan Ams. No Fearnside either.
 

Quote

Hildebrandt - Lampe looks like the closest matchup on Wednesday. 

I agree.
I watched Lampe shock Chun at the US Open, oh so many years ago with a headlock from left field.
I wouldn't count Lampe out, it's just that Hildebrandt is a wrestling tree chipper right now.

 

Quote

I can't imagine Hedrick slowing down Maroulis. Hedrick looked stingy at the challenge tournament, but Maroulis is so freaking versatile. 

Not a knock on Hedrick (who I know personally) but, with Maroulis apparently fully recovered, the only question is 'does it make it to the second period?'

Edited by Mike Parrish

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5 hours ago, Mike Parrish said:

For the record, Heaton did participate, but she was up at 55s.
Parrish was off to Pan Ams wrestling for Team USA............... 


I'm not critiquing Felicity Taylor.
I'm critiquing the seeding process for not enforcing the best national team ordering.
For example, why are there true third matches only in weights where there is a 'returning medalist' waiting in Final X?
Why isn't there a true second|third match for those athletes who haven't faced each other, regardless of 'returning medalist' status?

There is no issue at 53.  Heaton is the only one effected and she explicitly chose not to try and earn the 1 seed.  The seeding worked great.  

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