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The_Education

there is no Dake-Burroughs rivalry

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Sure Dake had one of the best NCAA careers in the modern era, possibly second only behind Cael. But that doesn't mean he's on the same level as Burroughs. He's not.

 

Burroughs truly excels from neutral, which is not Dake's strongest point. Dake was better than 99% of D1 wrestlers from neutral last season, but in the ulta-elite world of international wrestling, that doesn't mean a whole lot. Cael, for example, was untouchable in NCAA wrestling, but was never clearly better than Sajidov or Romero.

 

Typically, Burroughs beats guys even if he drops a period or gives up one or two takedowns. This happened against Ukraine, Venezuela, Japan, etc. He'll give up a takedown here or there, but he'll always get more takedowns, and he'll do it when he needs to.

 

Now let's turn to the Dake-Burroughs matches. Burroughs teched Dake in their first match, getting three unanswered takedowns and a turn. That wasn't close. Dake may have thought he could be a counter wrestler against Burroughs, before realizing Burroughs's takedowns are too quick, powerful, efficient, and well-timed to be countered.

 

In the second match, Dake caught Burroughs with a 3-point move when Burroughs was trying to avoid a 1-point pushout. Dake also got a pushout on a scramble situation after a Burroughs takedown, and Dake took Burroughs down once, as have a lot of other wrestlers. In the process, Dake tried a few gimmicks like wrestling from a knee, getting real low, and going chest-to-chest. You don't see Goudarzi or Tsargush resorting to gimmicks against Burroughs. They wrestled Burroughs like they wrestle everyone else.

 

In contrast, it was business as usual for Burroughs. Burroughs scored by getting in deep on a shot and pushing Dake out; turning Dake once; and taking Dake down three times, the last being in the first 5 seconds of OT. If you're counting, in two matches, that's six takedowns to one.

 

There is no rivalry. Burroughs is on a different level.

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Guest Hammerlock3

This topic should be called, "I don't like Dake and like to pretend he sucks whenever possible"

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This topic should be called, "I don't like Dake and like to pretend he sucks whenever possible"

 

Two things.

 

(1) I explained why there is no rivalry. If you think there is, explain to me why you think that. I really don't see it.

 

(2) I have nothing against Dake. He's an extremely good wrestler and a great competitor. I even said he has had one of the best NCAA careers in the modern era, possibly second only behind Cael. I also said that even though neutral is not Dake's strongest point, he was still better at it than 99% of D1 wrestlers. I'm not sure what part of that equals "sucking" to you.

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Clearly Dake is the better athlete, the only reason Burroughs won was because Dake wrestled 3 matches prior. Nobody argues that Dake will eventually overtake Jordan and this takes nothing away from Burroughs, just telling it likei it is.

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Guest Hammerlock3

#1 No thinking person thinks there is a legit rivalry. If your one of the drones who gets there news from themat homepage, your ignorance speaks for itself.

 

#2 WOW you admitted Dake had a great career! You and everyone else on the forum is out on that limb.

 

Your topic is useless

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The last match between Dake and JB went to OT. Dake graduated college a month ago. Burroughs is better than Dake, Burroughs is the best wrestler in the world. But if you think that Dake isn't going to cause a lot of problems for JB you are just oblivious.

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#1 No thinking person thinks there is a legit rivalry. If your one of the drones who gets there news from themat homepage, your ignorance speaks for itself.

 

#2 WOW you admitted Dake had a great career! You and everyone else on the forum is out on that limb.

 

Your topic is useless

 

Well thanks for posting on my thread twice to agree with me. :D

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Totally agree with the OP. I also don't believe the officials, or FILA will allow Dake to wrestle from his knees, and will be prepared to call it correctly as passivity in the future.

 

------

 

Any idea how refs would handle Robles' style, were he to attempt FS?

 

Do FS rules require the wrestler to not be down on mat when in neutral? Or is it not specified?

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I think we've all seen when it really matters, JB goes to an astronomical level.

 

The question is when will JB lose a step and will it be in time for Dake/DT/Howe to take over? Or will Chance Marstellar or a grown Aaron Pico arrive by then? Joe Williams was unstoppable on the freestyle circuit within the US for a long time. Then guys started to figure him out. Or maybe he lost a step? Point is wrestlers like Dake, Taylor and Howe will start to solve the puzzle eventually. Don't pencil him into the Rio lineup just yet.

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Come on now. Joe Williams, on his BEST DAY was not Jordan Burroughs. No shame in that.

 

And did you really just infer that Marstellar and Pico were going to beat Dake? It's bad enough that Dake loses fantasy matches to every guy in college, now he's losing fantasy matches to HS freshman.

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Burroughs will eventually lose. I think Dake is closer than many of you give him credit. I agree, JB is the best at this point but wouldn't be surprised at all to see Dake beat him and possibly even Taylor or Howe.

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I am just surprised it took so many posts before someone pushed David Taylor into the discussion.

 

 

And I never cease to be amazed how you guys seem to simultaneously argue that Taylor will never best Dake but that Dake will certainly best Burroughs. You don't see any irony in this?

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Clearly Dake is the better athlete, the only reason Burroughs won was because Dake wrestled 3 matches prior. Nobody argues that Dake will eventually overtake Jordan and this takes nothing away from Burroughs, just telling it likei it is.

 

 

Really, this is what you gathered from those 2 matches. I'll argue Dake is neither a better athlete nor will overtake Burroughs. Gadarzi nor Tsargush have been able to do so, but Dake is about too. Moreover, Burroughs has what 1 1/2 years of FS underneath his belt and hasn't remotely hit his ceiling, he's ot a good turner yet, and managed to turn Dake several times. Think about that.

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I think the main point of the post was that the article being referenced was extremely biased towards Dake - it was...go read it if you haven't. I love the way Dake talk's for the most part..for example him saying "Im the best in the world". Great, that's all confidence and you need that - it's awesome. But in this article - the writer suggesting that he lost most likely because he had to wrestle 3 times and Burroughs didn't, and Dake himself flat out saying it, is just ridiculous and completely dismissive of how good Burroughs actually is. Here are some quotes that I just found ridiculous:

 

"I'm looking forward to wrestling him again when we're both fresh. That will be some pretty cool fireworks," Dake said. "I still think I would win, going in fresh. There's just such an advantage to be able to sit out."

 

"If he was to wrestle three matches and I was to wrestle three matches going in, it would have been a little bit different. It's speculation. I can't just say I would beat him. It's hard to say, but I am looking forward to wrestling him again." (Can't just say you would beat him?...but you just did - one quote ago).

 

The article was extremely over-hyping IMO. Also, Dake's remarks come off as nothing but excuses. I think this is probably the only time Dake has talked and I haven't liked it.

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I am just surprised it took so many posts before someone pushed David Taylor into the discussion.

 

 

And I never cease to be amazed how you guys seem to simultaneously argue that Taylor will never best Dake but that Dake will certainly best Burroughs. You don't see any irony in this?

 

It is ironic isnt it? So much bias towards Dake. In this case, it doesnt make any sense what so ever. JB and Dake are not close right now, and people who are just absolutely in love with Dake, tend to think otherwise. They think that JB has peaked and he is basically just going to lay there, while Dake trains his butt off and catches up with JB. Apparently JB isnt going to get better at all. Oh and somewhere in there matches, some morons came away with the opinion that Dake is more athletic than JB lmao. What rock do these people crawl from under? How is that even a conclusion you could possible make even in the slightest? Taylor haters on here will do anything to discredit Taylor as well.

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I think the main point of the post was that the article being referenced was extremely biased towards Dake - it was...go read it if you haven't. I love the way Dake talk's for the most part..for example him saying "Im the best in the world". Great, that's all confidence and you need that - it's awesome. But in this article - the writer suggesting that he lost most likely because he had to wrestle 3 times and Burroughs didn't, and Dake himself flat out saying it, is just ridiculous and completely dismissive of how good Burroughs actually is. Here are some quotes that I just found ridiculous:

 

"I'm looking forward to wrestling him again when we're both fresh. That will be some pretty cool fireworks," Dake said. "I still think I would win, going in fresh. There's just such an advantage to be able to sit out."

 

"If he was to wrestle three matches and I was to wrestle three matches going in, it would have been a little bit different. It's speculation. I can't just say I would beat him. It's hard to say, but I am looking forward to wrestling him again." (Can't just say you would beat him?...but you just did - one quote ago).

 

The article was extremely over-hyping IMO. Also, Dake's remarks come off as nothing but excuses. I think this is probably the only time Dake has talked and I haven't liked it.

 

Yeah this was cocky Dake at his best. I had a problem with those same quotes myself. It will get tossed aside as "confidence" and "good for the sport", as Dake can do no wrong apparently. If any other wrestler said those things, this place would be all over them. Imagine if Taylor said that about Dake lol. Omg I couldnt imagine the uproar on here.

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Burroughs needs guys like Dake, Taylor and Howe domestically to help push him towards the next level. Maybe one of them, probably Dake if anyone, surpasses him, but I'm not sure I would bet on it. One of these guys will eventually beat Burroughs and then we'll see how high BUrroughs pushes himself in response. It will be pretty awesome, I think.

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I think the main point of the post was that the article being referenced was extremely biased towards Dake - it was...go read it if you haven't. I love the way Dake talk's for the most part..for example him saying "Im the best in the world". Great, that's all confidence and you need that - it's awesome. But in this article - the writer suggesting that he lost most likely because he had to wrestle 3 times and Burroughs didn't, and Dake himself flat out saying it, is just ridiculous and completely dismissive of how good Burroughs actually is. Here are some quotes that I just found ridiculous:

 

"I'm looking forward to wrestling him again when we're both fresh. That will be some pretty cool fireworks," Dake said. "I still think I would win, going in fresh. There's just such an advantage to be able to sit out."

 

"If he was to wrestle three matches and I was to wrestle three matches going in, it would have been a little bit different. It's speculation. I can't just say I would beat him. It's hard to say, but I am looking forward to wrestling him again." (Can't just say you would beat him?...but you just did - one quote ago).

 

The article was extremely over-hyping IMO. Also, Dake's remarks come off as nothing but excuses. I think this is probably the only time Dake has talked and I haven't liked it.

 

Yeah this was cocky Dake at his best. I had a problem with those same quotes myself. It will get tossed aside as "confidence" and "good for the sport", as Dake can do no wrong apparently. If any other wrestler said those things, this place would be all over them. Imagine if Taylor said that about Dake lol. Omg I couldnt imagine the uproar on here.

 

Dake can do no wrong? What is the title of the thread? This is the uproar.

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I think the main point of the post was that the article being referenced was extremely biased towards Dake - it was...go read it if you haven't. I love the way Dake talk's for the most part..for example him saying "Im the best in the world". Great, that's all confidence and you need that - it's awesome. But in this article - the writer suggesting that he lost most likely because he had to wrestle 3 times and Burroughs didn't, and Dake himself flat out saying it, is just ridiculous and completely dismissive of how good Burroughs actually is. Here are some quotes that I just found ridiculous:

 

"I'm looking forward to wrestling him again when we're both fresh. That will be some pretty cool fireworks," Dake said. "I still think I would win, going in fresh. There's just such an advantage to be able to sit out."

 

"If he was to wrestle three matches and I was to wrestle three matches going in, it would have been a little bit different. It's speculation. I can't just say I would beat him. It's hard to say, but I am looking forward to wrestling him again." (Can't just say you would beat him?...but you just did - one quote ago).

 

The article was extremely over-hyping IMO. Also, Dake's remarks come off as nothing but excuses. I think this is probably the only time Dake has talked and I haven't liked it.

 

Yeah this was cocky Dake at his best. I had a problem with those same quotes myself. It will get tossed aside as "confidence" and "good for the sport", as Dake can do no wrong apparently. If any other wrestler said those things, this place would be all over them. Imagine if Taylor said that about Dake lol. Omg I couldnt imagine the uproar on here.

 

Dake can do no wrong? What is the title of the thread? This is the uproar.

 

Look at all the responses to back him on this thread and others. Who cares what the title says. The kid has a cult following on here.

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