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JerseyJoey

Cael, Askren, Burroughs, McIlravy, Gable have in common?

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gable is the best American wrestler in history how can you dispute that? he pinned his way thru the olympics call me the next time you do that

 

Actually, it was Ivan Yarygin who pinned his way through the Olympics in 1972, not Gable. Look it up.

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Gable's college record was 94-1 with 71 falls. Gable wrestled unattached his freshman year: he did not lose. In fact, he won the Midlands that year beating Don Behm and Masaaki Hatta, and was name the tournament's outstanding wrestler.

 

Burrough's record at Nebraska was 128-20, with 12 pins. He lost six matches as a sophmore, 13 as a freshman, and of course the medical default in what would have been his junior year.

 

Lee Kemp was 143-6-1; 47 pins. He lost five as a freshman, zero in his sophmore year, once as a junior, and was tied in his senior year.

 

Kemp was outstanding as a freestyler and Burrough is off to a great start. Gable, however, was clearly the more dominate wrestler of the three in college.

I don't understand why it is hard for you to see how dominate Gable was when he competed/ Burroughs had very few if any freestyle losses mostly because he was not wrestling in any senior level tournaments. As far as Gable's loss to Kemp it was up a weight after at least a 3 year lay off.

I don't understand why some non-official matches matter to you and others don't.

 

Gable's freshman matches were not official matches, yet you count them. Gable also had non-official folkstyle matches after college. Why not count those? Gable also had freestyle losses during college to Sanders, Huff, Hatta, and Douglas. Why not count those? Gable also lost to Kemp when Kemp was 18. Why not count that?

 

Also, Kemp's post-freshman-year loss was to a non-college athlete, thereby not making it an official college loss. Officially, Kemp was an undefeated, three-time NCAA champ. Why do you count his non-official loss while ignoring some of Gable's non-official results?

 

I think the only fair way to look at it is to only consider official college matches when looking at college careers. As far as official matches go, Kemp went undefeated from his sophomore year to senior year, while Gable lost once from his sophomore year to senior year.

 

Education you pick and chose you how you look at the facts as much as anyone else example Burroughs wrestled very few if any open tournaments while in college or he would of had a lot of losses his first four years of college in freestyle. As for Gable's loss to Kemp it was up a weight and after a 3 year lay off of competing not a excuse but a fact. Gable beat Keaser something like 23-0 a couple of straight times then next year Keaser wins Worlds and let the gold slip away in the 76 Olympics. Gable hung it up after two years because there was no way to make a living in the US as a wrestler. Gable is admired/ranked so how because of how he dominated his opponents.

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gable is the best American wrestler in history how can you dispute that? he pinned his way thru the olympics call me the next time you do that

 

Actually, it was Ivan Yarygin who pinned his way through the Olympics in 1972, not Gable. Look it up.

 

Gable didn't give up a point.

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gable is the best American wrestler in history how can you dispute that? he pinned his way thru the olympics call me the next time you do that

 

Actually, it was Ivan Yarygin who pinned his way through the Olympics in 1972, not Gable. Look it up.

 

Gable didn't give up a point.

Nor did he in the pre Olympic matches in Europe, or in the trials. There was an article (in SI ?) saying the achievement wasn't simply like a no hitter. It was like pitching multiple consecutive perfect games in a single World Series.

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Education you pick and chose you how you look at the facts as much as anyone else example Burroughs wrestled very few if any open tournaments while in college or he would of had a lot of losses his first four years of college in freestyle. As for Gable's loss to Kemp it was up a weight and after a 3 year lay off of competing not a excuse but a fact. Gable beat Keaser something like 23-0 a couple of straight times then next year Keaser wins Worlds and let the gold slip away in the 76 Olympics. Gable hung it up after two years because there was no way to make a living in the US as a wrestler. Gable is admired/ranked so how because of how he dominated his opponents.

 

Gable's a legend. In my own opinion, he belongs to a different era than Kemp and Burroughs, and it's not fair to compare eras. But in terms of accomplishments, you can look at them. Gable does not have more accomplishments than Kemp or Burroughs. That's my only point.

 

As for how Gable's freestyle career stacks up to Burroughs's, I think Burroughs definitely has the edge already for the following reasons:

 

1) Burroughs won a world title right after college. Gable did not make the team right after college.

 

2) Burroughs has not lost to anyone at home or abroad in over two years. He even beat a two-time world champ twice (Tsargush). Gable's post-college career was a little over two years. He lost to Bobby Douglas and didn't make the world team in 1970, and then he lost to a Russian in 1971 and tied a second Russian that same year. Further, Gable did not face anybody of Tsargush's caliber.

 

3) Starting with the 1970 world team trials -immediately following college - Gable needed three cracks at a world title in order to win two. Burroughs only needed to cracks at world titles to win two.

 

4) Gable wrestled in an era of ten weight classes and the Soviet Union. Burroughs wrestles in an era of only seven weight classes and the breakup of the Soviet Union, meaning there are now countries competing like: Russia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Georgia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Moldova, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, etc. As a result, Burroughs faced more competition than Gable did.

 

Again, Gable is a legend and he competed in a different era. If you want to say he's great and Burroughs is great, fine. But I don't buy the idea that his freestyle accomplishments are more impressive than Burroughs's.

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The_Ed:

 

Don't take this as a dis of Burroughs. I have seen nothing to suggest he isn't equal to Gable or Kemp or several others. But, he has not had the opportunity to compete in the same sport post college. The post 2004 changes so bastardized the rules that, in my mind, making comparison of results merely conjecture. We may never have "apples" to compare to "apples" as what seemed at first to be a return to sane rules now seems to have short circuited. Burroughs era is the outlier.

 

PS: Gable's weight class is still 6kg, just 2 kg lighter (60-66-74 vs 62-68-74). Are those tweeners that can't make 66kg really a challenge for Burroughs? How is dropping two bottom and an upper weight changing very much for others?

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Cael, Askren, Burroughs, McIlravy, Gable have in common?

 

Who are 5 people who have never been in my kitchen?

With your affection for Cael I am surprised he hasn't been over for Kendaltucky night when you cook your favorite roadkill.

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