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What do you guys think of this NCAA/Manziel situation

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Just wondering what you guys think of this Manziel accusation? Star athletes make huge amounts of money for their schools.

 

I relate this to our sport. If I recall, there's an upper weight wrestler at Minnesota who got in some type of trouble recently. I also think guys like Taylor and Dake have made some good money for their respective universities.

 

Personally, I think the NCAA bigwigs are a bunch of knuckleheads...

 

http://espn.go.com/college-football/sto ... h-signings

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The NCAA rule may be stupid, but Manziel was an idiot. He knew the rules and knew he would be suspended. And since he comes from a rich family he wasn't strapped for cash. So it really makes no sense unless he was trying to make a point. But if that's the case, he might as well come out and say so otherwise his statement is a fairly weak one. This situation makes him look pretty dumb, regardless of the merits of the NCAA rules. Now his team will suffer.

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The situation is pretty black and white to me. These guys are supposed to be amateur athletes, and if he accepted $$$ for a signing session, then by definition he forfeited his amateur status. Nobody would care about Manziel if he were playing in the CFL and not college football; if you want to play university athletics, then you better maintain your amateur status.

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i think it sucks there aren't more professional options for young players who aren't interested in going to classes, but thats not something the NCAA can fix.

 

there's certainly things the NCAA can do better, but if NCAA athletes are getting such a terrible deal than perhaps the athletes shouldn't take it?

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If he is worth more than his scholarship, in the free market, then he should go that direction. The reality is that a lot of these athletes are not worth more. Even most draft picks are paid based on speculation that is inflated well over their actual value. This is evident by the amount of NFL contracts that are guaranteed as well as an athlete's longevity in the league.

 

Without the institution, these programs wouldn't have the followings they have. It is the allegiance to the school, not the athlete, that leads to the college sports crazy. If it were the athletes, Manziel would be accepting a contract in the UFL.

 

Are take and Taylor making a killing for their schools? No. I doubt it. The teams, collectively, may be doing well and drawing but I don't think we should value it all on one athlete. Just as many people talk about Ruth as Taylor when it comes to Penn State fans. What we have learned from Iowa is that it is the program that the fans stay loyal to.

 

Penn State's wrestling expenses were reported to be $1,399,621 in 2011 with Cornell reporting $726,289. Do these athletes generate more than these outlays? Also, these expenses are surely underreported as they don't, often, include infrastructure and resources used by the program that are available to athletics or the student body at large.

 

Rather than going on and on, I will just say that I support the current system in the NCAA and do not support paying players

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Texas A&M is not the reason Johnny Manziel is making that much money. He makes the school millions, but he could make that money for any school. Not many athletes can bring this value to Texas A&M. It's just inherently ridiculous that he is forced to not be able to earn a living for 3 years essentially by NFL fiat, but he's also not allowed to use his own image and signature to make money. THe NCAA is a corrupt and morally bankrupts system as is.

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Texas A&M is not the reason Johnny Manziel is making that much money. He makes the school millions, but he could make that money for any school. Not many athletes can bring this value to Texas A&M. It's just inherently ridiculous that he is forced to not be able to earn a living for 3 years essentially by NFL fiat, but he's also not allowed to use his own image and signature to make money. THe NCAA is a corrupt and morally bankrupts system as is.

 

If he doesn't like what the NCAA offers he should go elsewhere. The NFL doesn't want him (yet) so he needs to look elsewhere. But I get the feeling the 50k a year scholarship and training is actually a good offer.

 

There is always the UFL or NAIA among other options. Again, I think you'll find he actually places a higher value on A&M and the NCAA.

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The issue of paying college athletes always generates heated discussions. I agree that the NCAA is morally corrupt, but I also think it's silly to pay players. That was never the intention of college athletics. So if you don't like it, don't go. 99 percent of athletes will never go pro, so that's not why they're there. So who do you decide to pay and how much? And how do you justify it to parents and students of non-athletes, many of whom are struggling to make financial ends meet to go to the school, that the school is now not only giving a full scholarship to an athlete with questionable academic credentials, but also going to pay them? Also, Manziel is a terrible example of a guy that needs to get paid. Everything has been going his way. He won the Heisman, and has the most recognizable name in college football. NFL teams are looking at him and he has a decent chance of going pro. The guys that need the money are the 2nd string guys that nobody has heard who come from poor families that can't afford the living expenses of college despite the free tuition scholarship. Meanwhile Johnny Football is from a wealthy family and not strapped for cash, yet is throwing his team under the bus by signing autographs for money he doesn't need? It's pretty dumb.

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Texas A&M is not the reason Johnny Manziel is making that much money. He makes the school millions, but he could make that money for any school. Not many athletes can bring this value to Texas A&M. It's just inherently ridiculous that he is forced to not be able to earn a living for 3 years essentially by NFL fiat, but he's also not allowed to use his own image and signature to make money. THe NCAA is a corrupt and morally bankrupts system as is.

 

If he doesn't like what the NCAA offers he should go elsewhere. The NFL doesn't want him (yet) so he needs to look elsewhere. But I get the feeling the 50k a year scholarship and training is actually a good offer.

 

There is always the UFL or NAIA among other options. Again, I think you'll find he actually places a higher value on A&M and the NCAA.

 

I'm sure several NFL TEAMS would want him, the governing organization has arbitrarily picked an age for him to be able to earn a living.

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Its a tough situation, but it all comes down to choices. The NCAA has their rules and part of it is because they're stupid and the other part is to ensure student-athletes get an education. They want every student-athlete to follow the same rules, regardless of their chances at a professional career. Schools choose to be a part of the NCAA (either because they choose it directly or because the conference they choose to be a part of requires it). Student-athletes choose to go to those schools and therefore must follow all the rules. I think that those athletes should follow the rules regardless of what they may be. I think those rules should be innovated to keep up with changing times.

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Plasmodium,

 

College athletes are allowed to make money off from camps, clinics, and any job as long as they get paid a standard rate or in other words, they don't get paid any more than someone would normally get paid for doing that job. When it comes to camps and clinics, its hard to actually say what is normal, so there is a lot more leeway. (This is how it has been explained to me, I'm not an expert)

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In addition, his name can't be used in the title to promote the camp other than to say that he is a clinician. In other words, you can't have a a David Taylor Technique camp, but you can have a Technique Camp featuring David Taylor. Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong or if this has changed in the last 4-5 years.

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I had a supplier approach me with a kid still in college in the Title of a DVD. I was really surprised because I figured this supplier had already looked into the NCAA issues and the kid had good knowledge of what was allowed and what wasn't. I pushed back and said are you sure on this one. I don't want to get this kid in trouble. He then came back to me and said, don't sell that video. So people really don't understand the rules.

 

It might be that some of the major camps know what they are doing (or are the most conservative), but how I see the NCAA Champs, All Americans listed are just as Counselors.

 

But these one off camps that are run by wrestling clubs often times have the College wrestlers in the head lines. I think those camps are putting those kids at risk if someone really wanted to make trouble...at least based on my understanding of the rules...

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Just wondering what you guys think of this Manziel accusation? Star athletes make huge amounts of money for their schools.

 

 

I don't care how much money Manziel sells his autograph for. I think he should be allowed to sell his autograph 24 hours a day is some dopes want to buy it from him. Johnny just needs to understand that if/when he starts to sell his autograph that he is a pro athlete. The NCAA then has the right to tell him he is no longer eligible to play college football.

 

Look, the NCAA simply can't pay athletes. The minute you take a "big picture" view of this then you can see why paying athletes will not work.

 

The single biggest reason you can't pay athletes is that you would have non athletes footing that bill. Any payments made to an athlete come from the non athletes thru some combination of higher costs of tuition or ticket prices. Additionally, if you pay any athlete you are then running a professional sports league. Is this what your University wants to stand for? I don't think so.

 

Then you have Title 9 compliance. A large state school might compete in as many as 30 sports with 800 athletes. The entire athletic dept. would be paid for via football and, maybe, basketball, assuming the basketball team turns a profit. Big 10, SEC, ACC, PAC ...etc turn a profit via TV network money, but this funds all those lower sports like field hockey, gymnastics and swimming.

 

I saw where a California Congresswoman wants athletes to be paid $3,600 per month. Let's do this math. $3,600 x 12 months = $43,200. Multiple that by 800 athletes and you get to a budget expense for player salaries of $34.56 Million. How is a school like North Carolina State, Utah, or Georgia Tech going to come up with that kind of money? All the money they currently make goes to fund the lesser sports already, so how do you raise this new $34.56 million? A school that seats 80,000 for football would have to raise prices by $432 per seat per year, so either fans have to pony up more money or they have to raise tuition costs.

 

My kids don't play D1 sports, and I'll be damned if I want to pay higher tuition so Johnny Football can make $43K a year playing for my school. If he wants to be a pro athlete, let him be one. Find a pro league that wants you, Johnny. I don't want you. And the day my school starts paying you, I cease to be a fan. I can already watch pro football. Its called the NFL. I don't want my school to be in the pro athlete business, and I sure as hell won't pay for it.

 

As far as the NCAA and my school making money from licensing arrangements, I am not being forced to buy that stuff. Neither is anyone else. You don't want your school making money selling t-shirts or sweatpants, then don't buy them.

 

As for the athletes, if they don't like getting full tuition worth as much as 50K for 5 years, plus all meals worth a crap load of money over 5 years if we are talking athletic meals (steaks ...etc) adding up to $350K, then don't do it. Go play semi pro football, or CBA basketball. Then you can market yourself all you want. You might end up illiterate, but you can get yourself some money. Your choice. You don't like being an NCAA athlete, no one is forcing this on you. Stop crying.

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Per the age restriction: the NFL put that in place because, collectively, the risk of speculating on players before that age and development level was too costly. It would make the NFL more like baseball that routinely over pays for unproven players coming out of high school or foreigners that never add value to the organization. Basically, the teams have all agreed to pass on the rare exception of an athlete to ensure they don’t have to start a bidding war for unproven players that go bust. Remember, three years in the NFL is the average career. Most don’t last for more than one season.

 

Per the NCAA and A&M marketing his image, how else are they supposed to market the program without using the product on the field? He had agreed to be compensated with a scholarship. If he does not like the terms he can leave at any time and take an offer elsewhere.

 

Should only programs that turn a 'profit' be paying their athletes? Is that the issue that he is being ‘exploited’ because they bring in a lot of money? So, with that line of thinking, if he were to go to North Texas or McNease State it would be fine because they are not profitable programs?

 

So why did he pick Texas A&M? Because of the investment the school had made to the program before his arrival. He picked the school because the total package was what he was looking for. And while we hope it had something to do with the education, it very well could have been because it was the best option to develop his football. So has he now become greater than what was offered? Maybe he thinks so. So he should shop around for an offer outside of Texas A&M and the NCAA. Then he won’t feel exploited. And it will free up a spot for another hard working kid who just wants a shot and would love a scholarship.

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i think it sucks there aren't more professional options for young players who aren't interested in going to classes, but thats not something the NCAA can fix.

 

 

There are plenty of options, they just don't make money so you don't hear or read about them much. In football alone you have The Arena League, The Canadian Football League, The Professional Developmental Football League, The United Football League, The American Professional Football League, The Spring Professional Football League, The Professional Indoor Football League, and dozens of semi pro leagues. There is even a Women's Professional Football League.

 

I would bet good money that you wouldn't watch any of this crap if it were on your flat panel right now. I know I wouldn't. But the point is this. Johnny Football can join any of these leagues right now and sell his autograph or likeness all he wants. Not sure how much they'd pay him, since nobody buys tickets for these games or watches them on TV.

 

Athletes wanting schools to pay them is a stick up in my view. They would be stealing from the engineering, pre med and liberal arts students, all of whom are already on schedule to leave school with a MOUNTAIN of debt that these athletes will have none of, just so these athletes can take even more from the system.

 

No thanks. The day the NCAA goes pro, I am out. Done for good.

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i think it sucks there aren't more professional options for young players who aren't interested in going to classes, but thats not something the NCAA can fix.

 

 

There are plenty of options, they just don't make money so you don't hear or read about them much. In football alone you have The Arena League, The Canadian Football League, The Professional Developmental Football League, The United Football League, The American Professional Football League, The Spring Professional Football League, The Professional Indoor Football League, and dozens of semi pro leagues. There is even a Women's Professional Football League.

 

I would bet good money that you wouldn't watch any of this crap if it were on your flat panel right now. I know I wouldn't. But the point is this. Johnny Football can join any of these leagues right now and sell his autograph or likeness all he wants. Not sure how much they'd pay him, since nobody buys tickets for these games or watches them on TV.

 

Athletes wanting schools to pay them is a stick up in my view. They would be stealing from the engineering, pre med and liberal arts students, all of whom are already on schedule to leave school with a MOUNTAIN of debt that these athletes will have none of, just so these athletes can take even more from the system.

 

No thanks. The day the NCAA goes pro, I am out. Done for good.

 

I am friends with the ownership and front office (GM and DOO) of a highly successful program in one of these leagues. I can tell you he would not be happy with his offer to play.

 

I have learned that it is more about the allegiance of the fans to the school than about the athletes. The school's brand is what built these programs and make them generate so much money. Without the school's alumni and student body rallying these athletes would rarely be worth much. Just take a look at how many go pro afterwards and how much (or rather little) most of them make playing in different leagues. And we are talking the best of the best not your average SEC or Pac-12 starter.

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i think it sucks there aren't more professional options for young players who aren't interested in going to classes, but thats not something the NCAA can fix.

 

 

There are plenty of options, they just don't make money so you don't hear or read about them much. In football alone you have The Arena League, The Canadian Football League, The Professional Developmental Football League, The United Football League, The American Professional Football League, The Spring Professional Football League, The Professional Indoor Football League, and dozens of semi pro leagues. There is even a Women's Professional Football League.

 

I would bet good money that you wouldn't watch any of this crap if it were on your flat panel right now. I know I wouldn't. But the point is this. Johnny Football can join any of these leagues right now and sell his autograph or likeness all he wants. Not sure how much they'd pay him, since nobody buys tickets for these games or watches them on TV.

 

Athletes wanting schools to pay them is a stick up in my view. They would be stealing from the engineering, pre med and liberal arts students, all of whom are already on schedule to leave school with a MOUNTAIN of debt that these athletes will have none of, just so these athletes can take even more from the system.

 

No thanks. The day the NCAA goes pro, I am out. Done for good.

 

yeah i agree with you. probably should have said that it sucks that their aren't better and higher paying alternatives to the NFL. i think there is an opportunity there for more product in the marketplace. plenty of carriers and distributors need more content. youtube could take some google money and start a successful spring league and i think it would be a no brainer - as long as they didn't try to XFL it up like the utter morons at NBC (who also screwed up American Gladiators AND Ninja Warrior, because they incompetent).

 

but yeah, NCAA athletes that don't like the deal they are getting shouldn't take it. that part of it to me is pretty simple. or better yet, take a prep year after college, then get a free ride at a college as a redshirt, then quit your college team and work out and train for a summer and enter the supplemental draft. now you dont get exploited but rather take advantage of a school's facilities and give them zero production in return.

 

or go arena league or whatever. or just hit the weight room. bottom line is no one is forcing anyone to show up on campus.

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