World championships day 2

[MA_Wrestler 169]

Themat has an article with the first round draws for the US for tomorrow but doesn't have the entire bracket. Anyone have a link to full brackets for tomorrow? Thanks in advance

[sockobuw 49]

http://www.fila-official.com/sites/ultimate/index.php just updated

[MA_Wrestler 169]

I went to that page and don't see brackets anywhere. Sorry if I'm missing the obvious, but where on that home page are brackets?

[sockobuw 49]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

[sockobuw 49]

results choose from the weight in the drop down menu then. tomorrow weights weren't updated until the last few minutes.

[MA_Wrestler 169]

I figured it out. Thanks!

[bwh27 31]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

That's the bottom 1/8 (maybe that's what you mean), the bottom quarter also includes Salas (CUB) and Sokhiev. Ridiculous. The third quarter has Boke (TUR) and that's about it. Top two quarters have a few tough wrestlers each, but nothing compared to the bottom quarter.

 

Always hated how they bunch everyone together at the bottom instead of separating it out. You would have more balance overall in the bracket without that. Makes the bottom half almost inevitably tougher, and guys have to go through more tough matches. Such a no-brainer to change. On the plus side, the matches are more exciting, I sure as heck don't miss clinches.

 

Dlagnev should roll through his first two matches, then a quarterfinal against Iranian who he lost to three times, albeit usually very tight matches. He can win that match, but will be an underdog. Looks like Akgul is the most likely to come out of third quarter, and if Dlagnev beats him he'd potentially face Gatsalov or Kurbanov in the finals. Of course those two face each other in the first pigtail.

[sockobuw 49]

yes the bottom 1/8. I posted about separation criteria earlier today. it would not cure all, but it would be a place to start.

[armspin 257]

I just read your criteria, I loved it. You could also use i as a point system to determine seeding... every gold in the given time period is worth 3 pts, every medal is 2 and every "representation" is 1 or something like that. Highest point is highest seed and so on. Objective criteria is the key.

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

yeah i find the pigtail bunching to be bizarre. i mean, ok, you want randomized draws, i can live with that. but then why unrandomize the pigtails? all it does is increase the odds of an uneven bracket. so weird.

[sockobuw 49]

I just read your criteria, I loved it. You could also use i as a point system to determine seeding... every gold in the given time period is worth 3 pts, every medal is 2 and every "representation" is 1 or something like that. Highest point is highest seed and so on. Objective criteria is the key.

 

now we can patent our hybrid criteria/seeding system and pitch it to fila.

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

I just read your criteria, I loved it. You could also use i as a point system to determine seeding... every gold in the given time period is worth 3 pts, every medal is 2 and every "representation" is 1 or something like that. Highest point is highest seed and so on. Objective criteria is the key.

 

you could even include other tournaments during the year and then roll it all up into an objective, transparent ranking system and then use that for seeds!

 

ah well, we can always hope.

[armspin 257]

only concern with that is de-valuing guys who dont compete often, like the current FILA rankings. Yazdani for example wrestled only a wrestle off and this tournament You could argue he doesnt deserve a high seed then, but you are screwing over someone who DID deserve a high seed adn then draws a low-ranked Yazdani early.

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

only concern with that is de-valuing guys who dont compete often, like the current FILA rankings. Yazdani for example wrestled only a wrestle off and this tournament You could argue he doesnt deserve a high seed then, but you are screwing over someone who DID deserve a high seed adn then draws a low-ranked Yazdani early.

 

true. maybe you could make WC placement points deteriorate over time. so a gold is worth 10 the next year, then 9 then year after, then 8, etc. just adjust the values as needed. it'll never be perfect, but it would be better than nothing.

[SetonHallPirate 993]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

When you have 13 in the bottom quarter, and 8 in the other three quarters of the draw, of course the bottom quarter is going to have more talent. FILA may be accused of having rigged brackets, and those people are right, but it's not that they're trying to rig them, it's that they have a design flaw, and FILA is too shortsighted to notice the design flaw.

[SetonHallPirate 993]

BTW, I actually tried to come up with a ranking system based on the events in FILA's International Calendar (based on the Takedown Wrestling Media Dual Impact Index), problem was there were results missing from a few tournaments, and FILA would not (or more likely could not) give me the results of those tournaments! I can't do a ranking system if I'm not being given all of the information I need.

[MA_Wrestler 169]

My thoughts and predictions looking at the brackets for day 2. These weights seem a little more unbalanced, I thought today's weren't all that bad considering the blind draw. As mentioned already, the bottom of 84 is loaded, especially the bottom quarter bracket. 120 has in my opinion the best 4 guys in the bottom half, those quarters should be the semis. 60 seems wide open to me, huge bracket much like 66.

 

60kg semis: Khinchegashvilli, Georgia vs Dubov, Bulgaria

Esmilpourjouybari, Iran vs Goygereev, Russia

 

This bracket looks the best of the 3 weights for tomorrow as far as the separation of talent. Number 2 and three in world rankings set to face each other in top semi. Bottom half is tough with the extra round thrown in there. I would have picked the Russian to win this weight, but that extra match will make it very tough. It took a toll on Israpilov today, I think it will cause Goygereev to come up just short in the finals as well. He will have a tough Gomez in round of 16, after both have 2 matches just to get there. Gomez comes back to wrestle for bronze but falls to Iran

 

Gold: Khinchegashvilli

Silver: Goygereev

Bronze: Esmilpourjouybari

Bronze: Dubov

 

84 semis: Aldatov, Ukraine vs Kakhidze, Kazikstan

Boke, Turkey vs Lashgari, Iran

 

That bottom quarter is just ridiculous. Sokhiev vs Salas first round, both of the bronze medalist from the Olympics meeting in round of 16, after both having two matches already, just brutal. I'm contradicting what I said at 60 about the extra match having a negative effect here, but since Lashgari was my first thought to win this weight I'll stick with it, he runs the gauntlet, beats the Russian 2nd round, then Georgia, Cuba and wins it all. Will take amazing tournament for anyone on bottom of that bracket to come out on top. Just wrestling thru to the bronze from that mess will be tough!

 

Gold: Lashgari

Silver: Aldatov

Bronze: Marsagishvilli, Georgia

Bronze: Murtazaliev, Armenia

 

120: Semis: Petriashvilli, Georgia vs Kurbanov, Uzbekistan

Magomedov, Azerbijian vs Dlagnev, USA

 

Ok, so I'm picking with my heart here instead of my head. Dlagnev has beaten world and Olympic champs, just never at the right time. I'm gonna go out on the limb, say he has the tournament of his life, beats the Iranian in quarters who has beaten him three times, then avenges a loss to Azerbijian in semis and caps it off with a win in the finals. My head tells me Iran in the finals, Azerbijian bronze, but I'll pick with my US bias and hopes on this one. Top half of the bracket I'm pretty confident in those picks, bottom quarters could all go either way.

 

Gold: Dlagnev

Silver: Petriashvilli

Bronze: Ghasemi, Iran

Bronze: Kurbanov

[sockobuw 49]

here are my thoughts after a little discussion.

 

level 1: world or olympic champ in the past 4 years

level 2: world or olympic medalist in the past 4 years

level 3: representing a country that has won a medal in the past two years

 

take the guys at each level and seed them. if there are 3 guys with level 1 you now go by "fila points." any fila calendar event you can earn 3 (1st), 2 (2nd), or 1 (3rd) points. the guy within each level with the most points gets the higher seed. also promote competition by adding the highest "fila point" scorer to level 3, unless he is already on one of the levels.

 

ex:

level 1: two guys, most "fila points" gets the #1 seed the other gets #2

level 2: 4 guys, seeded 3-6 depending on their "fila points"

level 3: 2 guys, 7-8 seed determined by "fila points"

 

3rd guy could be added to level 3 if he has the most "fila points" accumulated in the fila calendar events. he would then be the 7th seed. if "fila points" are even the most recent placing trumps older credentials to award the seed.

[sockobuw 49]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

When you have 13 in the bottom quarter, and 8 in the other three quarters of the draw, of course the bottom quarter is going to have more talent. FILA may be accused of having rigged brackets, and those people are right, but it's not that they're trying to rig them, it's that they have a design flaw, and FILA is too shortsighted to notice the design flaw.

 

i wasn't saying they were rigged, just that the design made ridiculous scenarios a possibility.

[MA_Wrestler 169]

For the US, I have Gavin going 1-1, wins his first, loses to the Georgian who could very well pull him back to the repechage, but even if that happens that bracket is so loaded I don't think he wins a match down below either. Humphrey makes the quarters again, loses to Iran, who fails to make finals and knocks Humphrey out. Then of course I have Dlagnev having the tournament of his life, same pick I made for Metcalf, but here's hoping I'm right!

 

As for the team race, I've got Iran grabbing 3 more medals with Russia only getting one more, all but sealing the team title for Iran. Russia's 120 goes 1 and done, 84 could go 1-1 or 2-2, but I don't have him medaling. 60 could win it all for them, or he could miss the podium all together, tough draw for him. I think Georgia could end up in third as a team.

[gimpeltf 2,084]

yeah i find the pigtail bunching to be bizarre. i mean, ok, you want randomized draws, i can live with that. but then why unrandomize the pigtails? all it does is increase the odds of an uneven bracket. so weird.

 

Not sure I ever heard an official reason but I think the reason for this could be to minimize the number of matches where one wrestler went the previous round (pigtail) and the other did not (bye).

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

When you have 13 in the bottom quarter, and 8 in the other three quarters of the draw, of course the bottom quarter is going to have more talent. FILA may be accused of having rigged brackets, and those people are right, but it's not that they're trying to rig them, it's that they have a design flaw, and FILA is too shortsighted to notice the design flaw.

 

yeah, thats what i mean. it takes like, 10 seconds of looking at a bracket to realize this. its not even that hard of a fix. you just put the pigtails in order that you would seeds, so that at most, you have 1 extra wrestler per half a bracket. thats it. problem solved.

 

unless FILA actually likes it that way?

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

bottom quarter at 84 is sick. LASHGARI, MARSAGISHVILI, PASLAR, KUDIAMAGOMEDOV, and gavin happens to be in that mess. what a joke.

When you have 13 in the bottom quarter, and 8 in the other three quarters of the draw, of course the bottom quarter is going to have more talent. FILA may be accused of having rigged brackets, and those people are right, but it's not that they're trying to rig them, it's that they have a design flaw, and FILA is too shortsighted to notice the design flaw.

 

yeah, thats what i mean. it takes like, 10 seconds of looking at a bracket to realize this. its not even that hard of a fix. you just put the pigtails in order that you would seeds, so that at most, you have 1 extra wrestler per half a bracket. thats it. problem solved.

 

unless FILA actually likes it that way?

[bad_ears 0]

Quick question for you guys....what time does wrestling start tomorrow? PST please

Thanks in advance

[Jaroslav Hasek 2,067]

yeah i find the pigtail bunching to be bizarre. i mean, ok, you want randomized draws, i can live with that. but then why unrandomize the pigtails? all it does is increase the odds of an uneven bracket. so weird.

 

Not sure I ever heard an official reason but I think the reason for this could be to minimize the number of matches where one wrestler went the previous round (pigtail) and the other did not (bye).

 

hmm... i guess i could see that. but it all kind of evens out by the random draw. especially with the TFs at 7, you could have an extra pigtail but if you TF the guy in a minute then you're not even using much energy as a decent warm up. i dont think it makes up for the predisposition of a loaded half bracket.

 

fair enough point tho, i'll concede.